To Developers: Accession

[Daniel_Hatcher]

They will not let RDM die out. All jobs will probably be getting some kind of insane spell or ablity we've always hoped for in group 3 merit form. Perhaps Haste II, though that wouldn't be my preference lol. People shouldn't give up hope on RDM just yet, it will come back, and it will be quite amazing when it does, though it will be about 3 to 6 months from now I imagine.

DRK's been waiting the longest, and it's still waiting. I wouldn't count on it.

[Vaness]

@ saevel and daniel.You two were crying in the Cure V thread about how you didn't wanted to be Enhancing bots.I am pretty sure asking for accession temper, haste,gain-spell and Enspell 2 will make you an enhancing bot.Changed your mind?

[ManaKing]

@ saevel and daniel.You two were crying in the Cure V thread about how you didn't wanted to be Enhancing bots.I am pretty sure asking for accession temper, haste,gain-spell and Enspell 2 will make you an enhancing bot.Changed your mind?

It's a bot if you have to cast all of those spells on every person in the party. When you do it in an AOE it is more like we are actually supporting people like real supports.

[FrankReynolds]

It's a bot if you have to cast all of those spells on every person in the party. When you do it in an AOE it is more like we are actually supporting people like real supports.

That sounds like code for "I don't want to be so busy. I want to auto-attack like the melee do. Who knows, maybe I'll cast a buff or two if I'm bored."

[Vaness]

It's a bot if you have to cast all of those spells on every person in the party. When you do it in an AOE it is more like we are actually supporting people like real supports.

Ok so lets do some maths, simple ones.

Rdm using SCH sub have 2 Strat.Each strat have a 2 min Recast.

Situation no.1 (You get accession with the possibility to use it with haste, temper, Enspell and Boost-spell)
Actions
No.1 Accession + Haste
No.2 Accession + Temper
No.3 Do whatever for the next 45s because your Accession timer is at 1 min 45s
no.4 Accession + Enspell
no.5 Wait for the 1 min 45s on the second strat.
No.6 Accession Gain-spell

Conclusion:Considering a full AF3 +2 set gives other ppl a 5 min buff (aprox) you would have to keep recasting the buffs.That is an enhancing bot.

Situation no.2 (Haste and refresh 2 as single targets no accession but no gain/enspell/temper to cast)
Action
no1.Cast Haste on Melee
No.2 Cast Refresh II on the WHM while haste timer is down (about 10s)
no.3 Cast Haste on another melee
No.4 Recast haste every 10s until all the melee in your PT got.

Conclusion: It takes you less then 1min 30s to have every1 hasted/refreshed wich leaves you with 3 mins 30s to dance the Lambada if you feel like it.

Ofcourse I might give too much credit to most RDM thinking that they would actually WANT to cast enhancing.....at all.But as soon as you would get to a "certain level" of event, you can be sure that melees and tank would ask and annoy you about having all those shinies on them.So can you really be mad at them for not giving you accession?

[cidbahamut]

Ok so lets do some maths, simple ones.

Rdm using SCH sub have 2 Strat.Each strat have a 1 min Recast.

And you've failed right out of the gate. Stratagem charge time is 2 minutes: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Stratagems

The rest of your post is built upon an incorrect premise.

[Vaness]

And you've failed right out of the gate. Stratagem charge time is 2 minutes: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Stratagems

The rest of your post is built upon an incorrect premise.

I'm sorry you are right, I am a sch main and barely uses /sch or accession as sub....at all.
But that revelation makes the whole accession + haste/temper/gain-spells/enspells even worse.

So the rest of my built isnt exacly built on Incorrect since it was made to show how accession + the new buffs you guys asking, would make you even more of an enhancing bot.

[ManaKing]

Ok so lets do some maths, simple ones.

Rdm using SCH sub have 2 Strat.Each strat have a 2 min Recast.

Situation no.1 (You get accession with the possibility to use it with haste, temper, Enspell and Boost-spell)
Actions
No.1 Accession + Haste
No.2 Accession + Temper
No.3 Do whatever for the next 45s because your Accession timer is at 1 min 45s
no.4 Accession + Enspell
no.5 Wait for the 1 min 45s on the second strat.
No.6 Accession Gain-spell

Conclusion:Considering a full AF3 +2 set gives other ppl a 5 min buff (aprox) you would have to keep recasting the buffs.That is an enhancing bot.

Situation no.2 (Haste and refresh 2 as single targets no accession but no gain/enspell/temper to cast)
Action
no1.Cast Haste on Melee
No.2 Cast Refresh II on the WHM while haste timer is down (about 10s)
no.3 Cast Haste on another melee
No.4 Recast haste every 10s until all the melee in your PT got.

Conclusion: It takes you less then 1min 30s to have every1 hasted/refreshed wich leaves you with 3 mins 30s to dance the Lambada if you feel like it.

Ofcourse I might give too much credit to most RDM thinking that they would actually WANT to cast enhancing.....at all.But as soon as you would get to a "certain level" of event, you can be sure that melees and tank would ask and annoy you about having all those shinies on them.So can you really be mad at them for not giving you accession?

It's funny because I specifically said that I have no interest in improving /SCH and Accession. I just want Composure to AOE Phallanx 2, Temper, and possibly Haste or Gain spells. I don't care about cycles, I just want to benefit people when I benefit myself. Thus not a bot and thus all of your post was misdirected. I apologize that my post about preferring to use Composure as a catalyst to make RDMs cycles go away instead of Accession was a previous post and that you didn't read it. But I have no intention of double posting all day long every time I want to comment on a thread. I simply read everything that everyone has posted thus far so that I don't misinterpret what people are say. I guess that isn't common courtesy on forums.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

@ saevel and daniel.You two were crying in the Cure V thread about how you didn't wanted to be Enhancing bots.I am pretty sure asking for accession temper, haste,gain-spell and Enspell 2 will make you an enhancing bot.Changed your mind?

I don't LIKE being an Enhancing Bot, casting Haste and Refresh on one person at a time. I did it when RDM was desired, I still didn't like it. Acccession > Spell is the case of cast and then recast once at every recast time, it's a lot better that way and less tedious.

This allows plenty of time in between to do other stuff, such as depending on how the player plays RDM, Help with Curing, Nuke, Melee (if allowed) and so on.

I personally only care for Haste and Temper being made Accessionable, Refresh II is alright, but unless you're in a mage party you're not going to need to refresh all those party members.

[Seriha]

Yet, imagine if some got their wish and Temper and Gain spells could be cast on others... imagine that nightmare party where you need to dole out 6 individual hastes, 6 refreshes, 6 tempers, 6 gains, and maybe even 6 phalanx 2s. Basically, any time we're in a situation where we have to buff 3 or more people with the same spell, an AoE equivalent would be far more beneficial.

Being limited to the timer of Accession is a factor, yes, and bluntly, some kind of RDM equivalent would work just fine on a minute timer. Unfortunately, I doubt our set bonus would convey the duration extension to others if using Accession, nor do some buffs people would like to see benefit from the full set.

So, we come kind of full circle to why sphere/aura (like Mantelets, but RDM being it and people receiving as long as they're in range) or buff copying to others as both the more practical and elegant solution. Like it or not, casting burden has been one of RDM's bigger issues over the years, resulting in dropping spells like debuffs on mobs since they weren't terribly essential, perhaps not being able to nuke as often, or most definitely suffer from the melee perspective since you're looking at least 2 seconds of not swinging per spell you cast, which hurts a job that's already third-rate physically for various reasons.

The alternative to AoE spells is significantly longer durations on the single-targets. Personally, I'd gladly pay double, maybe even triple, the MP costs of a spell if it meant I could keep it one someone for 15 minutes or more. Sure, we'll see a glut of dispel/overwriting/buff-stealing happy mobs then, but for more leisurely play, it'd free us up to be a bit more versatile even if heavily leaned on as a party's support in a given group.