Job Adjustments manifesto Discussion

[Korpg]

Despite SCH's superior MP conservation, the most efficient set ups preferred BLM for timeframe nukes, AoE, or stun.

Prior to 80, SCH couldn't haste.

Anyone suggesting SCH was overpowered pre-level cap change is a liar or rolls with inefficient (i.e. bad) groups.

I think he meant nukes were just as powerful as BLMs, but cost less for the same nuke (no AMII included).

[Yugl]

I think he meant nukes were just as powerful as BLMs, but cost less for the same nuke (no AMII included).

They weren't as powerful as BLMs though. BLM had much more MAB options and higher elemental magic skill (And accuracy mattered back then). In fact, sub RDM, SCH didn't have access to MAB trait II. There really was no contest as far as damage was concerned. MP efficiency is where SCH shined, but as I mentioned, access to stun/AoE/timeframe nukes often outperformed SCH's MP efficiency (Mostly useful during duration fights such as COP Wyrms).

[Merton9999]

Scholars won't be happy until they put white mages and black mages out of business. No concern ever for balance from that job's player base, especially considering how horribly overpowered scholar was at 75.

Yes, actually, the intent of every SCH is specifically to make WHM and BLM obsolete. Well, maybe that's just me - I'd be ecstatic if I never had to look at that hideous WHM AF3 again. It's unbalanced for that to be so ugly. Actually this is unbalanced:

Every day:
Me: Hey LS, I got this great new ability on SCH that could be really useful in Abyssea...
LS: Shut up and stop lying, Mord, go switch to WHM

Lots of "I wants" in that thread.

Curiously, only one of those items was ever discussed at length on the English SCH job board. Just sayin'. Guess which one...

Modus Veritas
I'll wait and see what recast and ease-of-use adjustments are made, but I'm not buying the intentional balance of the ability based on misses. Unless SE is still thinking we're trying to exploit the exponentiation possibility, which, by the way, was obvious from the ability's introduction, and not gimped until years later? Is that even possible given the relatively new window in which MV can land?

Celerity and Alacrity
Slow already affects recast on spells that are used after Celerity and Alacrity. Haste does not. Why would making Haste work with these require Slow to be examined?

Manifestation and Nukes
Is this mistranslated? Has anyone noticed spells used with manifestation to be less potent? Gimped Drains? Resisted/short enfeebles? I thought maybe I just missed it for 4 years but wiki doesn't list this either. My guess is they meant that -ga nukes are reduced per mob affected so the same adjustment would have to be made to manifestation nukes and that will take time???

Accession applying to alliance
Um, lol? Not even I expected this.

[Sasaraixx]

Manifestation and Nukes
Is this mistranslated? Has anyone noticed spells used with manifestation to be less potent? Gimped Drains? Resisted/short enfeebles?

I believe that is a mistranslation. I went back and looked at Mocchi's original post.

検討は続けていきますが、精霊光来の章で範囲化した魔法は対象が増えても効果が減衰しないので、そのまま
範囲化というわけには行かず、バランスを取るための調整が必要になります。

That says, "We are continuing to examine but spells made AoE by Manifestation do not have their effect decreased even if the targets increase. Therefore we cannot go ahead with the change to area effect in the same way. An adjustment that preserves balance will be necessary."

[Elexia]

Scholars won't be happy until they put white mages and black mages out of business. No concern ever for balance from that job's player base, especially considering how horribly overpowered scholar was at 75.

I remember when you people called us Gimped RDMs then we came in strong and bitch slapped all of you so badly you cried to daddy SE to make your jobs better.

Good times.

[Siiri]

I remember when you people called us Gimped RDMs then we came in strong and bitch slapped all of you so badly you cried to daddy SE to make your jobs better.

Good times.

After scholars cried for months just like they are now that they are underpowered? editing some of this out, I wrote in anger at her reply. Suffice to say, Elexia's quote is why scholars have been a very hated job by a lot of other mages. So many of them seem to want only to bury other mages instead of co-existing in a balance.

[Neisan_Quetz]

I remember when you people called us Gimped RDMs then we came in strong and bitch slapped all of you so badly you cried to daddy SE to make your jobs better.

Good times.

That's pretty funny considering the only two jobs less popular than Sch are COR and PUP.

Good times indeed.

[Horadrim]

That's pretty funny considering the only two jobs less popular than Sch are COR and PUP.

Good times indeed.

That's what happens when you give a job 90% of two different jobs abilities, then bump those jobs up to 150%

SCH was a great job, until WHM became God mode (which they've been needing for a while, I'll admit) and BLM became the crowned prince of Yellow Proc. SCH is -still- a good job, but as I said before, why take a pistol when you can take a cannon? Why take a medical intern when you can take an award winning doctor? SCH's far from a "gimp RDM" -- They are too unrelated to even be comparable to one another and the shallow association "because they both can cast White and Black Magic, derp!" is beneath you. The jobs are completely different.

All of that aside, SCH is unpopular now because most career SCHs were BLMs or WHMs before the jobs release and gravitated to SCH because they finally had a mage job that could get consistent invites -- now they've moved back to their original jobs because both of them are distinctly more powerful and useful in Abyssea -- also known as the only thing anyone does in FFXI anymore.

Don't even pretend like it wouldn't be the exact same scenario for RDM if it didn't have its own unique options and uses -- a luxury SCH doesn't really have.

After scholars cried for months just like they are now that they are underpowered? editing some of this out, I wrote in anger at her reply. Suffice to say, Elexia's quote is why scholars have been a very hated job by a lot of other mages. So many of them seem to want only to bury other mages instead of co-existing in a balance.

How is that any different from -anyone- else in the forum?

Every thread I see is full of people clamoring to make their job the end-all, be-all of the game -- and that's exactly why no one ever gets what they want.

No one has any respect for balance or continuity -- the moment you talk about balance to BLMs they berate you for wanting SCH to be the greatest job ever even if all you want is for the job to have -something- useful to offer. You talk about balance to WHMs and they carry on about how they spent so much time underpowered -- which wasn't fair, but honestly, powering up a job by underpowering other jobs isn't the way to fix it.

Melees do the same exactly thing -- everyone here is carrying on about how they want their job to be god mode. The stupid thing is that everyone justifies this by saying everyone else wants to be God mode too, and then acting surprised and outraged when none of us get anything of any quality or use because the feedback channels are clogged with nonsense...

[Raksha]

Lots of "I wants" in that thread.

I think they are rephrasing them.

Did anyone else notice that, except for the Modus Veritas question, this is all useless shit that no one in the english forums have actually asked for?

[Korpg]

I think they are rephrasing them.

Did anyone else notice that, except for the Modus Veritas question, this is all useless shit that no one in the english forums have actually asked for?

I saw the Manifestation to AoE question in a thread here recently.