[dev1049] New weapon skills

[Alhanelem]

I don't know why people are saying Shijin spiral isnt good... Outside of abyssea, it seems to be on par with Victory Smite, with an additional effect.

[xbobx]

The problem si they are testing it in abyessa and obviously it is not going to perform as will with a crit based weaponskill.

To many abyessa is the only content, but we are moving away from it. I tried in cape last night and on average it was better then pummel. Pummel had to do almost full crits to match the damage. I was doing 1900-2400 with Shinjin

[brayen]

Why do people keep using the cookie-cutter excuse? the game can't change that. There is always a "best" gear choice for x situation, as well as a "best attainable" option that will always "plague" your game. trying to use that to justify having to "specialize" on a single set of weapons is just asinine. as it will be the same for weaponskills anyways. Fact of the matter is the change job option has been a fundamental aspect of this game in where you are allowed to play all the job classes to the fullest that you wish, initiating strict road blocks on that versatility is beyond me. As mentioned before this if you wish to "stand out" then gear up better, you would be surprised how often these so called "cookie cutter" people are geared poorly, the fact that this is being overlooked tells me a bit about how knowledgeable some people are in the actual mechanics and gear options of this game.

[Koren]

I would have liked to get the weapon skills naturally at the 350 or whatever skill level and have the merits adjust the additional affects for each one leaving the mod constant from when it was learned instead of this 17% increase per merit. Just have each be a damage varies with TP as a start. Then let the players decide what else the WS could do.

Example: Each weapon is its own category. 5 levels in each weapon merit, max 5 merits in each category. So 5 can be in Sword, 5 in H2H, 5 in Dagger, etc.

Sword Merit 1: Restores MP
Sword Merit 2: Critical Hit
Sword Merit 3: Lowers Enemy Attack
Sword Merit 4: Inflicts Paralysis
Sword Merit 5: Double Attack Aftermath

H2H Merit 1: Occ. Doubles Damage Aftermath
H2H Merit 2: Inflicts Slow
H2H Merit 3: Enfire effect
H2H Merit 4: Restores HP
H2H Merit 5: Allows one Additional Hit to Weapon Skill

and so on...

These are just examples so I don't really need to hear that H2H Merit 3 sucks vs the others or that I should have a healer or be /DNC if I want to heal myself.

At least this way would let us tailor-make these WS to the way we play, or the groups we may choose to play with. If you want a pure damage dealing WS there's a choice for that, if you want utility you can choose that instead. There are enough math fans here to figure out which would cause the most damage between Critical Hit and Double Attack Aftermath or if its better to put 3 merits in one and 2 in another or the difference between 2 and 3 merits is so small you might as well go 2-2-1 and get a minor additional effect slapped on for some utility.

I'm also for this because I'm a collective type player and the idea that some of these shiny WS would be out of my reach is abhorrent. I don't mind being able to max out 3 of my choice, but being unable to play with the others is just terrible. I'd like to be the best I reasonably can on my favorite jobs.

[Tannlore]

What were you hitting? Not that it really matters since I rarely see numbers past 500 unless it is a EP mob or I'm using Cataclysm.

I was popping them off on any mobs with no cruour buffs and just regain atmas. I plan to log in tonight and do some thorough testing in and out of aby mixing in various atmas and gearsets. I'll post my findings on the smn forum.

[Greatguardian]

If you want to do serious testing for the WS (this goes for anyone), Sneak attack them on level 0 bunnies in East Ronfaure and record your stats. Get about 20 WS naked, and 20 with as much {stat mod} as you can tack on.

Numbers on Aby and VW are nice, but don't really teach us anything about the WS.

Edit: Obviously, write down every WS# and note high/low, and # of merits in the WS.

[Tannlore]

If you want to do serious testing for the WS (this goes for anyone), Sneak attack them on level 0 bunnies in East Ronfaure and record your stats. Get about 20 WS naked, and 20 with as much {stat mod} as you can tack on.

Numbers on Aby and VW are nice, but don't really teach us anything about the WS.

Edit: Obviously, write down every WS# and note high/low, and # of merits in the WS.

Thank you for the explanation. Didn't feel like posting such gross details about my methods for testing. Typing it all on iPhone makes meh lazy. Good info for others testing.

Although testing in aby/vw tells me nothing? I beg to differ there. I want to know how these ws will behave in these circumstances as well. Which atma suit it more? Which ones do you think would work but for some reason aren't? (maybe broken and needs attention)

[Greatguardian]

It's easy to figure that out after you learn the basic WS properties, though, lol. One leads to the other.

Once fTP and exact WSC are nailed down for these WS, we can math out which atma will do best pretty easily.

[Tannlore]

It's easy to figure that out after you learn the basic WS properties, though, lol. One leads to the other.

Once fTP and exact WSC are nailed down for these WS, we can math out which atma will do best pretty easily.

Right cause every WS and atma/atmacite SE's ever implemented has been done so with 100% perfection and efficiency ya? Or every update... like NA players being able to use the new WS and abilities. Part of testing with the atmas is to see if they are working correctly with the desired WS: It is a test server after all. Things might not be working correctly (See comment about bad/missing .dat files for WS and ability names) and I'd like to have it found it before it comes live and we find out after the fact and risk not getting it fixed for weeks/months/ever..

I want to see practical numbers from testing. Not partial testing and then theory-craft after the fact cause "I know how it'll pretty much go". Assumption is the mother of all mess-ups.

[SpankWustler]

Right cause every WS and atma/atmacite SE's ever implemented has been done so with 100% perfection and efficiency ya? Or every update... like NA players being able to use the new WS and abilities. Part of testing with the atmas is to see if they are working correctly with the desired WS: It is a test server after all. Things might not be working correctly (See comment about bad/missing .dat files for WS and ability names) and I'd like to have it found it before it comes live and we find out after the fact and risk not getting it fixed for weeks/months/ever..

I want to see practical numbers from testing. Not partial testing and then theory-craft after the fact cause "I know how it'll pretty much go". Assumption is the mother of all mess-ups.

If you don't know how something should work, there's no way to test if it is working properly. Without knowing basic things about a weaponskill such as the fTP and modifiers, it is impossible to tell if anything is actually having the proper effect.

All you can determine is "dis suks" or "i liek dis", which while useful information for an individual, is not the most objectively useful information.