Personal temper findings

[Doombringer]

tanking is very simple. 1)hold hate. 2)don't die.

now, in a.. well at this point, not so recent update... se destroyed the enmity gain on a lot of rdms spells. we don't have our own equivalent of flash, shield bash, sentinel, whathaveyou, to generate hate. plus on top of that.. actual paladins, who used to be the hate monsters of ffxi, are already having problems holding hate off strong DD's.

now, while all that stuff you listed does help with the "don't die" part, just subbing ninja and spamming shadows would help MORE against most mobs. (all that cast/recast time applies to utsusemi to) and at the same time, duel wield and the fact your not using defender is going to lead to a lot more damage. damage that will generate hate. enough hate to more than cancel out the loss of provoke. (though, i would suggest that it's usually not gonna be enough to actually HOLD hate.)

so at this point, subbing warrior isn't really good. even if you find a mob that can tear shadows apart, or you INSIST on going cheap and not using tools, you could sub blu for MORE defense without hurting your attack via defender.



also, i dislike the idea of dnc as a dd sub.. it's not.. you get a better delay reduction from /nin. and while waltzes could be helpful, every point of tp you spend to heal is tp you didn't ws with. you may as well have subbed nin and not taken that damage in the first place. also in your example... what sam? what samurai is going to wait for you to build tp if your spending it 50 points at a time on waltzes?

then as a healer sub, if you find yourself in a situation where you're needed to heal others, but don't have the mp to keep up.. it's probably a "don't melee' situation anyway. how much healing power are you even gaining by subbing dnc? compared to the mage gear and staff you're not wearing?


i hate the typecasting of rdm even more than the next guy. i'm actually a long time "meleerdm" but.... it's not like this isn't controversial enough already, yah know?

this whole post makes me feel like a hypocrite but... i feel like it needs to be said.. so i'm gonna address this next bit at nobody in particular, so please nobody take offense :"if you're gonna suck, do it with a staff on your back. my life is hard enough already." that's a self quote actually, from years ago. after i explained to a friend all the gear he'd need to even TRY to be effective as a hybrid rdm.. and his response was something to the effect of "to hard, i'll just blah blah bare minimum"

my point is, there aren't many.. unconventional.. rdms left. so we all end up representative of one another in the publics mind. wow this post got long...

[Greatguardian]

I liked Doom's post.

Yeah, I went there.

[hideka]

could you link his thread? the fluxiations between our numbers indicates 1 of 3 things
1). my sample size was too small and didnt allow certian tiers to ramp up enough.
2). he has outside DA equipped and Temper provides +% instead of +ammount
3). he just invented numbers to fill in his gaps.

[SpankWustler]

could you link his thread? the fluxiations between our numbers indicates 1 of 3 things
1). my sample size was too small and didnt allow certian tiers to ramp up enough.
2). he has outside DA equipped and Temper provides +% instead of +ammount
3). he just invented numbers to fill in his gaps.

Here's his original post. At least, I assume it's the original post. I only follow 2-ish threads on BG and exactly 0 threads on other community forums, and I think he posts on almost all of them.

Not a lot of information is included, but his sample size is mentioned further down that page. It's safe to assume that he eliminated painfully obvious confounds such as Double Attack equipment given the experience that Byrthnoth has with testing spells and abilities in FFXI, though.

If he just invented numbers, he would probably have invented numbers that made it scale in a linear fashion rather than...however it scales. Also, he would have invented cooler numbers. Like "schlexen", the number with a speech impediment that lurks between six and seven.

[saevel]

Of all our enhancing magic, none of them scale in a purely linear fashion, other then stoneskin. Most are tiered in some fashion. Enspells / Phalanx / Gain-Stat spells all change calculations once you pass a certain skill point, then also each require you to hit the next tier before additional enhancing magic adds to potency. For example, 460 has the same potency enspell as 479 enhancing magic.

[Byrth]

Sorry, those were parses of Hpmedes with a D0 weapon, which lets me afk for a few hours while I collect data. Useful, considering I don't have a controller atm and am severely lacking in keyboard coordination.

What you do is:
* Get a D1 weapon (like Trainee Knife)
* Make sure you have 65 STR or less (at least)
* Go find a high level Hpmede (I use Teleport-Holla, run towards Temenos, and look for a Hpmede with >300 evasion).
* Pull it, and make sure you're swinging quickly enough that you keep its interest through casts, but slowly enough that the parser doesn't blur your attack rounds (~>180 delay)
* Having low STR will give you an fSTR of -1, which lets you turn your D1 weapon into a D0 weapon. This means you can never hit for damage. Put yourself somewhere without agro and afk with the parser running.
* I'm not sure exactly where this method came from, but it was introduced to me in the BG Critical Hit Rate thread where they dissected the dDEX relationship.
* You can figure out how to cast Temper every 500-600 seconds and use Composure once in a while for an indefinite period of time if you really think about it.

The original post for Temper was actually the bgwiki discussion page. I put it in the random fact thread because I wanted some input. I ended up skipping out on the followup with DA gear in favor of confirming whether or not THF gets Triple Attack II (they don't), but I can do it tonight instead of figuring out whether or not WAR gets Double Attack II if people care.

I think I saw your data on wikia, and N=500 explains it. In general (for your higher sample stuff at least), you can reduce what you're measuring to a binomial distribution if you set up your experiment correctly (make sure there are only two states). The linked page has the statistics for determining your 95% confidence interval.

As for why my data is weird . . . I don't know. The parses were almost continuous, I never changed gear, Temper never wore off, etc. Why it jumps 2% in 6 skill and then 1% in 25 skill is a mystery to me. I wanted the story to work out to a nice 1% every 10 skill as it originally appeared it would. If you want work this out faster and with less static about people caring/not caring about Temper and the RDM Meleeing that it represents, I'm Byrthnoth on BG and you can just PM me.

PS. Saeval, those things you're describing are called "piecewise linear." Nonlinear things look like this:
http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/Talk:Afflatus_Solace

[SpankWustler]

The original post for Temper was actually the bgwiki discussion page. I put it in the random fact thread because I wanted some input.

Sorry about posting something you tested and dragging you in here to clarify it as a result. This forum doesn't have PM's so I couldn't just ask if there was more or if it was cool or whatever. Thanks for providing so much information about what you were whacking and such.

Also, I am taken greatly aback by seeing neat and sanely recorded statistics on a wiki's talk page rather than seven idiots talking about Bora Axe's low magic accuracy. And rest assured, none of the seven are referring to the additional effect.

[saevel]

My point was that none of our spells are a straight 1 skill = ~something something~, their all staggered depending on which developer wrote the code. So while you can make a graph with the tiered points and draw a line through it, the line itself is a lie as it would suggest a difference between 360 and 379 enhancing magic on Enspell potency which in actuality there is none. It's a stair stepped appearance, no reason to think Temper would be any difference. Eventually people will figure out the tiers.

[Byrth]

Ah! I have just the page for this situation!

See, the second equation you're referring to actually is linear. It just involves a floor function. I've never verified that the first equation (nonlinear) is legit. It seems unlikely to me that it is, but it also isn't very relevant content anymore.

[hideka]

well, my guess, is that a base stat could possibly affect how your DA effects Ramp up, thats the only explination for the large diffrence were seeing between our numbers