DNC tanking

[Arcon]

There was a huge debate a couple years back that items which gave Evasion Skill (like the Evasion Torque) were superior to items that gave straight Evasion (like the Emperor Hairpin).

Did that debate ever get settled with some solid math?

Yes, Evasion skill = Evasion <= 200, after that 1 Evasion skill = 0.9 Evasion. In any case, Evasion > Evasion skill.

[Sappho]

Yes, Evasion skill = Evasion <= 200, after that 1 Evasion skill = 0.9 Evasion. In any case, Evasion > Evasion skill.

Thanks, Arcon.

[browolf]

No Dancer should mind not being able to use Sambas. I personally hate Tanking or gearing for Evasion on my Dancer, but if it comes right down to it, I'll pop Fan Dance and sit there throwing Waltz bombs til we get the main tank back up.

I never use fan dance. Evasion gear has it covered.

Dnc has tons of evasion. evasion is > evasion skill. And we get many tiers of evasion bonus in addition to the merits on closed position. In fact 90% of the time i see DNCs overkilling their eva and killing the mob waaay slower than they should be.

Since tanking is a combination of survival & damage, not enough damage *was* a problem until I got occasionally attack 2-4 dagger. That makes a big difference! Then you can fill up on crit/damage atmas.

[Urthdigger]

One thing I love doing with my DNC in abyssea is burning using Aeolian Edge. My atma setup is geared for MAB (Plus Gales for wind attack bonus), and with fan dance up it's not that difficult to survive a number of mobs beating on you. 20% PDT (Its lowest amount after getting hit a few times) goes a long way, especially with a few other easy to get PDT items like Twilight Torque.

[Dragonlord]

I stopped my oa dagger at 2-3 because i never use it. Most of DNCs dmg comes from DoT and the dmg and delay on the oa2-4 is pretty bad. In addition the loss of 9 agi and 20 evasion in 1 slot is very noticable and when it brings you below cap. I find dnc's tp gain to be more than enough to spam WS even w/o an oa offhand, and tend to tp faster than i can cure waltz 3 spam as well.

About fan dance, yes its true people tend to overuse it and reduce their damage outputs, there are strong uses as well. First thing that comes to mind are the TP moves that deal a set % of your HP like the NM scorpions have. Why eat a 2500 dmg move when you can drop it to 250? If mob doesn't do something like that, haste samba of course.

[scaevola]

About fan dance, yes its true people tend to overuse it and reduce their damage outputs, there are strong uses as well. First thing that comes to mind are the TP moves that deal a set % of your HP like the NM scorpions have. Why eat a 2500 dmg move when you can drop it to 250? If mob doesn't do something like that, haste samba of course.

I switched from 5/5 Saber to 5/5 Fan at 95. I like it.

Saber/Haste Samba will help you kill something faster, but Fan will give you wiggle room and allow you to kill things you wouldn't have been able to otherwise. Fulltime Saber/Haste Samba's great, but there's nothing I could do with that setup (including self-healing, hilariously) that a NIN/DNC with Kannagi couldn't do much better.

As a side-note, 5/5 Fan Dance DNC/MNK with counterstance up is pretty hilarious.

[Soranika]

I don't really get multi-hit weapons since double attack does not work on those weapon and unless I'm wrong, doesn't haste samba only work for the first hit of those weapons but not the additional ones?

I know for me, until I get either a twastar or one (or both) of the daggers from Qilin, I've been sticking with Phurba and Oynos knife on off hand, using Pyrric Kleos + Evisceration for self darkness skillchain as my form of WS damage. TP gain is fast enough, double attack is frequent and delay doesn't really effect the flow to much unless double attack doesn't activate.

[Sappho]

I don't really get multi-hit weapons since double attack does not work on those weapon and unless I'm wrong, doesn't haste samba only work for the first hit of those weapons but not the additional ones?

I watched a RDM/nin in campaign a couple years back who was soloing with a joytoy and a kraken club and it was a pretty amazing spectacle.

[Deadvinta]

Haste samba works on all hits, it's Enspell II that doesn't work on multihits.

[Deadvinta]

Also as a Dancer your double attack rate is about 10-15% from gear, which isn't going to happen very much anyway. Unless you're subbing Warrior. In which case, el-oh-el. The Parazonium's 2-4 actually procs quite a bit, the 3rd hit seems to be its favorite place.