[DEV1234]Lift the delay/haste cap

[Greatguardian]

Attack, pDif, dDex, and fStr are only considered during weapon skills?

wat.

[Alhanelem]

Attack, pDif, dDex, and fStr are only considered during weapon skills?

wat.

Wat is right. I don't see anyone stacking attack or STR or DEX during TP. Or maybe I haven't seen any competent DDs in years of playing.

By "considered," I mean considered by the player, not considered as in whether or not they actually have an effect.

Frankly, I'm not really sure whether to take you seriously or just assume you're trolling me, like everyone else on this forum, for personal entertainment value because I'm an easy target for it.

[Greatguardian]

Sitting around stacking STR over Haste during TP? No. Completely ignoring the value and effects of fSTR? No one with half a brain does that.

Edit: I'm not trolling anyone. Any good player who gives half a damn about their gear will be taking all of that into account and going with whatever increases overall damage the most. I'm so sorry you have an issue with crappy players ignoring important stats. Nothing's ever going to fix that.

FFXIMath became a lot easier in Abyssea because a lot of things like Accuracy, dDex, and fStr were automatically capped with cruor buffs and atmas. Gearing became a lot simpler. As soon as we moved back outside into Voidwatch, those caps became dynamic again and gearing became complex work with a lot more variables.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Depends on your definition of stacking, obviously once you're capped (or near capped) on Haste/Accuracy depending on options you don't need anymore, and can focus on other stats.

Goes right back to shit is situational.

[Alhanelem]

Completely ignoring the value and effects of fSTR? No one with half a brain does that.

Being aware of the effects of stats and actually using those stats are two entirely different things.

obviously once you're capped on Haste/Accuracy

Which is my whole point. Haste comes before everything else. No gear setup that doesn't include 26% haste or the maximum you can obtain whilst still having good accuracy can be or will ever be accepted for general purpose activity, largely because until Abyssea came along, no piece of gear that had more than 1-2% haste had much in the way of any other stats.

If you raise the maximum, the only thing that will change is the number of pieces of gear that people will have to devote to haste.

If haste on gear were eliminated, you would see a lot more diversity in the equipment worn by players. Accuracy is usually available together with other stats like STR and Attack, for instance.

[Greatguardian]

That depends entirely on context.

If you don't understand that, you're making it sound very much like you don't actually have multiple gear sets for different situations. Good players do. My Monk alone has 8 different variable "modes", each of which consisting of a set for all of my actions. You're complaining about Haste making the game "too simple" when the only simple thing is the player.

[Alhanelem]

If you don't understand that, you're making it sound very much like you don't actually have multiple gear sets for different situations

I absolutely do have different gear for different situations. The design of the game demands it. But unless you're doing something that doesn't involve meleeing, you normally max haste if at all possible whilst maintaining accuracy.

Most of the other gear sets people have are for specific job abilities, or weapon skills. Some DDs will have other special purpose sets. Key word special- not regular, general majority-of-the-time purpose.

Really, on your monk, how much of your time logged in and on the job is spent in 26% haste gear? Honest answer. and since weapon skill gear is generally only on for a split second, we'll not count that time.

The one thing I can tell you for sure is this. I've asked a lot of gear questions comparing X item that has haste and X item that doesn't, that have been responded to by elitists such as Cream_Soda (as known on this forum). The answer is dam near always "the one with haste." The more haste you have, the more effective that next percentage point is. Haste is the only stat that gets better and better for each extra point of it you have- the more of it you have, the harder it is to find a non-haste item that can compete with it.

[Greatguardian]

Does Haste beat other stats point for point? Sure, most of the time. Does that mean people have to sacrifice caring about other stats to cap it, or that other stats can't beat Haste in the same slot sometimes? No. Example: Some 2H jobs have to sacrifice capped Haste in order to maintain their 5-hit builds outside Abyssea.

If you really think good players don't take things like Attack, fStr, dDex, and Accuracy into account when gearing for Voidwatch, then you aren't dealing with good players.

Edit: Monk is ridiculously easy to cap Haste on. Such that there's absolutely 0 reason for me to not have 26% Haste at all times. Why would I give it up? What's wrong with me capping my Haste? Should I not? Does that mean that I ignore my Attack? My Accuracy? My fStr, my dDex? Does that mean I don't change gear when I hit Focus, when I hit Aggressor, or when I hit Berserk to take those effects into account?

ITT: Anyone who's capping Haste obviously doesn't give a crap about anything but Haste. Just quit, you have absolutely no ground to stand on.

[Alhanelem]

Such that there's absolutely 0 reason for me to not have 26% Haste at all times.

Because it's so easy for MNK to cap, MNK has much more leeway to get other stats without giving up haste. It's not so easy for most other jobs, which take more pieces of gear to max haste, and thus have less room for obtaining other stats.

Please give me one good example of an item without haste that is at least on par with another item in the same slot that has haste.

Anyone who's capping Haste obviously doesn't give a crap about anything but Haste.

No, I won't quit, because that's not what I said. Capping haste is the FIRST thing anyone does. I NEVER said that other stats are irrelevant- only that people only go for them AFTER haste. If you tell me that haste isn't any mainstream melee's first priority for TP gear, I'd say you're full of it.

ITT: Elitists who flame others for their own entertainment.

[Greatguardian]

Because it's so easy for MNK to cap, MNK has much more leeway to get other stats without giving up haste. It's not so easy for most other jobs.

... That's my point. But so what? 26% Haste isn't hard to get for anyone who isn't a mage. The only people with any real trouble are 2-handers who are trying to push really STP-intensive 5-hits, or SMN/SCH/BLMs. There is nothing preventing people from hitting 26% Haste and then focusing on other stats in the rest of their gear. There are different combinations of gear that can be used to hit max Haste too =/.

I really don't see your point. Oh no, capping Haste obviously means that all other stats are worthless. Right.

Edit: You're incorrigible. Throw around generalizations all you like. Capping Haste first may not always be the best way to go as the game stands right now. It takes a good player who actually gives a damn to tell the difference. Thing is? Capping Haste just isn't that hard anyways.