New Jug Recipes

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Barring the rest of your post. What excatly costs an arm and a leg?

Maybe he bought his +2s and empy?

[Olor]

yeah prices are pretty ridic. /sigh

[SNK]

I'm sure it's something else he's referring to but the only few items which cost some gil which I easily farmed in my spare time was a Moepapa Stone and Brego Gloves.

The job is cheap to gear up seeing as most of the solid gear you need is Rare/Ex.

[Phogg]

I'm sure it's something else he's referring to but the only few items which cost some gil which I easily farmed in my spare time was a Moepapa Stone and Brego Gloves.

The job is cheap to gear up seeing as most of the solid gear you need is Rare/Ex.

The thread is about the cost/benefit of consumables for BST, mainly our jug pets. Not gear.

Regarding the post about my af3+2, you make a subtle point for me. In my linkshells abyssea static I chose BST as my main job for getting af3 items. Know what job I was asked to play the entire time we farmed them? THF.

[Xilk]

However, none of that discussion is relevant to the problem in this thread. The problem is we are being forced by SE to use jug pets in any situation outside of randomly deciding you would like to merit or EXP with charmed pets for the novelty of it. There has been almost no reason to use charm since the 75 cap. No new content has catered to anything remotely close to a charm based BST since 75. I could sell/toss all my charm gear and it wouldn't even matter. Who cares if that's how the job was played for 75 levels, lets completely change gears and make it expensive as hell for you on top of it all, but you have no reason to be upset about that, right?

Actually, this thread is about the new jug pets that were added in the last update. You just derailing it for your rant. I started the Charm discussion thread as I think the 2nd thread in the BST section here. I have made my thoughts on the subject abundantly clear. I don't need to rehash them here.

You are caught up on the term of how "useless" bst is for what you want to do. If you feel that way, my suggest is to enjoy the jobs you like more for there apparent usefulness. Its certainly better than ranting and raving. I would want the game to be enjoyable.
If we get back on topic and look at your input about Falcorr... I can't really say there is much useful information there.

Who cares, I can do 3k dmg on thf every 40 seconds in abyssea and it costs me nothing. I've been the biggest BST proponent I know forever, but the job is officially dying on the vine. Take some time and repeat your tests on actual xp mobs outside abyssea. At 96 fantod it ~400 dmg on EM bats in Bostaunieux Oubliette. Yay. 16k per jug to do 350 dmg with a ready move? But I get TH! ><;

I was listing examples of what fantod was capable of. Ofcourse inside and outside of abyssea are completely different. How can I take such a comparison seriously? Are you doing 3k Ws's on em's outside abyssea on your thf? I don't recall any ws's doing quite that much damage. Is it the new dagger ws? because bst can use that too, though it may not be quite as strong as a thf using it, it will not be too far behind. I'm willing to bet a bst can do just as well on axes.

So if BST is doing about the same WS damage as a thf main, but the bst also has a pet doing damage... which one is doing more? is that really the issue?
Furthermore, falcorr is a thf type mob. Just a like a thf, the damage actually varies significantly for each hit. the dd is done by hitting alot (high triple attack rate) and doing alot of crit hits. Dipper and Falcorr both have a wider damage range than war type pets. This is largely surrounding the crits.

A single use of fantod showing 400 damage is not very informative...
it tells me 100 damage is within the range of a normal melee hit for falcorr vs an EM at level 96.
My examples showed what it was capable of which was outside of the normal expectations. they also helped to show how fantod functions for falcorr.

I'm pretty sure a bst main will hit above and below 100 damage also... but this is me seriously examining your testimony of falcorr performance when all you really want is to rant, rave and drop slather on SE for not doing it how you want it.

[Mavrick]

Falcorr is ~100k/stack on my server and with a high supply to boot. The addition of another THF pet has caused dipper's price to drop from 120k/stack to 80/stack so I guess in that sense it's not all that bad... The turtle on the other hand is a mind boggling 50k a pop. No one is even attempting to purchase a stack of Adamantoise... since stacks usually sell for higher, I'm guessing it would be 650k~700k maybe even more :/ The new pet food is 80k/stack! and thanks to the limit break bcnm Pet Food Eta is currently also 80k/stack... I'd hate to see what prices would be like if BST was actually a popular job.

[Olor]

Who cares, I can do 3k dmg on thf every 40 seconds in abyssea and it costs me nothing. I've been the biggest BST proponent I know forever, but the job is officially dying on the vine. Take some time and repeat your tests on actual xp mobs outside abyssea. At 96 fantod it ~400 dmg on EM bats in Bostaunieux Oubliette. Yay. 16k per jug to do 350 dmg with a ready move? But I get TH! ><;

Even when you can use charm, its lack luster compared to ready. Using slime pets in the same zone and waiting 2 minutes for sic (for completely random moves) to be up again just made me want to revert to jug pets, which is clearly what SE wants. Its ridiculous. I can get on my WAR and drool over a dozen or so JA's. I get on my BST and I now have only two useful JA's, Call Beast and Ready. Yay. SE can die in a fire, they have absolutely killed this job aside from a bunch of hacks who now use it to farm dynamis currency. In any actual capacity, the job is useless. 50 dmg regular hits from jug pets on NMs, 250 DMG ready moves, way to go BST!

All the fun I had with BST up to 75 is just a distant memory now. It's been my favorite job for 8 years, and I now have no motivation to level it beyond 96. Thanks for your "balance" SE. Way to balance a job out of any realm of usefulness.

BALANCE

That said, I love BST... to bits. But I'm done now, I am unsubbing to try some other games. Tired of playing and loving a job which the devs are afraid to ever raise higher than crap tier.

Balance to the devs seems to mean that SAM/MNK/NIN/WAR/BLM/WHM rule, a few jobs are pretty good, and everything else gets to suck. BST gets to have most of its JAs be absolutely useless, and be obsolete by design in the newest endgame content (voidwatch) - we could do WoE at a cost of 50K a run, but the devs ruined that event with ludicrous drop rates on everything but junk - and you can't solo fluxes - so we're screwed there too.

/sigh

[Economizer]

I'd hate to see what prices would be like if BST was actually a popular job.

BST isn't a popular job?!

-

Anyways, I came in here to make a suggestion about the new jug pets that I think SE should honor.

Wormy Broth / Slippery Silas should be level 23 ALL JOBS.

This would make it the first and only jug pet that all jobs can use. Considering its "status" as a "mascot pet" I think that SE should do this.

Lets get support for this idea before the community reps come back from holiday so it is the first thing they can ask the dev team for. Plus it would show they are listening to us!

[SNK]

The thread is about the cost/benefit of consumables for BST, mainly our jug pets. Not gear.

What's the difference really? Jugs are consumables yes but they're still part of your gear.

Regarding the post about my af3+2, you make a subtle point for me. In my linkshells abyssea static I chose BST as my main job for getting af3 items. Know what job I was asked to play the entire time we farmed them? THF.

You act like you're surprised about this. I farmed most of my BST gear inculding my Farsha on either WHM or MNK. What difference does it make what job you farm the gear you want for your favorite job?

Do you feel like it's less of an accomplishment because you obtained gear for a job by getting said gear on the job you're not on?

And about consumables, Pet jugs are cheap these days. I keep 2 stacks of Sheep Jugs on me for when I'm farming NMs like lotto pops and 1 stack of Dipper Jugs on me when I do fight the NMs I'm camping. This isn't really an issue for me and it shouldn't be for anyone else with BST.

It's a very easy job to make money with so I'm still trying to figure out where you think this huge cost is coming from. Back on topic tho, I'm happy these new jugs seem nice but the prices are way above what I'd be willing to pay for them. I'd rather just farm the mats myself and either craft them or have a friend make them for me.

[Phogg]

No, it simply reiterates my point that the job is subpar compared to quite nearly any other option at this point in most cases, and the lackluster performance by our jug pets and their cumbersome usage and timer issues is part of that problem. No one will ever ask me to bring BST for just about anything save for less than maybe 3-4 instances of any content outside of soloing that I can think of, and I can't blame them. If you don't see that as an indictment of the current state of the job, I don't know what to tell you other than we clearly disagree.

As for jugpet cost, they do cost a lot (just because you think 100k for 12 pets is not a lot, doesn't mean it is not a lot to everyone), they take up a ton of inventory space if you actually want to pay any attention to killer traits at all and, I dunno, actually play your job to the fullest. Not to mention in many cases you get to spend that gil for about 2 minutes before waving goodbye to it as you start up another event. It simply IS a cumbersome and costly endeavor to attempt to be a full time end game BST, even if someone wanted you to be. And in most cases, the cost/benefit of using the jug pet has almost nothing to do with its utility, but instead with the arbitrary difficulty of obtaining materials to make them, which was my original point. The cost vs. utility of most of our jug pets, which we are now basically required to use for almost anything post-75, is completely out of whack. I farm almost all of what I use on BST (again, with my THF) and my wife makes them into jugs or pet food. But that doesn't matter, whether you pay gil, or pay time to farm those items (which can range from considerable to ludicrous [see: Abraia]), you are being required to stop what you are doing, with frequent regularity, to obtain that gil or those items. The only thing that would be comparable for other DD's is if their gear would degrade with use requiring it to be fixed or replaced. Because if you thing jug pets are part of our gear, then I still don't see how that makes the situation better.