Offhand for almace

[Demonofhunger]

Tashan,

Thanks for sticking with the thread and providing the parse even as the trolling and nasty comments started. If I'd known that discussing the possibility of other sword options or asking for calculations was instant troll-bait, I would have spared everyone the drama.

Any thoughts on the final data?

[Prothscar]

Trolling is providing calculations and solid, irrefutable data? To me it seems like you just can't handle the fact that your sword is terrible and that you're wrong.

Also what's with the ~4 hour difference in fight time along with the extra 14 fights on OA2-4 sword? Seems that even the controllable variables in this case weren't controlled very well, but even with the imbalance, STR sword comes out ahead by a considerable margin when subtracting the average of 14 fights.

[Prothscar]

STR Shamshir:
Melee dmg: 246478
WS dmg: 151132

Total: 397610


OA2-4 Sword:
Melee dmg: 202988
WS dmg: 135346

Total: 338334


However, this is largely inaccurate as it's using only the average damage per fight for WSs and CDCs. Overall, the difference could be even higher. Adding spell damage:

STR Shamshir:
Melee Total: 397610
Spell Total: 531199

Overall Total: 928809


OA2-4 Sword:
Melee Total: 338334
Spell Total: 495938

Overall Total: 834272


Again, inaccurate. Could be more of a difference. The extra 14 fights on the OA2-4 sword skews the already skewed nature of a parse, however, using averages, STR shamshir still pulls ahead by almost 100,000 points of damage in 112 fights.

Averages are a largely inaccurate base in this circumstance not only to begin with, but considering that there's a difference of 144 spells for OA2-4, despite the disparity in attack/round difference and WSs, plus 14 fights difference. The 4 extra hours I will assume is afk time, not padding.

[Tashan]

Also what's with the ~4 hour difference in fight time along with the extra 14 fights on OA2-4 sword?

Player Participation (Offensive)

Player Number of fights % Participation
Tashan 105 83.33 %

Not sure where the extra 14's coming from. As for the 5, they were incompleted fights aka death.

As for the 4 hour difference I'm not sure what you mean. There are some insane reads on there like:

5 Mourning Crawler True Tashan 3:15 PM 6:11 PM 02:56:29 600 0

If that's what you're refering too, although I can assure you I did not spend 3 hours killing a crawler. I did take breaks though, as said I would.

[Tashan]

Tashan,

Thanks for sticking with the thread and providing the parse even as the trolling and nasty comments started. If I'd known that discussing the possibility of other sword options or asking for calculations was instant troll-bait, I would have spared everyone the drama.

Any thoughts on the final data?

You're welcome Demon - As for thoughts, I can think of some but I'm a little busy so I can't stop to do a big write up.

[Tashan]

Oh I see what you mean Pro.

It catches fights which wern't mine also. Anyone who made a kill near me is also said.

It counts up the total number of fights under Performance.

[Prothscar]

Noticing quite a few discrepancies and impossibilities that shouldn't be possible assuming both swords and every fight were under the same conditions, idk. It's the large difference in number of spells despite the difference in WS freqeuncy/attacks per round that has me, it shouldn't technically be possible for you to have higher spells and weaponskill frequency in the same number of fights, and besides that, it should also not be possible to have differing overall damage with the same number of fights without a large amount of damage overflow happening at the end of a battle (goes both ways, for STR or OA2-4 sword). The NPC would sort of offset this, but he seems to be pitifully weak, as is expected given previous parameters in this thread. Something just seems off.

60,000 extra damage accounts for multiple extra monsters, unless every killshot was with a powerful single hit spell, or a multihit spell whose hit was strong. 30,992 of that is from melee related damage, the rest is all from spell damage. OA2-4 sword wouldn't be boosting spell damage, thus the difference is even more bizarre.

This brings into play either inaccuracy/forgery (my bet is on inaccuracy) of the parse, due to those uncontrollable variables previously mentioned, and also due in part to the fact that you're parsing against yourself. Some of the other numbers are also rather confusing.

[Tashan]

There's nearly a 60k total damage difference between the two parses, in the Khanda's favour. I have no idea why that is.

The only thing that is at a loss on the Khanda is the melee damage.

The crawlers were VT-IT. Perhaps the second set had more HP in total?

[Prothscar]

Yes that's the issue, it shouldn't have much of a damage difference. The only difference that should be apparent on this parse should be a difference between weaponskill and melee attack frequency, but there's a major difference in overall damage and spell frequency as well. This does not make sense and does not match possible parameters if both swords had 100 fights each under the same conditions.

I do believe that the difference would be far less, perhaps opposite (but can't say for sure, only with decent certainty) if this information were more clear.

Would have to be a very high level variance, and would have had to have been a large amount of high level crawlers toward the Khanda rather than the Shamshir. Unless things have changed from the 75 days for monster stat scaling, differences between stats for 3-4 levels are not very severe.

Unfortunately this lends itself to what I have been saying about parses.

While it's appreciated that you took the time, and some groundwork has been laid (which correlates with my own calculations a couple of pages back), I don't see this being taken as much of critical evidence in the Khanda's favor.

[Tashan]

Indeed.

I was going to sit down and analyse this properly later, but I got so bored of doing it I wanted data up as fast as possible. But since you're looking at it now Pro, I may as well do it with discussion.

---

When I first saw the difference in damage I too was surprised. There didn't seem to be any apparant explanation. I added up the total number of fights of which I recieved exp for countless times to make sure it was 100 and it was.

I questioned the validity of the tests and then remembered the purpose of the experiment:

Posted by Demonofhunger View Post
How does the additional TP from an OA2-4 sword factor into the comparisons?

I've asked on various boards and never seen the actual equations being used when sword comparisons are being done. No one has ever offered them up

Or rather will the extra TP gain make up and increased WS frequency make up for the loss in damage?

I can't precsely conclude that just yet but I can point out the obvious:

The loss in damage across the board for the OA2-4 is quite substantial. This was predicted us all.

The average for all forms of damage is lower on the OA2-4. This was predicted by us all.

The majority of damage in both parses came from spells (56%+). The majority of damage from spells came from Delta Thrust. This would lead me to believe that STR Shamshir is more favourable as it provides a bonus to the largest form of damage.

Whilst the total damage is off, the percentage in WS damage is a difference of 4.03% in Khanda's favour. This would lead me to resolve that even with a substantial increase in Weaponskills, the damage is not enough to warrant the swords use.