Reopened: How can Empyrean be better than Relics?

[Neisan_Quetz]

the one information I could dig up in the Final Form Magian thread over on that other FF site said a JP test had Ukko's having an abnormally high critical rate compared to most other crit WS (Jin/Evis average +10% iirc).

[Alhanelem]

Actually this thread didn't need to be re-opened, only because it's well known that this situation is a problem.

[wish12oz]

The only testing I ever saw said at 100% tp the crit bonus is 10% on crit based WS's,
I doubt they would change it for 1 WS.
http://robonosto.blogspot.com/
It was here somewhere~

Actually this thread didn't need to be re-opened, only because it's well known that this situation is a problem.

Apparently it does need to be opened, since people somehow seem to think it is a problem, when it's not. Even inside abyssea, only 5 empyreans are 'the best' as far as DPS goes, and outside, its less then that.

[Alhanelem]

The only testing I ever saw said at 100% tp the crit bonus is 10% on crit based WS's,
I doubt they would change it for 1 WS.
http://robonosto.blogspot.com/
It was here somewhere~

Apparently it does need to be opened, since people somehow seem to think it is a problem, when it's not. Even inside abyssea, only 5 empyreans are 'the best' as far as DPS goes, and outside, its less then that.

They don't have to be "the best." If they're even within sight of "the best", then it's a problem. Empyrean weapons are not just a little bit easier to get than relics, they're easy enough that anyone with one or two friends and the right jobs can get one.

[wish12oz]

They don't have to be "the best." If they're even within sight of "the best", then it's a problem. Empyrean weapons are not just a little bit easier to get than relics, they're easy enough that anyone with one or two friends and the right jobs can get one.

I dont understand how people being able to get stuff is somehow bad, could you please explain it?

I've seen the blog but didn't his data show the crit rate for WS isn't consistent? Their test has Backhand Blow at +40%, and Rampage as possibly being +10% but also potentially lower. Raging Rush showed higher than +10% on the blog.

Rereading it they're unsure Jin's critical bonus is even as high as +10%.

Rereading, good call, been so long since I bothered to look at anything guess I was confused, lol. Only thing I ever cared about was blade jin, must of confused that with everything or something.

[Neisan_Quetz]

I've seen the blog but didn't his data show the crit rate for WS isn't consistent? Their test has Backhand Blow at +40%, and Rampage as possibly being +10% but also potentially lower. Raging Rush showed higher than +10% on the blog.

Rereading it they're unsure Jin's critical bonus is even as high as +10%.

[Byrth]

The measurement isn't immune to the fact in the title and doesn't reflect the recent dynamis changes. If relics were better, more people would make them instead of Empyreans.

Now that it's easier for Joe Schmo to get currency, any future census will reflect the relative desirability/effort of obtaining a relic. This past census reflects both Relics being inferior and relics being harder to get. Future censuses will show whether relics are still harder to get and whether they're inferior. There's no guarantee that the more difficult option has to be the best. Look at the OA2-4 weapons. They uniformly suck and are really hard to obtain, yet people still get them. I've got one myself.

tl;dr: For all we know it's balanced as intended right now and this topic is stupid.

[Vold]

tl;dr: For all we know it's balanced as intended right now and this topic is stupid.

It's obvious it was intended to go down like it did as far as I'm concerned and every relic thread to date treating the devs like they had extreme retardation going for them when they designed Empyreans has been stupid because of a lack of sense and understanding about why they had to do what they did so Empyreans have appeal for anyone to care to work on them.

Let's say Empyreans didn't exist. What would hardcore people be doing right now? Exactly right. My answer is the same exact answer: Absolutely NOTHING while they wait for the next update. Congratulations, you now understand why some Empyreans are better than relic/mythic for the time being, whoever "you" may happen to be.

If we keep this subject going for much longer the horse is going to come back to haunt us for revenge. Just sayin'.

[Alhanelem]

I dont understand how people being able to get stuff is somehow bad, could you please explain it?

Who said getting things was bad? This is about risk/difficulty/time investment vs. reward.

The better the reward is, the more challenging/time consuming/risky it should be to obtain. A relic, which is not especially easy nor quick to obtain should be a superior prize for the effort to something that can be obtained relatively quickly with little difficulty.

[wish12oz]

Who said getting things was bad? This is about risk/difficulty/time investment vs. reward.

The better the reward is, the more challenging/time consuming/risky it should be to obtain. A relic, which is not especially easy nor quick to obtain should be a superior prize for the effort to something that can be obtained relatively quickly with little difficulty.

loooooooooooooooool
you think relics are hard to get.
PROTIP: Empyreans are harder to get then relics, I would say why, but people always report my posts and they get removed when I explain how 90% of all relics are obtained, but I assure you, it's much easier to get then an empyrean. Most are obtained through buying currency, and how most make the gil to buy the currency doesn't even involve needing to be at your PC or play FFXI.

Also, by your logic mythics should be the best, empyreans second and relics last, just sayin~