Stop Player Bashing

[Hoshi]

Ahh I see. I haven't tried to use alla since maybe 2007... My favorite forum was ki and once that died I pretty much lurked at bg.

[rog]

Yeah, if you go back earlier than that, alla was actually pretty terrible with the false information, etc. Now it's really not much different than bg. Quality of information is more or less the same. New information is overall definitely quicker on bg, but it always gets reposted to alla, without the 500 page threads.

[Hoshi]

Oh I see... I'll have to start lurking on alla as well then ^^

[Arcon]

lol

Itt: facts = opinions.

I really think you're one of those people who just like to "hear yourself talk".

So you're the one the OP is trying to protect.

Tired of hearing yourself talk yet? I bet you make yourself laugh.

That's really stupid.

Btw, please don't let us keep you up all night. It's important to get a good nights sleep before class.

I think you're a lost cause.

You've told us enough to know that you are a bad player.

All of this in a thread that was supposed to encourage people to be nice and respectful to others. Something that everyone agreed upon when signing up, something that's mentioned loud and clear (and twice) in the General Forum Rules and shouldn't even have to be discuss. Something that actually can't be discussed, yet people are still going on about it.

I would seriously like some moderator intervention sometimes, some of the comments people have made (both in this and countless other threads) clearly violate the rule about being respectful to others and I don't see a reason why this should be tolerated. And no, I don't mean everyone whom I've quoted above, although none of these posts were nice, but some of them were downright insulting. And that should not stand in this official forum.

That's ok. I'm not here to be nice.

Clearly. However, whatever your intentions for posting here are, it is still a rule that makes no exceptions.

However if they don't sell it, then they are doinitrong.

There is no doing it wrong in this regard. While there might be a way to deal more damage with the amount of money you have (both in cash and potential), that is not what's right or wrong. People play for different reasons, I once geared just to see how many attacks I could do in the least amount of time. On PLD. That was neither efficient nor effective and I was very well aware of that fact. However it was what I wanted to try. When I asked people what the lowest delay weapons were a PLD could use people immediately assumed it was "wrong" and started telling me what I should use instead. People always make assumptions about a person's intentions and values and most commonly identify them with their own. But that's not respecting my own decisions, I didn't impose them on anyone, I didn't assume they were "right". So who are you to tell me it's wrong how I wanna play?

I know you meant wrong in the sense of getting most out of your job for the potential money you have, but as I said, that's not what everyone cares about. What if someone just wants to feel like posessing something extraordinary, something that not many others have? Judging from what I read from you so far I'm pretty sure you'd immediately consider them needy and irrational. But what if they're just after achievements? Having decent overall gear or having one exceptional piece of gear and leave the rest out, and slowly build it up to meet their potential. What's wrong with that if that's how people wanna play?

And even if it was true, if they were really needy and irrational, pointing it out would belittle their feelings. Unless they go around and start telling everyone how great of a melee they are with their Kraken Club and 117 club skill, no one should look down on them for playing how they do.

You're making a general assumption, saying if people don't sell it they're wrong. That's not just false but also extremely unhelpful. I don't know why people would even say that.

FACT: saying you are a bad player is not bashing you, it's simply stating a FACT.

Whether it's being a fact or you pointing out it's a fact is very different. Naturebeckles never once assumed she was a great or even good player, she stated a few things about her gear and that she didn't know about <stal>. Even if the things she posted weren't satisfactory to some people, pointing out she is a bad player (which you really can't tell from what she has said) without any motivation (other than them disagreeing with you) is bashing. It is disrespectful and belittling of their abilities.

I really believe a moderator needs to step up and remind people of being nice occasionally, and intervene when it gets too far (which has already happened imo). This forum is already starting to go down the BG path, a gathering place for elitists who care about nothing but being right, ironically even when they're wrong. And that's not a place I'd like to see the official forums end up in.

And if my above text has somehow offended or insulted anyones intelligence in ways I can't comprehend, there is this handy ignore feature; you can use that and never see my text again and then we can't possibly bother each other.

Wait, what.... there is such a beautiful feature?

[GlobalVariable]

Wait, what.... there is such a beautiful feature?

Yup. Click name, click view profile, click ignore user.

[Naturebeckles]

All of this in a thread that was supposed to encourage people to be nice and respectful to others. Something that everyone agreed upon when signing up, something that's mentioned loud and clear (and twice) in the General Forum Rules and shouldn't even have to be discuss. Something that actually can't be discussed, yet people are still going on about it.

I would seriously like some moderator intervention sometimes, some of the comments people have made (both in this and countless other threads) clearly violate the rule about being respectful to others and I don't see a reason why this should be tolerated. And no, I don't mean everyone whom I've quoted above, although none of these posts were nice, but some of them were downright insulting. And that should not stand in this official forum.



Clearly. However, whatever your intentions for posting here are, it is still a rule that makes no exceptions.



There is no doing it wrong in this regard. While there might be a way to deal more damage with the amount of money you have (both in cash and potential), that is not what's right or wrong. People play for different reasons, I once geared just to see how many attacks I could do in the least amount of time. On PLD. That was neither efficient nor effective and I was very well aware of that fact. However it was what I wanted to try. When I asked people what the lowest delay weapons were a PLD could use people immediately assumed it was "wrong" and started telling me what I should use instead. People always make assumptions about a person's intentions and values and most commonly identify them with their own. But that's not respecting my own decisions, I didn't impose them on anyone, I didn't assume they were "right". So who are you to tell me it's wrong how I wanna play?

I know you meant wrong in the sense of getting most out of your job for the potential money you have, but as I said, that's not what everyone cares about. What if someone just wants to feel like posessing something extraordinary, something that not many others have? Judging from what I read from you so far I'm pretty sure you'd immediately consider them needy and irrational. But what if they're just after achievements? Having decent overall gear or having one exceptional piece of gear and leave the rest out, and slowly build it up to meet their potential. What's wrong with that if that's how people wanna play?

And even if it was true, if they were really needy and irrational, pointing it out would belittle their feelings. Unless they go around and start telling everyone how great of a melee they are with their Kraken Club and 117 club skill, no one should look down on them for playing how they do.

You're making a general assumption, saying if people don't sell it they're wrong. That's not just false but also extremely unhelpful. I don't know why people would even say that.



Whether it's being a fact or you pointing out it's a fact is very different. Naturebeckles never once assumed she was a great or even good player, she stated a few things about her gear and that she didn't know about <stal>. Even if the things she posted weren't satisfactory to some people, pointing out she is a bad player (which you really can't tell from what she has said) without any motivation (other than them disagreeing with you) is bashing. It is disrespectful and belittling of their abilities.

I really believe a moderator needs to step up and remind people of being nice occasionally, and intervene when it gets too far (which has already happened imo). This forum is already starting to go down the BG path, a gathering place for elitists who care about nothing but being right, ironically even when they're wrong. And that's not a place I'd like to see the official forums end up in.



Wait, what.... there is such a beautiful feature?

Arcon.... I LOVE YOU.

[Kuishen]

I would just like to come in here and give my opinion on the matter, as probably the majority of my posts are going to be considered "bashing somebody".

Pointing out flaws in logic, no matter how you do it, can be perceived as rude or disrespectful. It can't be avoided, especially when people claim their opinions on a matter are correct when all other evidence says they are not. On top of that, said people will go around spreading their opinions as fact or otherwise spread false information. That right there is the real crime, and if nothing is done about it then where would we be?

I, myself will explain something in a calm matter, as respectful as possible once. If the person continues to argue their obviously false opinions/views with me then I will degenerate into throwing insults eventually. So that is probably where most of my "bashing" comes from. It doesn't start out that way, but will get there eventually if people are being retarded.

Unfortunately there is no cure for stupidity, you can only point it out when it happens, otherwise people walk around thinking they are, well, not stupid. While there is nothing wrong with that in of itself, when they start presenting facts or opinions as correct when they are clearly incorrect, that is where I draw the line and have to say something.

EDIT: Apologizing in advance if that made little sense, late, tired, etc.

[Arcon]

Pointing out flaws in logic, no matter how you do it, can be perceived as rude or disrespectful. It can't be avoided, especially when people claim their opinions on a matter are correct when all other evidence says they are not. On top of that, said people will go around spreading their opinions as fact or otherwise spread false information. That right there is the real crime, and if nothing is done about it then where would we be?

I, myself will explain something in a calm matter, as respectful as possible once. If the person continues to argue their obviously false opinions/views with me then I will degenerate into throwing insults eventually. So that is probably where most of my "bashing" comes from. It doesn't start out that way, but will get there eventually if people are being retarded.

Unfortunately there is no cure for stupidity, you can only point it out when it happens, otherwise people walk around thinking they are, well, not stupid. While there is nothing wrong with that in of itself, when they start presenting facts or opinions as correct when they are clearly incorrect, that is where I draw the line and have to say something.

I don't disagree with that (although no one in this thread, for example, deserved it), but if that's the case and they don't wanna learn, report it to the mods. Excerpt from the General Forum Rules:

- Please do not post false, fabricated and/or fictitious information. It is unconstructive and will only confuse others. Please be careful with what you post and keep in mind that your words can affect others more than you may expect.

If someone is blatantly posting false information, that is indeed a violation of the forum rules, and as such should be dealt with by moderators, not other posters. Or well, it can be dealt with by them as well, as long as they adhere to the rules themselves. People shouldn't have to feel the need to resort to vigilante justice, which is why I encourage a stronger moderator involvement in here.

On the matter though, many of the things that have been mentioned in here are, in fact, opinion and not wrong or right.

[Kuishen]

I'm 60% sure that most of what I was referring to doesn't fall under that category, and the other 40% is not having faith that the mods will do anything constructive, given the track record with GMs and FFXI.

[Vinc]

Arcon the problem you and a lot of others fail to see is that you're not playing this game alone. If you are, then you should make this clear in every post that your opinion is subject to that. People ask others to gear properly for party situations - whether linkshell or pickup - because how anyone gears affects everyone in a party situation. To put it simply, wear what you want in the street, but when you go to church try to dress appropriately? If that makes sense.

Also, your calls for being nice are completely out of line. I am actually offended by you suggesting that I was being rude in my post, and I wish a moderator would step up and speak to you about that. I posted something that I found funny, and you are making me feel bad by implying that I was being mean. That's not fair.