[dev1049] New weapon skills

[Economizer]

I really don't get how saying that players shouldn't be held back because someone is afraid of being outdone by others offends you, but alas. I'm not going to quote the thinly veiled comments calling me a retard, but I will get to the core of this. I hope that this can help pacify your dander.

Have a problem with people who play the game differently from you? Fine. Some of us enjoy different aspects of this game, and no, that isn't automatically a bad thing.. Being able to master multiple jobs quickly and easily doesn't make someone a "cookie cutter robot". It's actually extremely easy when you understand how the game itself works at its core. All you have to do is apply the same concepts to whatever you're working with at the time.

I have no problem against people who play the game differently, or people who master several jobs and play them all well. In fact, I think that players able to do that are needlessly held back by artificially limiting how many WS you can merit.

Some players will be able to do this, I have no problem with that, and I have no clue how you came to the conclusion that I did or that I said anything to that effect.

The only players I have a problem with are ones who think they need to have the best gear and the best merits for their particular job and that everyone else should be held back from this unless that is the only job they want to prioritize.

Players who work hard at what they do and care about being good at it will always be better then those who are worried about being the best or being "cookie cutter" or some other thing they see as horrible, even if they are not the best at what they are doing.

I trust that you feel that you work hard at what you do, as that is the feeling I get from your post, and this is entirely what I defended, and not a thing more then what I mean.

[brayen]

i think he just missed what your point was. Not sure why he got so offended. (i think u two are even on the same side of the argument in this discussion too which makes it funny but w/e lol)

[Greatguardian]

i think he just missed what your point was. Not sure why he got so offended. (i think u two are even on the same side of the argument in this discussion too which makes it funny but w/e lol)

Possibly. I'm seeing absolutely no consistency at all in my reading of the past 3 pages. People seem to be all over the place.

It would help if the term "Cookie Cutter" was expanded upon, because that is driving me crazy. The hell is wrong with using the best TP/WS/merit sets for a job? They're the best because they're the best. There is no subjective case there. Using this as a derogatory term is flying in the face of the rest of what appears to be going on here.

[Economizer]

It would help if the term "Cookie Cutter" was expanded upon, because that is driving me crazy. The hell is wrong with using the best TP/WS/merit sets for a job? They're the best because they're the best. There is no subjective case there. Using this as a derogatory term is flying in the face of the rest of what appears to be going on here.

I think calling someone "cookie cutter" is the poor statement that their gear and merits match. That's kind of inevitable and only matters if you think it does.

I was replying to the person who was saying that allowing people to merit as many WS as they want would result in people being cookie cutter. I was telling them that thinking that using the best sets for a job does not set you apart, but rather, playing well does.

Of course, having these things helps, which is why I think they should be available for all jobs someone has, rather then being limited to placate people who are irrationally afraid of looking the same as others.

I don't think that someone could log into your character and do what you do unless they know what you know and care enough about it to put in the effort to pull it off. This isn't necessarily hard, but putting in the effort to do these things is something most people don't do, and I think that should be what sets us apart (not that that is neccisary) not some artificial limit on merit point allocation.

Hopefully this helps, and if I used phrasing that was confusing before, I'm sorry.

[Greatguardian]

Point taken, I'm sorry about that then. In the post you quoted, I saw nothing about cookie cutter from the other guy, so apparently I was missing a good deal of context.

Honestly, I could care less about the whole merit deal. I already know I'm only unlocking GKT, H2H, and Gun. I have a Vereth and an Armageddon already, but those WS just look supercool - and are situationally useful regardless. Last Stand is easily comparable to Wildfire, and would be stronger on anything that physical or non-fire damage are more viable on. Shijin's plague effect is fairly potent, though probably ineffectual on real NMs, so it's a nice solo/lowman tool for summoning pokemanz and keeping TP feed down.

Shoha is just a beast, though. I'm making a new magian GKT for it. A 99 TPBonus Keito with 5/5 Shoha is likely going to demolish a 90Masamune with Fudo, and there's no way I'm taking a Masa to 99.

[brayen]

Cookie cutter is simply a term used for what you see the most of. Peoples argument is that this makes for a change...simply because some people will be able to access the better WS while others who don't have such a luxury to merit enough for all their jobs will be left behind(forcing which jobs you ultimately use as no one will consider a job using raging axe cuz they lack rampage *as an example*) In any case, cookie cutter is deemed evil because people just see same job classes wearing the same stuff and using the same WS/spells, even tho a greta majority of the time said cookie cutters are in fact not wearing the optimal gear or anything like that which makes it all the more humorous.

[Greatguardian]

I know what Cookie Cutter means, the important thing was context. In the context you bring up, I think it's silly to be upset over it. If X gear is the best, I'm going to wear X. If other people wear X too, so what? Good for them, I say. That's always going to happen, no matter what.

What makes you say that "cookie cutting" isn't optimal, though? Why would people wear a set en masse if it was not optimal? Are you referring to the spread of misinformation? If so, I'm against that too! Hell, it's the vast majority of why I post on these forums. You should see the things people come up with.

However, if you were to give everyone all of the knowledge about the game in existence, along with the ability to GM any gear they want out of thin air, people are going to end up wearing the same thing 95% of the time.

[brayen]

I know what Cookie Cutter means, the important thing was context. In the context you bring up, I think it's silly to be upset over it. If X gear is the best, I'm going to wear X. If other people wear X too, so what? Good for them, I say. That's always going to happen, no matter what.

What makes you say that "cookie cutting" isn't optimal, though? Why would people wear a set en masse if it was not optimal? Are you referring to the spread of misinformation? If so, I'm against that too! Hell, it's the vast majority of why I post on these forums. You should see the things people come up with.

However, if you were to give everyone all of the knowledge about the game in existence, along with the ability to GM any gear they want out of thin air, people are going to end up wearing the same thing 95% of the time.

because cookie cutter is usually optimal within reason. For example, a good majority of people have totally skipped out on augmenting abj gear due to the retarded random stats, even tho for a good amount of cases these are the optimal choices. you bring up good points on misinformation as well but main point i was stating was this. as cookie cutter is usually reference to "basic" gear that players wear.

[Economizer]

I think the other five percent of the time will refer to that neck piece and soon the new cape that increase crit rate and damage taken at the expense of having to increase your Tonberry hate.

Now that's a hard choice.

[FrankReynolds]

because cookie cutter is usually optimal within reason. For example, a good majority of people have totally skipped out on augmenting abj gear due to the retarded random stats, even tho for a good amount of cases these are the optimal choices. you bring up good points on misinformation as well but main point i was stating was this. as cookie cutter is usually reference to "basic" gear that players wear.

I opted out of that crap because I am against random stats as well, and I refuse to give SE a reason to put that shit on more gear. Nobody wants to be cookie cutter, but by placing these merit caps, they are basically saying that you can only be really good at 3 of 20 jobs (depending on the WS), unless you go build a relic or something. That's pretty harsh. Bear in mind that I'm saying this as a person who probably won't run into that limitation as much as many others will. I'm for the good of the player base. I don't want to be doing Nyzul PUG with a bunch of crappy DDs who have no WS (just and example). I also don't wanna have to filter people out based on that.

As for defending the interwebs from terrible misinformation, please refer to my signature if your not sure these stupid people exist. :P