Poor Poor Rdm...useless as ever even to 95

[Leonlionheart]

From a DD point of view, AWESOME. Will be putting RDM+BRD in the party from here on out, and force the WHM to do everything from outside (unless I need bar- for that fight, and the RDM isn't /SCH). RDM makes fights pretty simple in the first place with addle, para II, slow II, etc. This just helps them out a bunch.

Of course this is all moot if the prominent end game continues to be Abyssea.

[Olor]

From a DD point of view, AWESOME. Will be putting RDM+BRD in the party from here on out, and force the WHM to do everything from outside (unless I need bar- for that fight, and the RDM isn't /SCH). RDM makes fights pretty simple in the first place with addle, para II, slow II, etc. This just helps them out a bunch.

Of course this is all moot if the prominent end game continues to be Abyssea.

Except whm is getting addle... so what was it that RDM had again?

[Leonlionheart]

Except whm is getting addle... so what was it that RDM had again?

Paralyze II, Slow II, Phalanx II, Refresh II

[Olor]

Paralyze II, Slow II, Phalanx II, Refresh II

Which gets you exactly nowhere with the vast majority of content that players actually engage in, so, yeah. Whoop de doo.

[Ank]

Just because it holds true doesn't mean its a hard and fast rule of SE's.

Come on man don't take their hope away.

[Fredjan]

RDM now has two "unique" enhancing spells, Refresh II and Temper (The description didn't say if it can target others or not, I'd like some confirmation - I am NOT a melee RDM - I play RDM for party/end-game play).

Merit point spells are just that, merit point spells. I'd rather have enfeebles I can learn that are unique to RDM that don't require me to spend merit points to obtain something no other job has. However, there's another thought I've had similar to what people have said about White Mage merits (namely Protect/Shell potency), and something I'd like to suggest:

- Change group 2 RDM merits to unique spells learnable at RDM Lv75 that no other job can or will learn.
- Adjust group 2 merits to "enhance" potency of the spells given in this category. Slow potency, Paralyze potency, Blind potency, Dia potency, Bio potency, Phalanx potency, blah, blah, blah.

That'd make me happy.

As is, SCH/RDM can provide the strongest Phalanx in the game, until they give RDM more enhancing gear. With the best enhancing magic skill gear available compared to RDM/SCH (yeah, I'd rather Accession + Phalanx and save merits on Phalanx II >.>) and SCH/RDM, SCH has the highest total.

About Cure V, I have mentioned this in the WHM Manifesto thread, but I'll type what I've thought since then...

As someone who has WHM, RDM, and SCH leveled, I too am "so-so" about RDM and SCH not having a higher tier cure spell. However, SCH has Rapture to help them (not to mention AF3+1/2 head to increase Rapture's effect even more), Red Mage doesn't have anything. If anything, RDM deserves Cure V more than SCH for that reason, and going by the trend of previous cures learned, RDM would learn it sooner. If they gave SCH Cure V, SCH would likely become the strongest healer with access to Rapture, unless they restricted it in some way for that spell (not likely, they haven't restricted Rapture of Ebullience on any white/black magic spell). A Rapture'd Cure V would exceed a WHM's Cure VI in healing strength without need of Divine Seal from /WHM. As things are, it's possible for SCH to outdo Cure V with Divine Seal + Rapture, granted that's only possible every 10 minutes. tl;dr: It's more likely that RDM will see Cure V than SCH.

[Neisan_Quetz]

RDM now has two "unique" enhancing spells, Refresh II and Temper (The description didn't say if it can target others or not, I'd like some confirmation - I am NOT a melee RDM - I play RDM for party/end-game play).

Merit point spells are just that, merit point spells. I'd rather have enfeebles I can learn that are unique to RDM that don't require me to spend merit points to obtain something no other job has. However, there's another thought I've had similar to what people have said about White Mage merits (namely Protect/Shell potency), and something I'd like to suggest:

- Change group 2 RDM merits to unique spells learnable at RDM Lv75 that no other job can or will learn.
- Adjust group 2 merits to "enhance" potency of the spells given in this category. Slow potency, Paralyze potency, Blind potency, Dia potency, Bio potency, Phalanx potency, blah, blah, blah.

That'd make me happy.

As is, SCH/RDM can provide the strongest Phalanx in the game, until they give RDM more enhancing gear. With the best enhancing magic skill gear available compared to RDM/SCH (yeah, I'd rather Accession + Phalanx and save merits on Phalanx II >.>) and SCH/RDM, SCH has the highest total.

About Cure V, I have mentioned this in the WHM Manifesto thread, but I'll type what I've thought since then...

As someone who has WHM, RDM, and SCH leveled, I too am "so-so" about RDM and SCH not having a higher tier cure spell. However, SCH has Rapture to help them (not to mention AF3+1/2 head to increase Rapture's effect even more), Red Mage doesn't have anything. If anything, RDM deserves Cure V more than SCH for that reason, and going by the trend of previous cures learned, RDM would learn it sooner. If they gave SCH Cure V, SCH would likely become the strongest healer with access to Rapture, unless they restricted it in some way for that spell (not likely, they haven't restricted Rapture of Ebullience on any white/black magic spell). A Rapture'd Cure V would exceed a WHM's Cure VI in healing strength without need of Divine Seal from /WHM. As things are, it's possible for SCH to outdo Cure V with Divine Seal + Rapture, granted that's only possible every 10 minutes. tl;dr: It's more likely that RDM will see Cure V than SCH.

I count +70 enhancing max for sch from a quick search on XIAH, and +79 for Rdm. Care to tell me where the missing 10 skill is coming from? Also Phalanx 2 was buffed so it's equal-ish to 1 at 5/5 now, with longer duration from Rdm (although you only get cape+feet+2/5 set bonus for duration as opposed to 5/5).

EDIT: Forgot waist slot for Sch

[Fredjan]

I count +70 enhancing max for sch from a quick search on XIAH, and +79 for Rdm. Care to tell me where the missing 10 skill is coming from? Also Phalanx 2 was buffed so it's equal-ish to 1 at 5/5 now, with longer duration from Rdm (although you only get cape+feet+2/5 set bonus for duration as opposed to 5/5).

EDIT: Forgot waist slot for Sch

Re-looked into it myself, you're right. I must've had an error when I looked into that. >_> I stand corrected.

I did do some looking into Cure V, however, and to give people an idea what RDM and SCH are capable of with this spell:

RDM- You're lucky to break 1k. Cure potency, on RDM, reaches up to ~42% at this point as far as I'm aware, using Augur's gloves and Estoqueur's Houseaux +2 (The large MND boost beats 1% extra from serpentes).

SCH- Won't break 1k, but using Rapture + Savant's Bonnet +2 (+60%) you're capable of doing 1500+, which is stronger than a WHM's Cure VI usually. That isn't factoring abyssea (cruor buffs or atma) either. There's a reason they haven't given SCH this yet, and I think that's probably one of the reasons.

I do have to laugh @ the raise 2/3 additions to these jobs though. Seems kinda pointless with the ease EXP is to get.