[Job Adjustmentｓ Manifesto] RDM Suggestions

[Hyrist]

Oh he does, but he spends all his time in HNM camps, Voidwatch, etc. Which means he's never in situations in which he would melee.

As goes for melee, I would like to see a native Double Attack trait (maybe...) and an enspell that is actually effected by MAB AND Enhancing Skill. Making the weapon actually glow (like Sarasinger) during this effect would look cool XP. More importantly, vorpal blade without having to sub a certain job would make meleeing more enjoyable...

Maybe that isn't what RDM actually NEEDS but it is something I would like to see lol

Edit: The Double Attack could come from Enspell t3. "Composure: Grants Double Attack." When casting it under the effect of composure (who wouldn't...) you get double attack. XD

I could see this. But I'd rather see a spell that would grant us this separately, one that could be cast on others in specific situations like HNMs.

I'm looking for more of a global improvement on RDM, Meleeing being a part of it not to be ignored, as any Red Mage that's not spending 98% of his time on monsters that even Blue Mage's wouldn't be Tping on would think.

There should be a use for the gear we receive, and the weapons we can aim for. Otherwise, what separates us from being a mock Scholar? And don't go picking away at individual spells I'm talking class concepts here. We have a decent Martial Skill rating and spells (and 1 Ability) that enhances them, they don't.

Idealy it should be our spells that define us further. Spells that enhance ourselves as well as others.

Red Mage should be up front on things other classes Melee on without hesitation. There's enough healing and recovery given to all other kinds of support jobs and subjobs, fodder shouldn't be a point of contention.

This absolutist idea that Red Mage should NEVER melee in ANY group kinda sickens me. HNMs, zone bosses, particularly nasty NMs and certain Mission mobs, yeah, sure backline away. (But please give us better buffs and enfeebles to do it with.) Everything else, pull out that sword, put on your melee gear and go to town.

Enhancing THAT aspect of the job shouldn't hurt anything, and broaden the situations in which they can. (Giving us a tool for Abyssea usage and low man or low difficult events to streamline things.) My idea mainly is to have a utility in the front-line that streamlines this concept. It shouldn't be all that hard or dramatic to do so.

[Aurara]

I haven't been to an HNM camp in years.

[Rayik]

"Melee-fodder, Magic-bosses"

Works for me.

[Rayik]

Unfortunately with the whole Enhancing thing, the more I think about it, it just feels almost like it's too late to really do anything to turn the tide of how the spells were distributed. We can't just get -aga version of buffs; WHM has them, and it's one of SCH's main gimmicks. A slew of new spells just bogs down the casting cycle even more. Composure only benefits the RDM, and is actually detrimental to party members(longer recast timers).

Maybe SE just needs to wake up and put the Enhancing crown on another job.

[Greatguardian]

Contrary to popular forum belief, there is a large population of extremely good Red Mages who prefer the magical aspect of the job. Preferring to play a backline does not equate to being lazy, or bandwagon. Backline Red Mages can, and really should, be extremely active.

That's what strikes so many Red mages as crazy about the melee aspect. We barely have the MP and the time to keep up with a serious casting role, that there's no way to seriously consider taking away a massive chunk of our Refresh gear (7/tick to 0 is a lot, 1166 MP/Convert assuming maxed Vert merits), the benefit of our Main/Sub slots, and our time/attention that we'd have to devote to WS'ing, Engaging, and running up to new monsters without severely detracting from our casting abilities.

Many of us don't think that drop in magical ability is anywhere near worth the mediocre melee damage we contribute, nor do we feel that exchanging magical buffs for melee buffs would be worthwhile considering, as pointed out, Red Mage has suffered from a relative lack of growth in their abilities over the past 15 levels. Red Mage still is, and always has been an extremely powerful job. I think the Devs realized that, and tried to tone it down a bit as they raised the level cap. Unfortunately, they seem to have taken that toning a wee bit far. I have little doubt that RDM will swing back up on the way to 99, though.

Good to see you got the link thing figured out. Good lord how old is that pic? Blue letter 75?

That's the point. He never Abyssea burned RDM, it was 75 before the level cap.

[Rayik]

Contrary to popular forum belief, there is a large population of extremely good Red Mages who prefer the magical aspect of the job. Preferring to play a backline does not equate to being lazy, or bandwagon. Backline Red Mages can, and really should, be extremely active.

That's what strikes so many Red mages as crazy about the melee aspect. We barely have the MP and the time to keep up with a serious casting role, that there's no way to seriously consider taking away a massive chunk of our Refresh gear (7/tick to 0 is a lot, 1166 MP/Convert assuming maxed Vert merits), the benefit of our Main/Sub slots, and our time/attention that we'd have to devote to WS'ing, Engaging, and running up to new monsters without severely detracting from our casting abilities.


Many of us don't think that drop in magical ability is anywhere near worth the mediocre melee damage we contribute, nor do we feel that exchanging magical buffs for melee buffs would be worthwhile considering, as pointed out, Red Mage has suffered from a relative lack of growth in their abilities over the past 15 levels. Red Mage still is, and always has been an extremely powerful job. I think the Devs realized that, and tried to tone it down a bit as they raised the level cap. Unfortunately, they seem to have taken that toning a wee bit far. I have little doubt that RDM will swing back up on the way to 99, though.

I see where you are coming from, and pretty much agree, but the one thing we can all agree on, is RDM is a versatile job. A WAR hits stuff. WHM's heal and buff. BLM's nuke. RDM can do all these things and more, it just really comes down to play style preference. If someone prefers the backline, that's great, but there needs to be more for those of us who prefer the frontline too, since it really is a facet of the job. Not every RDM wants it, the same way not every RDM wants to stand in the back the whole time either. For all it's potential, RDM should not be typecast into a single job role, not melee nor pure-mage.

EDIT: Basically, there is a time and place for a RDM to be in the back line casting, and a time and place to be up in the front swinging. Neither is optimal 100% of the time. But to completely ignore either of these facets of the job is to ignore what it is to be a RDM in the first place.

[Hyrist]

I haven't been to an HNM camp in years.

Take a look at the monsters your fighting and ask yourself two questions:

Is your Blue Mage, Theif(non tanking) , or Puppetmaster Tping on them?
Do you have a White Mage, Dancer, or Scholar in the party?
(In Abyssea there's a third: Have procs been made?)

If the answer to these questions is yes, then you can Melee, and probably should. The faster the monster dies, the better.

[Aurara]

Take a look at the monsters your fighting and ask yourself two questions:

Is your Blue Mage, Theif(non tanking) , or Puppetmaster Tping on them?
Do you have a White Mage, Dancer, or Scholar in the party?
(In Abyssea there's a third: Have procs been made?)

If the answer to these questions is yes, then you can Melee, and probably should. The faster the monster dies, the better.

The hilarity of this statement is incredible, you would promote meleeing on stuff like itzpapalotl, Glavoid, Chloris, APADEMAK, Pantokrator, Tunga, Ulhuadshi, and various other bosses where you could be doing something more useful than giving these mobs TP?

[Aurara]

Take a look at the monsters your fighting and ask yourself two questions:

Is your Blue Mage, Theif(non tanking) , or Puppetmaster Tping on them?
Do you have a White Mage, Dancer, or Scholar in the party?
(In Abyssea there's a third: Have procs been made?)

If the answer to these questions is yes, then you can Melee, and probably should. The faster the monster dies, the better.

Rayik let me break it down for you

Lets use Apademak for example:
1. No, my BLU THF nor PUP is TPing on them
2.We have a WHM, but not a SCH or DNC
3.No, procs have not been made because its apademak and proccing is stupid. Combine that with the fact that apademak levels up and fulms you if somebody dies(hi you or a melee because you feed it stupid amounts of TP). Protip btw Hyrist, it only weakens you if you fight it wrong, and clearly you do with that statement.

[Rayik]

Rayik let me break it down for you

Lets use Apademak for example:
1. No, my BLU THF nor PUP is TPing on them
2.We have a WHM, but not a SCH or DNC
3.No, procs have not been made because its apademak and proccing is stupid. Combine that with the fact that apademak levels up and fulms you if somebody dies(hi you or a melee because you feed it stupid amounts of TP). Protip btw Hyrist, it only weakens you if you fight it wrong, and clearly you do with that statement.

Completely missed again. 0/2. Read the comment you quoted.