Salvage Gear Enhancements

[cadant]

As long as the luck factor is not as hardcore as neo-nyzul and requires the use of some kind of cheating, I don't mind. Then again maybe that's what they want so they can finally start banning people since they obviously don't care about all the people doing it in nyzul.

Assuming it's possible to finish a run with a skilled group nearly every time barring extreme bad luck, like old salvage back at 75 cap, I can deal with everything else. I never minded the crappy drop rates because at least we were able to kill the mobs

[Aramaic]

The only runs I ever hated that were considered luck based was Bhaflau. Was terrible to do every floor and get no NM on any rampart. That aside salvage worked well, strategies were formed for how each run could be accomplished and the system as a whole is understood. To change that now to all luck based and non-severe bad luck is laughing in the face of the community at this point.

[Aramaic]

One more thing I want to point out. You didn't completely revamp neo-nyzul, you adjusted the data collection so you have to go up to 100 in one felt swoop. Aside from that all you did was adjust mob levels and put new nm's in. For limbus you made new boss fights but you didnt change how the system worked. Why would you now revamp a working system when you really didn't do a full revamp to other said events of like kind.

[Minikom]

Up to 18 players can participate, but we are envisioning a difficulty level that can be cleared with around 6 players.

After read this... just hope if you go with 6 man you dont need embrava and PD to win this, 18 ppl is a lot for salvage. 6 is perfect and 3 is ideal, salvaged is/used to be a event for 3-6 ppl making this 18 just sound terrible (just my thoughts)

[Zhronne]

I'm very worried about Camate's announcement.
First of all are we talking about a complete Salvage revamp? I.e. "old style" salvage won't be available anymore?
Or are we talking about ADDITIONAL Salvage zones?
It does make a difference.

Second: I'm a huge Salvage lover, but I recognize it's always been tricky/annoying to handle cells assignments and calling people. Despite how annoying it may have been to handle this, I think it was PART of what was making Salvage so fun.
It gave you the power to decide, or gave you the illusion of being ale to have a certain degree of control over what was happening in a game controlled by random numbers generatos.
Similar to what yellow, red and blue !! procs did in Abyssea. Items could still not drop, but you were given the chance to get a slight control over that too.
Making everything random to solve the issue of the original system being "frustrating" is a path that risks making things only even more frustrating and not solving anything at all.
Your party needs magic unlocked so that the WHM can heal you? But no, your DNC gets magic unlocked instead.
And so you keep killing random monsters for ages, until the random number generators unlocked everything you needed to unlock.
I see this as way more frustrating.
With the cells system you were of course relying on the random factor when it comes to drops. But you were given a certain degree of "control" over it: you could choose which cells to target to, you chould choose who to give them to.
That matters A LOT into making the system much less frustrating, imho.

On the other hand, making so the new system is "too easy" and each mob unlocks 3-4 random things on a random players is TOO MUCH.
In such a scenario you could wonder why even having things locked at start if everything is unlocked within a few kills?
What made Salvage so different, so unique, so fantastic is the lock system, the strategies you had to develop around that, the choices your group was forced to make.
In my opinion it's what made it different, fun, and challenging.
If you remove this aspect or make it trivial, Salvage won't be particularly different from any other event already in-game, aside from the fact it would drop different items of course.

[Trisscar]

*Snip*

Knowing Square, the new gear and upgraded Salvage armors aren't going to be significantly better than what Salvage already has available. However you have a tendency to dramatically increase the difficulty for minor improvement.

Since you haven't learned yet, let me spell it out for you: Don't do that.

How hard is it for you to understand that?

[Okipuit]

I have some more information to share about the content of the Salvage higher-tier expansion.

• After warping to the next floor, a lamp will be placed for voluntary Pathos unlocking
  We will be making it possible so that each player can check the lamp and select a status to be unlocked that was unlocked in the floors prior. (In order to use the lamp, certain conditions must be fulfilled on the previous floor; however, we are planning to make the conditions easy to accomplish.)
  
  The plan is not to make this the main focus of unlocking, but it is an alternative method if the necessary unlocks did not occur while defeating monsters and the aim is to secure a method for voluntary unlocking.
  
  
• Unlocking Pathos as an element of strategy
  The strategy and knowledge for which routes to take and which monsters to defeat in order to unlock statuses will be necessary just like they were for the existing Salvage content. While only the order will be random, the only difference is in the amount of monsters that are necessary to defeat, and we are planning to have a good amount of room to make use of the knowledge gained from the existing Salvage.
  
  
• Jobs that can equip the rewards
  Dancer and scholar cannot equip the rewards from the existing Salvage content. While this will not change, the revamped Salvage equipment as well as the new equipment will have dancer and scholar added to the list of jobs that can equip them. We will also be making adjustments so that the stats are compatible.
  

I think the easiest way to see how this content has changed would be to try it out first-hand on the Test Server and we are working hard to implement this. However, it seems like it is going to take some more time, so hang in there just a bit more.

[Khiinroye]

[*]Jobs that can equip the rewards
Dancer and scholar cannot equip the rewards from the existing Salvage content. While this will not change, the revamped Salvage equipment as well as the new equipment will have dancer and scholar added to the list of jobs that can equip them. We will also be making adjustments so that the stats are compatible.

What about Geomancer and Rune Knight? While those are not in the game, the devs obviously know about the workings of those jobs, as far as what is intended for them to do and what stats are useful for them. Since the enhanced salvage gear is still in the works, it would make sense to ensure that the upcoming jobs aren't left out on gear that is released in the period that we're waiting for the new expansion.

Obviously this doesn't only apply to salvage gear, but to all gear that is currently in development.

[Monchat]

What about Geomancer and Rune Knight?

They will belong to the "lolJob" category until Adoulin bring end game gear, which will certainly not be at start of the expansion.

[Kitkat]

I have some more information to share about the content of the Salvage higher-tier expansion.

• After warping to the next floor, a lamp will be placed for voluntary Pathos unlocking
  We will be making it possible so that each player can check the lamp and select a status to be unlocked that was unlocked in the floors prior. (In order to use the lamp, certain conditions must be fulfilled on the previous floor; however, we are planning to make the conditions easy to accomplish.)
  
  The plan is not to make this the main focus of unlocking, but it is an alternative method if the necessary unlocks did not occur while defeating monsters and the aim is to secure a method for voluntary unlocking.
  
  
• Unlocking Pathos as an element of strategy
  The strategy and knowledge for which routes to take and which monsters to defeat in order to unlock statuses will be necessary just like they were for the existing Salvage content. While only the order will be random, the only difference is in the amount of monsters that are necessary to defeat, and we are planning to have a good amount of room to make use of the knowledge gained from the existing Salvage.
  
  
• Jobs that can equip the rewards
  Dancer and scholar cannot equip the rewards from the existing Salvage content. While this will not change, the revamped Salvage equipment as well as the new equipment will have dancer and scholar added to the list of jobs that can equip them. We will also be making adjustments so that the stats are compatible.
  

I think the easiest way to see how this content has changed would be to try it out first-hand on the Test Server and we are working hard to implement this. However, it seems like it is going to take some more time, so hang in there just a bit more.

Wait a minute...maybe I'm misinterpreting, this but does this mean we have to unlock and re-unlock pathos each floor we go up?