Spoilers*Test Server

[SpankWustler]

Not everyone has a place in every type of content.

I agree that it's totally okay for some jobs to be stronger or weaker in certain content, but Blue Mage and Voidwatch are currently mix like cat poop and a nice Cuban sandwich. Physical spells performing poorly on harder stuff is to be expected, but the way the proc system operates currently is awful for anyone playing Blue Mage during the event.

This could change a bit, since apparently the hints for procs on the test server are more detailed, but right now the proc system is awful for Blue Mage (and Summoner to a lesser extent) by design. Not awful by way of exclusion, either. Awful by way of inclusion.

[Tashan]

You guys are disagreeing with Daniel_Hatcher, but what he's saying is true.

It's not neccesarily how it SHOULD be, but it is how it is.

A large part of it isn't even SE's fault. It's ours. We're always trying to be better and more efficient at what we're doing and critically analyse every last detail in this game to the point of arguement. Or we read other peoples testimonies, and just take the lazy route and copy it.

LV75 Merit Parties - No Room for Black Mages.
Pre-Easy Mode Sky - SAM SAM SAM SAM
Abyssea - Boy, sure is a long time since I've seen a Dragoon.

The only thing with Voidwatch is in the past I've always managed to find a way into completing most content with just BLU. However, it doesn't sound likely with VW.

Which tbh I'm not even sure I'm too bothered by it. I just hope upgrading Almace doesn't have to lead me towards it.

[Mightyg]

You guys are disagreeing with Daniel_Hatcher, but what he's saying is true.

It's not neccesarily how it SHOULD be, but it is how it is.

A large part of it isn't even SE's fault. It's ours. We're always trying to be better and more efficient at what we're doing and critically analyse every last detail in this game to the point of arguement. Or we read other peoples testimonies, and just take the lazy route and copy it.

LV75 Merit Parties - No Room for Black Mages.
Pre-Easy Mode Sky - SAM SAM SAM SAM
Abyssea - Boy, sure is a long time since I've seen a Dragoon.

The only thing with Voidwatch is in the past I've always managed to find a way into completing most content with just BLU. However, it doesn't sound likely with VW.

Which tbh I'm not even sure I'm too bothered by it. I just hope upgrading Almace doesn't have to lead me towards it.

Unfortunately when Voidwatch counts as about 50-75% of the new content we're getting, it starts to become an issue. I mean really, of all the things to nerf a spell with, I'd say accuracy loss is probably one of the most rage inducing to me at least. I'm pretty sure any long time player of FFXI has missed enough swings, weaponskills, full resist spells, target out of range lose all your tp to last a few lifetimes.

[Tashan]

Your either using hyperbole, or you really REALLY suck. I'm betting the former.

On IT+ I can get 800~1K without using JA's on VC, Q.Cont and GR, although GR varies between 500 and 1200 while QC goes between 700~1500 depending on how many hits land. Diss still dish's out 500~1K damage depending on target.

So yeah your just crying at this point in time that your super awesome spell was given a acc reduction to balance it out, not even a damage reduction just an accuracy reduction. Something you can fix with either sushi or /THF.

Is that within Abyssea or outside?

Either way, you're comparing High-Level NMs to Incredibly-Tough monsters.

Or End Game to a Merit Party.

...I don't get it.

[Prothscar]

Also I'd like to add that your Vertical Cleave damage is outrageously wrong.

Assuming the monster is level 97, which it would be higher if talking about a VWNM (which we are) and has 100 VIT (reasonable) and 400 DEF, you have 170ish STR, max vertical cleave is 631 damage, not 800-1000.

Even more reasonable for a VWNM: lv110, 460DEF, 100VIT, you with 170 STR, max V.cleave would be 297. Goblin Rush is 301, QC 470.

[Prothscar]

I'm certainly not saying it's exclusive to BLU, but that does not excuse SE for not fixing the issue. They need to start looking at the problems that we're telling them to fix rather than creating useless JAs and spells that no one wants.

[Tashan]

It's true it does need to be addressed.

[Mefuki]

So what I see here is a new spell with the potential to fill a niche - efficient physical spell vs high-level NMs - and it's been nerfed into the ground for those NMs because of how dire the need for acc is in that situation even without a penalty. What we have now is a new spell for old content instead of a new spell that will lead the way into new content... and really, why shouldn't we get new and effective spells? There will be more spells at 99, and some of them may replace old mainstays. I'm okay with that. But not once in this entire discussion, despite your repeated asking, have I sought for Heavy Strike to replace these old physical spells. I've sought for it to fill a niche they never had a place in to begin with.

Exactly. This is a design phliosophy that I adhere to in regards to Blue Mage and I'd hope the develepers would have the same one. There's no point in wasting time adding redundant (Dark Orb), penelty-heavy (Barrier Tusk, Mortal Ray) and downright useless spells due to lack of a niche to fill (post acc mod Heavy Strike).

The central points when designing these spells should be: Where would this spell be used? Does the mp cost/casting time/recast time etc warrant their use? Keeping in mind that Blue Mage is a hybrid job and can do many things but cannot fufill all the roles at one time, what spells can we add that are still lacking from it's repertoire, things that need to be added to round out their various roles.

It's like Nightfyre said, when going after lower level/defense monsters, most just use Delta Thrust. In fact, we have a nice set of spells to use on these kinds of monsters. That's not the problem. That aspect of our job is fine. But, we still have niches that need filling. What purpose does it serve to add yet another good on lower level/defense spell but bad on high level NM's? Why would I even bother with Heavy Strike, acc penelty and all, on these weaker monsters when I already have spells that fill that role?

Heavy Strike has a chance to fill in a missing space in one of our roles and all of our spells should follow suit. They need reasons to be used and SE can make it happen if they're clever about their effects, gives them reasonable opportunity costs and allows them to fill niches that have been empty for a long time.

[Yugl]

So uh, what am I looking forward to this update?
- Thunderbolt I hear is crap
- Hardenshell is good, but only for 1or3min/5?
- Barrier Tusk stinks
- Heavy Strike gimped
- Dark Orb? Maybe
- Sudden Lunge I get mixed reviews on; the cast+recast time stinks, but the duration rocks
- White Wind I hear is ok, but it's expensive for outside fights
- Ray is crap
- Water bomb looks like the new Enmity generating Regurgitation? Not much on this.