[dev100x] Relic & Mythic Weapon Adjustments

[InfamousDS]

The inherent problem here is the intentional ignoring of valid arguments. Up until ~3 years ago, getting anywhere appreciable in FF required a significant amount of effort. The source for that goes even further. Bear in mind, we now get 4x (EP--)-(DC++) exp to the original design. Things are easier, and there is no respect for hard work anymore. My arguments are irrelevant to anything except time investment. Rambus wants the game to use the same tried-and-true formula that has existed since... forever. Abyssea destroyed FF as many players knew it. The first expansion (predating Empyreans), allowed any person to hit the new 80 cap in a matter of hours. The second was post Empyrean, and added new JSE that pretty much thrashed all gear beforehand. We want relics to be better because they ARE better, not because some misguided concept of hatred of the new or "its better because it takes longer". 99% of people who pull excessively high numbers do so in Abyssea-zones. If Abyssea wasn't the new core of gameplay, then I would be ok with an easy to get weapon that was at its best there. But, unfortunately, Abyssea is now where everything is at. There is a huge disadvantage to being able to kill 20+ mobs with 1 WS over not being able to kill even 1 unless it was near dead (in terms of AoE only and exp giving monsters only). Relic and Mythic are superior because Empyrean is a misused system and was meant to be the same difficulty. By overstepping how easy Abyssea is and adding in how easy it is to acquire the drops, Empyreans are now jokes with far too much power. They only inspire awe in newish players, and are to me a major nuisance when compared with everything that predates them.

Edit: Proof of concept; There are no other WS only parties except Fell Cleave, an Emp Weapon Skill. There never was UNTIL Emp Weapons came out, just like no SMN burns or manaburns (outside merit) until Level Sync. The difference between them is that Fell Cleave is supposed to be an achievement, well-earned. It isn't, whereas Level Sync is universal (which is where Emp is heading).

[Tsukino_Kaji]

We want relics to be better because they ARE better

But they're not. And they shouldn't be. They WERE good, people just need to move on to bigger and better things.
I bet if empyrean upgrade items were sellable/tradable, none of the desperatly holding onto the past threads would exist.

[Taint]

I bet if empyrean upgrade items were sellable/tradable, none of the desperatly holding onto the past threads would exist.

Many people including myself would have 5-10 Emps if the items were sellable.
Relics do take more then some mindless killing...I went 1/35 for my Yoichi test sitting on full currency for 10 months before giving up. (got test doing Apoc 90 trial 18 months later) I didn't finish a Mythic because I couldn't find a competent group to kill the 3 Toau kings, or a group that cared to. I had the alex (18k/30k barely trying), nyzul and einherjar parts done. My 90 emp was done 1/3 in LS, 1/3 with friends and 1/3 just standing near the ??? and helping randoms proc blue/red in exchange for hearts, it took a little over a week. Relics/Mythics deserve a boost because they were once and still are a major accomplishment. Emps are a dime a dozen. In my LS which has been around for years we have 1 Relic remaining and a dozen or so emps, most were done since Feb 1st. Yes the novelty of a Relic/Mythic is long gone, but the effort and accomplishment far exceeds what they are doing with Emps. And dont get me started on the 8k or so mobs I grinded through, most relics quit because of the gayness of those trials.

[Rambus]

The inherent problem here is the intentional ignoring of valid arguments. Up until ~3 years ago, getting anywhere appreciable in FF required a significant amount of effort. The source for that goes even further. Bear in mind, we now get 4x (EP--)-(DC++) exp to the original design. Things are easier, and there is no respect for hard work anymore. My arguments are irrelevant to anything except time investment. Rambus wants the game to use the same tried-and-true formula that has existed since... forever. Abyssea destroyed FF as many players knew it. The first expansion (predating Empyreans), allowed any person to hit the new 80 cap in a matter of hours. The second was post Empyrean, and added new JSE that pretty much thrashed all gear beforehand. We want relics to be better because they ARE better, not because some misguided concept of hatred of the new or "its better because it takes longer". 99% of people who pull excessively high numbers do so in Abyssea-zones. If Abyssea wasn't the new core of gameplay, then I would be ok with an easy to get weapon that was at its best there. But, unfortunately, Abyssea is now where everything is at. There is a huge disadvantage to being able to kill 20+ mobs with 1 WS over not being able to kill even 1 unless it was near dead (in terms of AoE only and exp giving monsters only). Relic and Mythic are superior because Empyrean is a misused system and was meant to be the same difficulty. By overstepping how easy Abyssea is and adding in how easy it is to acquire the drops, Empyreans are now jokes with far too much power. They only inspire awe in newish players, and are to me a major nuisance when compared with everything that predates them.

Edit: Proof of concept; There are no other WS only parties except Fell Cleave, an Emp Weapon Skill. There never was UNTIL Emp Weapons came out, just like no SMN burns or manaburns (outside merit) until Level Sync. The difference between them is that Fell Cleave is supposed to be an achievement, well-earned. It isn't, whereas Level Sync is universal (which is where Emp is heading).

Just for clarity I have no problem with bridging have and have nots. I do not mind a weapon for have nots that can get close to me or do better with better mixes of gear then me. I am talking about the weapon itself in saying this. Mythics and relics should have the capacity to outperform emps. This should be on all jobs, not this some relics outdo emps in abyssea, and some emps destroy relics in abyssea. Leaving mythics in an usless limbo unless you mean SMN staff or WHM club

Someone can correct me if my view is wrong but to me it seems people want relic weapons to be left in the dust because people think the users are stuck up, rmt, whatever else. I do not think it is right to stereotype in such a faction and i think people are using "everything new should be better" argument as a buffer from their real insecurity. I am trying to find the truth and trying to figure out what could make everyone happy. I really do not understand when people say “no emp should be best that is that” when I say relic are hard to do they should be top due to their history and I do not mind you getting close to a relic.

Fell Cleave is a 300 skill ws. That last part is confusing me. It is an Impaction, scission, detonation, does not have a level 2 or level 3 property.

Still waiting for an asnwer to my question Tsukino_Kaji

[InfamousDS]

Fell Cleave is a 300 skill ws. That last part is confusing me

That is an error on my part. I'm only intimately familiar with Dagger Magians, I know the paths for perp- and that's it for my other weapon. I just see so many people using Emp and Fell Cleave together (I know what it looks like) without actually having checked them to see the WS on it.

[Rambus]

That is an error on my part. I'm only intimately familiar with Dagger Magians, I know the paths for perp- and that's it for my other weapon. I just see so many people using Emp and Fell Cleave together (I know what it looks like) without actually having checked them to see the WS on it.

DRK and WAR can use Fell Cleave, the emp ws for GA is called Ukko's fury.

Fell Cleave is for AoE farming in abyssea but.. blu does it best XD

Cream_Soda relics are a MIN 10 days, and thats assuming you have all the money on the first day.

1>2: JP midnight
2>3: 1 week from trade
3>4: 82 hrs
4>5 : no wait

and you are assuming things, you do not know if that update is going to allow you to make relics faster, it might we do not know, like you said speculation.

relics and mythics take more work and time then emps, should be no argue to that.

Tsukino_Kaji , answer my question to show your not making a false statment:

Every expansion had it, there are too many count. In every expansion what people were using was replaced by what was new. If not, you'd still be wearing your full RSE all the time.

I disagree with that, i told you why, ball is in your court.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Still waiting for an asnwer to my question Tsukino_Kaji

Wait for an answer and not accepting the answer you were given are two differnet things.