Pupdate 10-28-2011

[Dfoley]

Okay i have some data for some math people

Inhibitor: was 5/10/15/20 store tp
Tested using soulsoother (wiki says 400 delay)

0 attachments
0 10 20 30 40 51 61 71 81 91 102
Confirms 400 delay

inhibitor 0 fire maneuvers
0 10 21 32 42 53 64 74 85 96 107
+4 store tp would be
10.7 21.4 32.1 42.8 53.5 64.2 74.9 85.6 96.3 107
Okay, so 0 maneuvers = is 4 store tp (says it used to be 5, so -1???)

inhibitor 1 fire maneuver
0 11 23 35 46 58 70
+14 store tp would be
0 11.7 23.4 35.1 46.8 58.5 70.2
Okay, so 1 fire maneuver = +14 (was +10, so +4 from what it would be)

inhibitor 2 fire maneuvers
0 12 25 38 50 63 76 88 101
+24 stp
0 12.7 25.4 38.1 50.8 63.5 76.2 88.9 101.6
So 2 fire maneuvers is +24 store tp (was 15, so +9)

inhibitor 3 fire maneuvers
0 14 28 42 56 71 85 99
+38 store tp
0 14.2 28.4 42.6 56.8 71 85.2 99.4

I am going to assume
1) Delay is 400 (screw you wiki n your bad formulas)
2) it is 4/14/24/38 store tp

okay theytak, thank you for pointing out the wiki formula is off. here is the final results which confirms the 400 delay and confirms 100% of data points

[Dohati]

since stormwaker head is the only one to get stoneskin and phalanx, i wish they had lower priority for elemental magic. the stoneskin effect would be excellent for soloing with ninja sub, but i wouldn't want my puppet wasting all her MP on nukes... or please just give soulsoother stoneskin. <3 i don't see the problem with it since real whms have afflatus solace.

[Dfoley]

Gonna redo my calculations with the bg wiki tp formulas

[Theytak]

Inhibitor: Done using valoredge, Base TP/hit 9.3

Inhibitor, 0 fire maneuvers: 9, 19, 29, 38, 48, 58, 67, 77, 87, 97, thus 9.7 tp/hit, which is due to Store TP +5 (same as it was originally, thus it's unchanged)

Inhibitor, 1 fire maneuvers: 10, 21, 31, 42, 53, 63, 74, 84, 95, 106, thus 10.6 tp/hit, due to Store TP +15 (originally +10, so 5 stp increase)

Inhibitor, 2 fire maneuvers: 11, 23, 34, 46, 58, 69, 81, 92, 104, 116, thus 11.6 tp/hit, due to Store TP +25 (originally +15, so 10 stp increase

Note about this last one: Caroline borked it up the first try, but that bork up still allowed me to get an accurate number. Due to how much tp/hit is, it's a bit annoying to get the last couple of numbers since the puppet will randomly WS. The highest I've gotten is 9 hits, and the numbers held true to that point. If anyone can pull off getting all 10 to confirm 100% that would be nice, but I don't want to deal with the headache since the math is already clear enough.

Inhibitor, 3 fire maneuvers: 13, 26, 39, 52, 65, 78, 91, -fuckup- 102 (third fire maneuver wore off a second before the hit), however given that 2 fire maneuvers is 11.6 TP/hit, 3 can't be anything other than 13.0. If it were 13.1, the 2 fm hit would have resulted in 103 TP. Additionally, I ran through again and got the following: 13, 26, 39, 52, 65, 78, 91, 104, 117, WS, which further solidifies this one. 3 FM is 13.0 TP/hit, due to Store TP +40 (originally +20, so 20 stp increase)

tl;dr:
Inhibitor:
0 FM: STP +5
1 FM: STP +15
2 FM: STP +25
3 FM: STP +40

Basically they gave it turbo charger's scaling.

That leaves:
flame holder
damage guage
strobe
reactive shield by level
analyzer

Strobe's values are gonna be annoying to test, but given how they changed inhibitor, we can assume with moderate safety that they changed strobe in the same manner, from enmity +5/10/15/20 to enmity +5/15/25/40.

Reactive shield testing is simple enough, it's just gonna take forever to do. Also, you need to stay clear that it's affected by the puppet's SKILL level, not the puppet's actual level. Assuming either

A: Melee for Valoredge, Ranged for Sharpshot, Magic for Stormwaker, and for Harle, it'll be impossible to test which individually affects it since all our skills are capped and all of harly's skills are capped at the same level (and I doubt 30 skill from cirque pants+2 and merits will make any difference)

or B: Universally by Melee skill, or less likely, by magic skill (ie valoredge and sharpshot will have shitty returns with it, but from playing around yesterday this doesn't -seem- to be the case)

Analyzer testing, I would assume is probably easiest to test via thousand needles spam (I'd say get a blu and try it in diorama for a base line, since getting cactuars to -spam- thousand needles is not exactly easy.

Damage Gauge, and Manabooster's exact fast cast values are pretty much impossible to test accurately on the test server, so until it goes live we won't be able to know for certain.

Flame Holder is also gonna be tricky, but that's less to due with the test server and more to do with how fucking difficult it is to test pet ws fTP values since we can't just SA WS test it like we can player WS. I'll play with this after I finish my magic mortar testing and see if I can't at least get a general idea of the values.

Also missing from your OP:
Elemental Recast is the same as Enhancing (they're separate timers, but the same length), and healing/na recasts are the same length, but shorter than elemental, ~6 seconds.

and we still need to do some work with magic mortar (I'm gonna do that next)

[Dfoley]

tl;dr:
Inhibitor:
0 FM: STP +5
1 FM: STP +15
2 FM: STP +25
3 FM: STP +40

Interesting that i would get 5/14/24/38 with soul soother. Maybe it depends on the frame?

Also missing from your OP:
Elemental Recast is the same as Enhancing (they're separate timers, but the same length), and healing/na recasts are the same length, but shorter than elemental, ~6 seconds.

and we still need to do some work with magic mortar (I'm gonna do that next)

With which head? Or are all heads on 15 sec for elemental spells now?

Same with other spells are they all independent of the head now?

[Theytak]

Interesting that i would get 5/14/24/38 with soul soother. Maybe it depends on the frame?



With which head? Or are all heads on 15 sec for elemental spells now?

Same with other spells are they all independent of the head now?

the fact that you got 5/14/24/38 can be attributed to the probability of the frames not actually having 400 delay, and rounding errors in your math somewhere, 5/14/24/38 makes absolutely no sense and is completely unlike anything SE would do. As for whether the casting times are different, I hadn't thought of that. That's something we'll need to look into. My comment though was related to stormwaker head.

[TimeMage]

You guys are simply awesome, thanks a lot for the testing. Keep up the good work!

Oh, and you may want to mention anything that remotely resembles a bug in the Test Server subforum thread, so that we make sure the community reps see it.

[Theytak]

Preliminary findings, Magic Mortar can be resisted, and has a HIGH rate of resistance.

Harlequin Head, Stormwaker Frame, 1051 HP (only HP boost was animator +1) 10 WS vs level 0 wild rabbits in west ronfaure. Variance in TP has no effect on damage.
Magic Mortar: 91, 365, 365, 91, 365, 91, 91, 365, 365, 91. 91 = 1/4 damage (91x4 = 364, + decimal rounds up to 365 since it's taking a quarter of an odd number)

HYPOTHESIS (Read: NOT proven fact, but rather, educated guess as to what the out come will be based on 5 and a half years of playing pup and crunching pup numbers, that I will attempt to confirm/disprove via testing)

Base damage = current automaton melee skill, but can be resisted based on current TP. 100% TP: 50% chance of dealing 1/4 base damage (~1/12 max HP), 200% TP: 25% chance of dealing 1/4 base damage (may be 1/2, I'll have to do some testing here to determine if it's the same resistance or not), 300% TP: 0% chance of resistance. Additionally, base damage is added cumulatively to the damage dealt based on missing HP.

If anyone else wants to test this theory too, more data will always be welcome.

edit: due to me being a dumbass, I JUST noticed that harle/waker has 365 melee skill. I changed heads to valoredge (for more light slots) to boost HP, but noticed the change in melee skill to 370, so I figured wtf. I tried it. Result? 370 damage. Took off cirque +2 pants, damage? 360. So Magic Mortar Floor = Current Auto Melee Skill.

Of course, there's more to it than that, since people are reporting numbers in the 400s, but vs tw bunnies in ronf, the damage is 100% consistent. I still have a lot more things to test, though

edit 2: ok, the 100~200 TP resistance window applies to ALL damage for the ws. I used DEA to activate with 31% HP, then proceeded to do 20 more magic mortars. damage was again consistent, but was also , again, resisted literally half the time. 10 ws came out 811 damage, 10 came out 200 damage. I've never seen magic mortar resist before, and I don't think I've read anything about anyone getting magic mortar to randomly do 1/4 damage vs anything normal... I'm flabbergasted.

Additionally, I tested with increasing the puppet's max HP by 200, and base damage didn't flinch, it was static 370 damage (when it didn't resist for 92 damage) with valorwaker and af3+2 pants at both 1051 HP and 1267 hp.

What the fuck did they do to this ws...

edit 3: done testing for today, magic mortar has given me a migraine.

edit 4:

Ok, smn's have blood pacts, bst has sic/ready, drg has w/e their forced breath JA is called. I want some pup love. Let's axe cool down in favor of something like this:

Striking Maneuver: The Player chooses one of the weaponskills currently available to the automaton and forces the automaton to execute it. The automaton must have at least 100 TP for this ability to be successful.

Get rid of random weaponskilling at random TP%. Get rid of maneuver priority. Just give us WS like all the other g'damn pet jobs have, simple, easily controlled, and so much less aggravating.

[Blueyes]

Get rid of random weaponskilling at random TP%. Get rid of maneuver priority. Just give us WS like all the other g'damn pet jobs have, simple, easily controlled, and so much less aggravating.

I would like to add that I do agree with this. A few days ago I was having fun with Sharpshot in Zeruhn Mines and a few too many times my automation would use Barrage just before deciding to weaponskill, hardly giving me any time at all to put a Wind Maneuver back up, which would then result in the automaton using Daze due to Thunder Maneuver being up. I could be throwing in Dark Maneuver to make sure at least Armor Piercer goes off as a backup, but I found myself hesitant to use anything more than Wind Maneuvers to make sure Armor Shatterer would trigger reliably. Or else I would need to always be on guard to throw a Wind Maneuver back up when TP is ready. In general it's problematic and it shouldn't be so stressing to make sure the automaton works the way we want it to.

[Laxedrane]

Preliminary findings, Magic Mortar can be resisted, and has a HIGH rate of resistance.

Harlequin Head, Stormwaker Frame, 1051 HP (only HP boost was animator +1) 10 WS vs level 0 wild rabbits in west ronfaure. Variance in TP has no effect on damage.
Magic Mortar: 91, 365, 365, 91, 365, 91, 91, 365, 365, 91. 91 = 1/4 damage (91x4 = 364, + decimal rounds up to 365 since it's taking a quarter of an odd number)

HYPOTHESIS (Read: NOT proven fact, but rather, educated guess as to what the out come will be based on 5 and a half years of playing pup and crunching pup numbers, that I will attempt to confirm/disprove via testing)

Base damage = current automaton melee skill, but can be resisted based on current TP. 100% TP: 50% chance of dealing 1/4 base damage (~1/12 max HP), 200% TP: 25% chance of dealing 1/4 base damage (may be 1/2, I'll have to do some testing here to determine if it's the same resistance or not), 300% TP: 0% chance of resistance. Additionally, base damage is added cumulatively to the damage dealt based on missing HP.

If anyone else wants to test this theory too, more data will always be welcome.

edit: due to me being a dumbass, I JUST noticed that harle/waker has 365 melee skill. I changed heads to valoredge (for more light slots) to boost HP, but noticed the change in melee skill to 370, so I figured wtf. I tried it. Result? 370 damage. Took off cirque +2 pants, damage? 360. So Magic Mortar Floor = Current Auto Melee Skill.

Of course, there's more to it than that, since people are reporting numbers in the 400s, but vs tw bunnies in ronf, the damage is 100% consistent. I still have a lot more things to test, though

edit 2: ok, the 100~200 TP resistance window applies to ALL damage for the ws. I used DEA to activate with 31% HP, then proceeded to do 20 more magic mortars. damage was again consistent, but was also , again, resisted literally half the time. 10 ws came out 811 damage, 10 came out 200 damage. I've never seen magic mortar resist before, and I don't think I've read anything about anyone getting magic mortar to randomly do 1/4 damage vs anything normal... I'm flabbergasted.

Additionally, I tested with increasing the puppet's max HP by 200, and base damage didn't flinch, it was static 370 damage (when it didn't resist for 92 damage) with valorwaker and af3+2 pants at both 1051 HP and 1267 hp.

What the fuck did they do to this ws...

edit 3: done testing for today, magic mortar has given me a migraine.

edit 4:

Ok, smn's have blood pacts, bst has sic/ready, drg has w/e their forced breath JA is called. I want some pup love. Let's axe cool down in favor of something like this:

Striking Maneuver: The Player chooses one of the weaponskills currently available to the automaton and forces the automaton to execute it. The automaton must have at least 100 TP for this ability to be successful.

Get rid of random weaponskilling at random TP%. Get rid of maneuver priority. Just give us WS like all the other g'damn pet jobs have, simple, easily controlled, and so much less aggravating.

Based on this, sounds like to me they turned magic mortar into a true elemental weaponskill. Have you tried to test it with tranquilizer, loudspeakers, manabooster, and mattk or macc claws? Might also be worth checking if it does amber in abyssea now.