Sept update blues

[Leonlionheart]

This update might of been extremely lackluster but we'll need to see the grandscope of things from 95-99.

I hope so, because this update was "extremely lackluster" right Yugl?

Like I said, only a handful of small upgrades, the earring being one.

[Yugl]

If you only see a handful, then you're probably gearing wrong.

[Leonlionheart]

If you only see a handful, then you're probably gearing wrong.

If you see more than a handful, then you're probably gearing wrong.

The biggest upgrade is probably chersos helm, for war anyway, and it's only 1% better in haste and pdt than an augmented genbu's kabuto.

Tons of niche stuff I suppose, but something really worth sinking time into? I think not.

[Yugl]

If you see more than a handful, then you're probably gearing wrong.

In other words, you pose the "Nu uh" comeback.

There's a universal cure body piece for RDMs, SCHs, and BLM to boot. A new PDT piece for DRG (And maybe even the other classes listed on that piece). Various accessories including that H2H piece and 7ATT/Wyvern DT for DRG. The helm accompanying the PDT body is good for WSs sets without a critical hit focus (i.e. for NMs you're close to floored critical hits against). Cure potency cape for RDM, SCH, and BLU. Ocelo for Benthic typhoon. Lenore for enmity cure sets. Torque for Alchemy and Smithing. Glassbelt for DRG breath moves. Two new skill up earrings. Fast cast ring. New sTP ring for those that were using the one from Tahrongi. Valseur any good for DNC? Aife Mantle for Benthic. Motenten found Ire+1 to beat the elemental gorgets and BB for belt (Nightfyre showing Anguinus in certain belts), so I imagine Justiciar will win in some of these cases, but I haven't calculated that yet. Phrenic for enmity certain cure sets (Depends on beginning set). Nefer Khat for SCH nukes for mix sets. Rauch for potency light enfeebles on SCH (And potentially RDM unless I'm forgetting a piece). Saevus for pure potency on SCH. Romanus for RDM? I don't recall any piece better than that.

I'm not going to even entertain this any further because it's pretty clear by now that you're wrong.

That was mathemacally proven to be inferior to other gear. It's not enough to show off shiny stats, there is math behind, and math tells you that moonshade earring surpasses it.

With which augments? Also, this depends on the fact that you're using moonshade for MNK.

[Monchat]

With which augments? Also, this depends on the fact that you're using moonshade for MNK.

First the H2H earring does not break a H2H tier, nor do the faith torque; you do break a tier by wearing both though, but getting +1 base dmg with two items is not so good. Check the MNK forums. So far looks like the best capped acc combo is the new kick dmg necklace+ moonshade (regain/att), and the best uncapped is (ziel charm+moonshade(acc/regain)).

[Leonlionheart]

In other words, you pose the "Nu uh" comeback.

There's a universal cure body piece for RDMs, SCHs, and BLM to boot. A new PDT piece for DRG (And maybe even the other classes listed on that piece). Various accessories including that H2H piece and 7ATT/Wyvern DT for DRG. The helm accompanying the PDT body is good for WSs sets without a critical hit focus (i.e. for NMs you're close to floored critical hits against). Cure potency cape for RDM, SCH, and BLU. Ocelo for Benthic typhoon. Lenore for enmity cure sets. Torque for Alchemy and Smithing. Glassbelt for DRG breath moves. Two new skill up earrings. Fast cast ring. New sTP ring for those that were using the one from Tahrongi. Valseur any good for DNC? Aife Mantle for Benthic. Motenten found Ire+1 to beat the elemental gorgets and BB for belt (Nightfyre showing Anguinus in certain belts), so I imagine Justiciar will win in some of these cases, but I haven't calculated that yet. Phrenic for enmity certain cure sets (Depends on beginning set). Nefer Khat for SCH nukes for mix sets. Rauch for potency light enfeebles on SCH (And potentially RDM unless I'm forgetting a piece). Saevus for pure potency on SCH. Romanus for RDM? I don't recall any piece better than that.

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

85 and 90 content both brought in clearly superior pieces to anything we've seen before. Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

Point is, this stuff isn't something that the average player is going to go gaga over like AF3+2. It's not as big of a jump, and it's harder. This isn't a good business model.

[Mahoro]

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

85 and 90 content both brought in clearly superior pieces to anything we've seen before. Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

Point is, this stuff isn't something that the average player is going to go gaga over like AF3+2. It's not as big of a jump, and it's harder. This isn't a good business model.

It would be a far worse business model to put stuff into the game that eclipses AF3+2 only ONE year after Abyssea was implemented. WoW does this sometimes, but as I pointed out in another thread, there would be literal howls of protest from the FFXI playerbase if SE up and made your precious AF3+2 obsolete at this point. Yes, it's not as big of a jump. The new gear is a liberal mix of best-in-slot upgrades and sidegrades. Really, what ELSE did you expect?

For the people who live in Abyssea and want to work on AF3+2 for their umpteenth job, it's still there for you. For some of us, who have long since capped out on Abyssea and are looking for a new challenge and new gear to tweak out our jobs, SE just delivered some fun new content.

[Yugl]

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

This is just a semantics argument. In other word, "My definition of non-niche and handful is different from yours." You don't have a real comeback other than that.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

DRG working on a 5-hit without access to Rose strap will require it. Alternative options, insofar as that's not all that's implemented, is not always bad.

Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Loki's was less phenomenal then than it is now because we didn't have CDC, CW, Blade Hi, Razed Ruins, and so forth. Some AF3 were crap. Just look at Mavi scarf. Your list here is less than what the 95 piece brought and some of these were more niche than the level 95 update. It's illogical for you to assert that level 80 brought a bold upgrade in gear which maintaining that this update did not.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

You're really just creating a contradiction for yourself or trying to make vague arguments here. If the gains from level 80 were sufficient, then 95 should be sufficient. If you want to spell out exactly what stats they need to make so that it hits that oh-so vague notion of "not far superior" yet has "clear signs of level progression", then feel free to flesh that out. Otherwise, it's linguistic craft that spells out "I'm not satisfied" without giving clear justification.

Overall, I think the another issue you fail to recognize, aside from the fact that we paid an extra $10 for Abyssea content, is that the player's gripe over this entire situation is due to casuals crying about Abyssea and other people attaining the same "far superior" gear you mentioned are to blame. This is the problem when casual players try to act elitist. Elitists can handle difficult content with grand rewards because they're in it for the haul. Casuals making elitist demands are difficult to appease because they want gear that is easy to obtain, yet they want separation from some imaginary "herd" they feel superior to (Preposition...). At the same time, if it's gear they cannot obtain, they don't want it being vastly superior because they're worried about the real elites towering over them. It should be obvious how SE tried to reconcile these tugs and how the current situation resulted from that. Case and point, the current dilemma is the fault of ideas originating from players, not SE.

Edit: And I make all these statements knowing that I'm currently excluded from VW content. Despite being a poster on BG, I'm more casual than people expect.

[Neonii]

I'm seeing niche pieces for a handful of jobs, no major upgrades besides some of the VW bodies/hats. Mostly Inventory -1, mostly things you will seldom use.

Better? Yes. But better in the sense of level progression that we've seen through out the rest of the game? No. Even if it is just 5 levels, you mentioned Hoard Ring Vs. the new Attack/STP ring. Yes it's better, but off the top of my head I can't think of one job that will benefit from it in the ideal set. WAR? 5hit will still require tactical mantle, so put your Blitz ring back on. SAM? 5hit requires haste sacrifices and you can 6hit w/ sword strap reliably, so go get a mars ring. DRK? Maybe for a Apocalypse build, but I don't get into that. Good if you're trying to push for a Cala 6hit, but you're still using tactical mantle and accuracy sacrifices so there's no way it'll be worth it.

85 and 90 content both brought in clearly superior pieces to anything we've seen before. Even 80 brought in things like Loki's Kaftan, 6% haste panties, and AF3 accessories.

Should everything in the update be far superior to previous gear? Maybe, maybe not. Should it show clear signs of level progression to make the average player want to spend 13$ a month? Yes.

Point is, this stuff isn't something that the average player is going to go gaga over like AF3+2. It's not as big of a jump, and it's harder. This isn't a good business model.

One mans trash is another mans treasure and imo leave it at that.

[Ahrana]

I just double checked the data mined gear. I saw about ten pieces that I would take for my mains (whm, sch) but only 2 or 3 of those are solid upgrades. If I wanted to blow out my inventory I could probably take another 4 or 5, but I'm sure as heck not putting any effort into getting them with another level cap increase on the horizon somewhere.