Unconditional 12% Movement Speed

Dear Developers… why are things so unbalanced in this area?

This whole post began as a discussion on Ventrilo about movement speed between one of my sacks and myself. We pulled a table together. Without even looking at things like NIN boots....

Unconditional movement speed is a wonderful thing. I appreciate that we should work for it but things have gotten more and more unbalanced for certain jobs.

Any job which is wholly reliant on Herald’s gaiters from Tiamat or Crimson Cuisses from Kirin is considerably disadvantaged in comparison to others. Especially if you don’t RMT. The supply isn’t especially enormous even if you did scrape the gil together.

Mog Bonanzas aren’t cutting it. People don’t sell these shoes, they get them and hold onto them. They don’t often make it to the Auction House.

WHM/BLM/SMN/SCH all have access to Herald's Gaiters from Tiamat.

Remember we’re talking about unconditional movement speed here.

Why it is acceptable that some jobs get access to three forms of unconditional 12% movement speed and in COR’s case one of those is buyable from the Auction House when WHM/BLM/SMN/SCH only have access to gaiters?

At this point in the game paying over 10m gil for a pair of gaiters seems to contradict everything you’ve strived for by implementing Abyssea and reducing the dependence on gil. Even if a linkshell is capable of camping and killing Tiamat, the gaiters don’t always drop and the high price on them means that other members in your group are reluctant to let them go. In terms of difficulty of obtaining, I’d take a piece of Empyrean Armour or a 100% drop from an easy NM in Abyssea over a high level Wyrm whose window is huge and who doesn’t guarantee to drop, any day.

DNC gets free unconditional movement speed feet for 10mins work…

RDM/DRK/BLU/DRG/PLD all have access to Crimson/Blood Cuisses from Kirin

Please for the love of Altana improve the drop rate on Wyrmal Abjuration: Legs. My linkshell and many others are so demoralised that we’ve all but given up. We used to farm sky but it took us 3 years to see one pair of blood cuisses completed. I’ve only ever seen two pairs drop in my entire FFXI career. We capped out on Shura Togi/Kirin Osodes long before we saw a freaking pair of Cuisses. No one wants to do Kirin in shell anymore because it’s so depressing and they know it’s such a long waiting list. We’ve been up since the level cap has gone up and he’s an easy kill now but you need to collect a bunch of seals and then get lucky on the drop rate.

What’s bugging me is the inbalance. I don’t mind working hard towards a piece but for me 10-15 million gil is a ludicrously high amount to try and find and Kirin's drop rate is so low on W legs that its hard to find support for famring him.

I’ve completed Salvage sets, almost all mission lines, multiple relic sets, many many pieces of EAF etc and would work my butt off towards unconditional movement speed on my jobs but I can’t get it.

I have WHM/BLM/RDM/SCH/SMN/BRD/COR/PLD at 90. COR could buy hermes (occasionally but possible), BRD I have completed the EAF feet for. The rest? Outta luck. I had 7 of these jobs at 75 before Abyssea came out and most of them for several years.

Please improve the Wyrmal Abjuration: legs drop rate and give us alternatives for all those jobs restricted by either Kirin or Tiamat.

The only problem here is Tiamat. Kirin is EASILY done with a group of 3-5 (SMN perfect defense + 2-3 strong melee would be pretty much minimum) and with the way triggers drop now, you can get up to 4 sets of Kirin after killing just one of each of the 8 trigger nms. ONE round of trigger nms can (and usually will) net you TWO full sets of god pops. Those will usually net you FOUR Kirin pops. So what if you did like two rounds of trigger nms? Up to 8 Kirins, etc. Unless you're saying that sky is absolutely filled with people on your server. You can trio all the gods with ease at 90, you can basically duo any of the trigger nms with dd+healer, and kirin is easily 5-manned. And with the sheer amount of sets you could be burning through, the low drop-rate wouldn't be noticed. My old LS went 0/200+ on Ridill while other shells were freelotting them. It's all about luck I suppose... I don't believe that wyrmal abjuration: legs drop rate is as low as you say they are.

Atoreis from Ramuh (now Bahamut) does Kirin with no 2hrs as WHM MNK WAR. Granted the mnk and war have Verethragna and Ukonvasara respectively but it's possible if you actually want to do ALL of your Kirin sets in one sitting.

What my group (of 3 players + 2 mules) does is just go up to sky, kill whatever is up, then move on with life. It doesn't take that much time. Yes, the lottery bullshit still stands. You could spend 2 seconds popping despot or 7 hours and not pop it. But we just leave when it gets too lame. You don't need to make an entire LS event for sky but if you did I guarantee you'll make more kirin sets than you think you would have.

Once again, Tiamat seems to be the only crappy bottleneck. Tiamat won't sit around and wait specifically for YOU to claim it. Tiamat doesn't even spawn daily! Terrible.

Hermes Sandals are not an issue, they're just expensive and only because they USED to cost a lot less. They were in the 2 mil range when Dark Ixion was first introduced.

Although I do agree, there is an imbalance.

In the meantime, another easily obtainable movement speed gear for your mages are Tatsumaki Sitagoromo with movement speed 8%.

I've long since given my mule accounts my gaiters and just used the tatsumaki.

Good luck, hope this thread works out.

Trotter's Boots.

I appreciate that we seem to have had exceptionally bad luck with kirin but we really have only seen 1 pair drop as a shell.

You know you can get +8% movement pants by just doing the easy-as-all-get-out "A Shantotto Ascension" add-on. You have to select one of the three pants, but each one covers like 7 jobs. Since you seemed to focus on mage jobs, you can even get Cure Potency +5% to boot! So it may not be 12% from Herald's Gaiters, but it's something. RDM can use the mage one also instead of W. Legs. But I agree with other posters. W. Legs not that terrible to get now. Herald's Gaiters... that's just ridiculous.

A while back I suggested a new merit category with movement speed, regen and refresh values.

Burn brd to 90, it's what I did so I could run faster.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Burn brd to 90, it's what I did so I could run faster.

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She has BRD at 90, but you`d know that if you actually read the post.

sorry, I've just never seen the need for every job to have every other job's abilities. That goes for native, gained from gear, whatever. That's why there are 20 jobs instead of just 1 where you buy items/abilities to essentially just merit your character from level 1 onwards. If you want a certain job's abilities/gear, then set it as your job. You want every job to have +12% movement, ok, if all 20 have that it is referred to as "normal speed".

My bard doesn't have the ability to do 2-3k damage in a single ability, therefore SE needs to either nerf every job that does or add a 2-3k damage ability to my bard. Sounds ridiculous? Makes as much sense and is just as valid as this thread.

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Originally Posted by blowfin

She has BRD at 90, but you`d know that if you actually read the post.

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You don't have to. It can becondenced down to; Complaining. Why can I run fast on everything with no effort? Complaining. Why do I have to camp end game bosses for it? Complaining.

Go to WOG and buy sprinter's shoes for 750AN ea. Problem solved.

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You don't have to. It can becondenced down to; Complaining. Why can I run fast on everything with no effort? Complaining. Why do I have to camp end game bosses for it? Complaining.

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No, it was a question. It really boils down to this: Is there a need for gaiters, and to a lesser extent wlegs, to still be cock blocked like they are when basically every other job in the game has gained easier access to movement speed.

A little bit of balance in the other direction would be most welcome as the tables have turned quite considerably.

Honestly I dont know why people would oppose this. Gaiters are a ridiculous testament to the old ways, and they stick out like a sore thumb as an example of the problems we had before Abyss. Should we just keep it like that as a reminder of the ways things were? Some gaudy shrine to HNM shells and MPK? A testament to people who Bazaar the boots after their shell camped them twice a week?

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sorry, I've just never seen the need for every job to have every other job's abilities.

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Well thats kind of the problem in a nutshell. Thats exactly what has happened over the last few years to the jobs that had access to movement speed in the form of wlegs, gaiters and trotters. EVERYONE else got access to movement speed, and generally with easier to obtain items. While the difficulty of obtaining Gaiters etc. remained at the same level.

So if we were to go by your rationale, any job that was gifted with movement speed in the last 4 years shouldnt have it.

The list includes:
-WAR
-SAM
-BST
-MNK
-PUP
-DNC

and Im sure theres more that I havent thought of.

Hell even something as simple as making gaiters Rare/Ex and a 100% drop would go a long way, its not like you can spam Tiamat for drops and it brings it more in line with what seems reasonable in the current game.

Well most of end game is abyssea anyways so there are several atmas that give you movement speed+ so yeah, problem solved. BTW, both of the good move speed+ atmas are godsends for farming seals via quests, makes it so much faster.

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Originally Posted by Urat

Well most of end game is abyssea anyways so there are several atmas that give you movement speed+ so yeah, problem solved. BTW, both of the good move speed+ atmas are godsends for farming seals via quests, makes it so much faster.

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p1: hey which DD atma's you using?

p2: RR/apoc/ambition

p1: ambition? wtf?

p2: it's cool, urat said it was ok.

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Originally Posted by Purrs

You know you can get +8% movement pants by just doing the easy-as-all-get-out "A Shantotto Ascension" add-on. You have to select one of the three pants, but each one covers like 7 jobs. Since you seemed to focus on mage jobs, you can even get Cure Potency +5% to boot!

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I'd get 8% movement speed and the damage down stat on the Shantotto pants, if one is using them for kiting. Seems kind of pointless to get anything else.

Exactly what is the problem here? I move around fine without +12% movement speed. When I get it by putting on one of the aketons that work in the 3 cities, I barely notice a difference. And as mentioned, the Sprinter's Shoes are available for a couple hundred allied notes. What's the problem?

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Originally Posted by Zarchery

Exactly what is the problem here? I move around fine without +12% movement speed. When I get it by putting on one of the aketons that work in the 3 cities, I barely notice a difference. And as mentioned, the Sprinter's Shoes are available for a couple hundred allied notes. What's the problem?

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Probably that we want to be able to move fast somewhere other than our home nation, and without it wearing off when we take offensive action on a mob? (or when the mob takes offensive action on us)

Just a guess.

You know that only one of your 3 aketons are actually working, and that's the one for your home nation, right?

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Originally Posted by HFX7686

I'd get 8% movement speed and the damage down stat on the Shantotto pants, if one is using them for kiting. Seems kind of pointless to get anything else.

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I got -pdt and cure potency on mine (SCH can't cap cure potency easily). But I have gaiters so dont need the movement speed

So if they increased everyone's speed by 12% would the +12% movement items be useless now? Or would they add another 12% on top of that?

If it's the former that's just dumb and if it's the latter then +12% will be the new "normal speed" and you'll soon start complaining again.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

So if they increased everyone's speed by 12% would the +12% movement items be useless now? Or would they add another 12% on top of that?

If it's the former that's just dumb and if it's the latter then +12% will be the new "normal speed" and you'll soon start complaining again.

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Or they could just make all monsters run slower.

And if it's dumb for all jobs to run faster, then why is it already possible? I'll drop my gaiters when you drop yours.

make monster's speed 12% faster too. moving around in this game just takes too bleepin' long.

Either that or give us freely useable mounts that dismount us when we get aggro.

I have to say, one of my biggest complaints about FFXI is traveling/movement speed. I do have to hand it to SE, they've made some significant improvements to traveling with confluxes in Abyssea, but walking from Point A to Point B in every other area of the game is still horrifically SLOW. I'd be very happy to see the base movement speed increased.

Why not just make the necessary Kupower permanent? it wears during battle but then it gives the player a choice after the battle is done: Hoof it at the speed we have now or rest a few ticks to run faster. Then again this thread's title is saying unconditional movement speed >.>

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Originally Posted by Alpheus

Why not just make the necessary Kupower permanent? it wears during battle but then it gives the player a choice after the battle is done: Hoof it at the speed we have now or rest a few ticks to run faster. Then again this thread's title is saying unconditional movement speed >.>

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The whole point is to have movement speed that is usable in battle. This isn't just matter of convenience.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

The whole point is to have movement speed that is usable in battle. This isn't just matter of convenience.

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Didn't get that from the OP or from her subsequent posts. Came across to me as either a "jw" sorta question or as someone else put it complaining. i do sympathize with the OP since by her own account she seems to be quite the accomplished player.

SMN has Garuda's Fleet Wind.

Honestly, while I'd love movement speed as much as the next guy (and my main jobs are BLM/SMN/RDM, so definitely ones that fall into this debate) I think it's meant to be more of an achievement. As far as I can see, the only jobs that get movement speed items easily are the ones that can use Hermes' Sandals, plus NIN and arguably BRD and SAM. On the other hand, the only job that can't boost movement speed by 12% or more through gear (as far as I can see) is DNC, which gets Chocobo Jig. The rest can use Herald's Gaiters, Crimson/Blood Cuisses, or Skadi's Jambeaux. Granted, not all of them want to, since THF/RNG can use Strider/Trotter Boots instead of Skadi, but you get the idea.

Which jobs that get easy movement speed (discounting ASA here, so I think this would be most easily defined as WAR/MNK/COR/PUP/BRD/SAM/NIN) have a decent combat use for it aside from escaping combat with the mob? WAR, MNK, and SAM have to be up close to deal decent damage most of the time, although Yoichinoyumi SAM is an exception. PUP could use the auto to achieve much of the same thing as movement speed boosts, albeit at the risk of losing your auto. BRD can't deal much damage anyway and NIN's ranged damage, from what I've seen, is pretty weak, which leaves COR. COR has ranged damage, and thus would get some use out of it, but it's also the least-played job in the game according to the last Census, so it probably needs the boost quite frankly.

Meanwhile, let's look at the jobs that have a harder time getting it, relying on Gaiters/WLegs/Skadi/Trotters. (Yeah, Trotter's is a bad example, but the only valid job on them for my argument is RNG.) First, Gaiters: WHM doesn't deal damage most of the time, but could use Gaiters to kite and cure simultaneously to an extent if for some reason that were ever, ever needed. BLM with gaiters is somewhat of a powerhouse, able to outrange most mobs with no trouble and then nuke them down. SMN doesn't get as much use out of them, since you could usually kite using Carby anyway, and most of your damage is from avatars. SCH, see BLM and WHM.

Next, WLegs: PLD/DRG/DRK don't really have a reason to be restricted to these and not Hermes', since none of them have significant ranged damage output. RDM could function like a BLM on these, perhaps to a slightly lesser extent due to lower nukes, while BLU using ranged spells would be pretty hard to deal with also. Lastly, Skadi/Trotter's: THF usually prefers to melee for damage, while BST would be using a bet and wouldn't need the movement speed. RNG, being primarily ranged damage, could probably get some real use out of these (shooting while kiting, methinks).

Yes, some of these arguments are fairly weak due to me only having a small amount of experience with some of the jobs involved. Sorry for that. Feel free to correct me where I'm incorrect or where there's a more valid point.

So, while extra unconditional movement speed would be nice to have, I believe the difficulty of obtaining it is fair given the amount of extra help it would be for quite a few of the jobs that have a harder time getting it.

(also, I love how COR is on three of the major sources of movement speed: Hermes', WLegs, and Skadi.)

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Originally Posted by Ironside

On the other hand, the only job that can't boost movement speed by 12% or more through gear (as far as I can see) is DNC, which gets Chocobo Jig.

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Tandava Crackows

http://www.ffxiah.com/item/11430/tandava-crackows

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Tandava Crackows

http://www.ffxiah.com/item/11430/tandava-crackows

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And now I feel like an idiot for missing that, I've seen those drop before. Thanks. XD

So, I've been watching Herald's Gaiters for some time now. I've never had the Gil to purchase it for my WHM or BLM. I was close to getting it when everyone on my server was selling them for about 6-8 million, but I was short by 2-3 million. When I had enough (for 6-8), they moved up to 9-11 million. Now they sell for 13-14 million and I'm short yet again, but can probably sell a couple of items to get it. I am kind of holding myself back from buying them right now because what if SE decides to release something for WHM and BLM that is reasonably attainable.

I've watched other jobs get their Movement Speed +12 gear, of which Aoidos' Cothrn. +1 (+2), Tandava Crackows and Danzo Sune-Ate is just insult to injury (if it was Abyssea only, I wouldn't be QQ'ing about this). Now SE makes Fajin Boots?!

I have Desert Boots +1 and it is such a pain in to stop, cast then move on. For those of you that suggest ASA pants, since when is 8% greater or equal to 12%? Show me proof and I'll shut up and get them. Sprinter's Shoes? Show me that the "quickening" wears off when you are attacked on Herald's Gaiters, and I'll stop whining.

So, SE, for your consideration, let's make an easier to get movement speed +12 item for WHM, BLM, SMN and SCH. Or maybe even a somewhat soloable BCNM that drops a rare/ex version of Herald's Gaiters.

Yes, I am complaining.

Not sure if it was mentioned since there's a lot to read here but.... Garuda got Fleet Wind....

I still don't get why you need more movement speed?
A mage who's panicing and pulling the mob is out of question cause he's just delaying the mob to be claimed by it's party, esp when the hatecap is reached.

And traveling isn't that bad anymore even before Abyssea. You can rent a chocobo for less than 500 gil, most time 120 gil.
There are several ways to reach a destination via teleportation, WoTG or outpost travel.
Even the increased stability of sneak and invis (NIN and WHM) made traveling more fun than before.

For NM camping and outclaiming - I don't need those either.

Am I that old school that I can run from A to B without complaining that certain jobs can be there faster than me?

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Originally Posted by Eldelphia

Please for the love of Altana improve the drop rate on Wyrmal Abjuration: Legs.

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As was mentioned before, one round of trigger NMs will net you eight Kirin pops. The drop rate is not nearly as bad as you make it out to be. Your LS must have had the most horrible luck I've ever seen if it took you years to get the first Cuisses (or you only did it twice in those years). Wiki states a ~25% drop rate with a very high sample, my personal experience has it a lot higher still. Over years of doing sky, we got about ~40% Wyrmal Abjuration drops off Kirin. Now, even if you go by Wiki's lower estimate, with eight Kirin pops from one round of trigger NMs, you'll get an average of two Wyrmal Abjurations from one tour of sky farming, which can even be done in one day.

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Originally Posted by Myrrh

Trotter's Boots.

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Trotter Boots. And they have the worst drop rate of all movement speed items I'm aware of, including Strider Boots, from my personal experience.

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Originally Posted by TerribleOne

For those of you that suggest ASA pants, since when is 8% greater or equal to 12%?

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It's not the same, but any movement speed bonus over 0% has a major advantage: it allows you to outrun the majority of mobs. So while it's not the same, it can be used for a lot of the same things, especially during battle (kiting was mentioned, especially in combination with PDT-8% on them).

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Originally Posted by Soranika

Not sure if it was mentioned since there's a lot to read here but.... Garuda got Fleet Wind....

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Was mentioned a few posts above yours.

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Originally Posted by Ihnako

I still don't get why you need more movement speed?

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It's about efficiency. Movement speed bonus saves you more than than you think, and not only by running. As I mentioned before, the "outrunning mobs" part makes it possible to run through almost any area without Sneak or Invisible, which saves you more time casting, especially in zones like Ro'Maeve where there's magic aggro all around, even right at the start, and additionally it saves you having Monomi and Tonko tools in your inventory, which is a major plus for me. It's also very useful for kiting, if there still are such battles. And ask a BLM75 what they could do back then with Herald's, you'll see quickly that the price tag is not just due to its rarity, but actually mainly due to its function. BLM with movement speed was godly back then.

And it's only Sneak and Invisible that got an upgrade if I recall correctly, Monomi and Tonko still only last 3min for Ichi and 5min for Ni, same for Spectral Jig, which is still retardedly short.

You know that if you could get +12% movement speed it would quickly become the new normal and you would again feel slow once you got used to it. I gotta ask, why 12%? Why not 24%, 36%, 48% or 200% or something?

So there is no solution to this non-problem.

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Originally Posted by Arcon

It's about efficiency. Movement speed bonus saves you more than than you think, and not only by running. As I mentioned before, the "outrunning mobs" part makes it possible to run through almost any area without Sneak or Invisible, which saves you more time casting, especially in zones like Ro'Maeve where there's magic aggro all around, even right at the start, and additionally it saves you having Monomi and Tonko tools in your inventory, which is a major plus for me.

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Do you know that there is something called "intentionaly" by design?
If you don't want to risk anything stay at your moghouse but don't complain that you have to use sneak/invis (spell/tools/powder/oils/JA) and that it will take inventory space and/or time.

shine

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Originally Posted by Ihnako

Do you know that there is something called "intentionaly" by design?

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Do you know what you asked?

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Originally Posted by Ihnako

I still don't get why you need more movement speed?

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You listed reasons why movement speed doesn't help. I merely provided an explanation of why and how it can help. Make of it what you want.

=\ Combat application of movement speed.... really? That's.... a rather improper argument to have for justification of how easy vs how difficult/expensive movement equipment are between jobs.

http://i43.tinypic.com/54ja8k.jpg

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As I mentioned before, the "outrunning mobs" part makes it possible to run through almost any area without Sneak or Invisible, which saves you more time casting, especially in zones like Ro'Maeve where there's magic aggro all around, even right at the start, and additionally it saves you having Monomi and Tonko tools in your inventory, which is a major plus for me.

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So you want to just bull through zones like Ro'Maeve to conserve a 3-4 seconds of casting time and/or 2 ninja tools (which is the equivilant of maybe 100 to 200 gil). You'd rather just ignore using natural tools abilities for avoiding aggro in the first place, as if sneak oils and invisi pots don't exist. It's also rather disturbing now that I remember how many people who've been playing almost as long as me not know you can overcast over invisible.
People diss Spectral Jig but all you have to do is manually remove the sneak effect before it wears and then reuse Spectral Jig without using invisible.

I can understand wanting to run faster, but just using it to bull through zones where you SHOULD be using invisible and/or sneak... can you say lazy? *Side note, if there's nin worried about inventory space and not carrying master ninja tools... I pity them.

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It's also very useful for kiting

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Jobs that are good at kite are quite capable within their means. Yet it's hard to deny that it wouldn't be useful. But then again, BLM aren't exactly hurting without these days. Sleep, Gravity and just a tiny bit of patience still goes a long way.

Call it for what it is, a side from a few jobs where movement speed is part of combat application (THF,DNC,RDM kiting large mobs for aoe leveling/farming) movement speed is mostly about convenience of travel and maybe the occasional fleeing of danger. I've lost count of how many times fleet wind from garuda help me escape the clutches of an UFO at Sea. Some things are, as Ihnako state, are intentional design.

Oh lord. Before I start tearing you a new one, please read what I said before. I merely answered Ihnako's question about what the benefits are, which you obviously agree with, otherwise you would have countered my arguments, since you seem so intensely, yet inexplicably, against my opinion. Whether or not these benefits fit your agenda or not, or even the degree to which they benefit the player is irrelevant and everyone can judge that for themselves.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

=\ Combat application of movement speed.... really? That's.... a rather improper argument to have for justification of how easy vs how difficult/expensive movement equipment are between jobs.

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Why? You didn't really name any reasons against it, other than saying that kiters can do well without it too. If that's your idea of debunking a statement, you obviously are in no position to argue. Disregarding that, I never said combat application is what it should be judged by, I only said it had combat applications. You were supposed to provide your own interpretation, not try to read one into my comment.

http://i43.tinypic.com/54ja8k.jpg

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Originally Posted by Soranika

So you want to just bull through zones like Ro'Maeve to conserve a 3-4 seconds of casting time and/or 2 ninja tools (which is the equivilant of maybe 100 to 200 gil). You'd rather just ignore using natural tools abilities for avoiding aggro in the first place, as if sneak oils and invisi pots don't exist. It's also rather disturbing now that I remember how many people who've been playing almost as long as me not know you can overcast over invisible.

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Yes, I'd rather do that. It saves time and money and most of all it saves inventory space (and even more time not having to juggle inventory items around from the satchel and sack). Not sure what overcasting has to do with it, but I don't know anyone who doesn't know that, whether they are new or old. I use items when I have to, and I don't when I don't have to. Isn't that what progress in the game is for, to make things easier for us? Why should it be different for moving around and for combat? Two aspects of the same game. For that matter, why does movement speed exist in the first place? Why do we have Chocobos? Whatever happened to walking from Sandy to Jeuno? By your logic you're a lazy bum if you warp from one conflux to the other, because SE made perfectly good pathways to take through the zone, but noooo, someone like you has to come along and feel all special and entitled to faster modes of transportation.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

People diss Spectral Jig but all you have to do is manually remove the sneak effect before it wears and then reuse Spectral Jig without using invisible.

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Good advice, which also pretty much everyone knows, but which is actually applicable in some cases, aside from the fact that it can kill you in other cases. Still, it wasn't what I was referring to. I meant the duration of the Sneak/Invisible status gained from it, again in response to Ihnako, who stated that the duration has been adjusted for NIN and WHM. I simply stated that it was only changed for WHM, that NIN didn't profit from it, and mentioned DNC along with it, because it's another job-specific form of obtaining those buffs.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

I can understand wanting to run faster, but just using it to bull through zones where you SHOULD be using invisible and/or sneak... can you say lazy? *Side note, if there's nin worried about inventory space and not carrying master ninja tools... I pity them.

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Who says you should be using Invisible and/or Sneak? Aside from you, that is. Are we exploiting a game mechanic by running through it without it? What about Flee then? You can run through entire aggressive areas with Flee, often even avoiding Bind, Sleep and Stun, which is not the case with mere movement speed increase of 12% (or even 25% for that matter). You can do whatever the game allows you to. There is no rule for what should and shouldn't be done. You can call it lazy if you want, but by the same logic I can call you lazy for using any kind of warp, Chocobo or airship.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

Jobs that are good at kite are quite capable within their means. Yet it's hard to deny that it wouldn't be useful. But then again, BLM aren't exactly hurting without these days. Sleep, Gravity and just a tiny bit of patience still goes a long way.

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True, with EXP mobs. Nevermind the myriad of important mobs that have a complete immunity to Sleep, Gravity and most other useful debuffs, mobs that movement speed gives you an actual and important edge over. And sure, kiters can do without it, on most situations, but again, it makes it easier, and isn't that what everyone strives for in combat, making fights safer and easier? Maybe it's only a handful of times when it happens, but what if life or death really do depend on those 12%? I can't speak on that one from my own experience, but considering how many near death situations I've had myself, it's entirely plausible to think that those 12% could have made a difference in some fights over the decade of FFXI's lifetime.

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Originally Posted by Soranika

Call it for what it is, a side from a few jobs where movement speed is part of combat application (THF,DNC,RDM kiting large mobs for aoe leveling/farming) movement speed is mostly about convenience of travel and maybe the occasional fleeing of danger. I've lost count of how many times fleet wind from garuda help me escape the clutches of an UFO at Sea. Some things are, as Ihnako state, are intentional design.

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Isn't that pretty much what I've been saying? What exactly was your point? Sometimes you seem to want to say that movement speed is useless, other times you say it's awesome. I don't know what you're trying to say here. As for mob-gathering, that's a valid point that works on a lot more jobs than the ones you mentioned. Just last week I did that again on my BLM, and I can tell you now it would not have been possible without, at least not in the numbers that I pulled, because even with Phalanx and capped PDT they can still hit you for considerable damage. Considering that, movement speed saved me another hour or two by being able to gather a massive number of mobs compared to only a handful, without being in grave danger. And the same thing can be done on most jobs, which is very useful for trials for example.

Tl;dr, this game is a massive time sink. Always has been and always will be. Anything you can do to save your time, no matter how little, is a welcome addition in my opinion. And that's what it is, my opinion. There are definite applications of this status boost, be it within combat or outside of that, regardless of what you make of it.

The thing is, if you give jobs that use gaiters an alternative, then you are replacing one of the main reasons for tiamat. This is counter productive, that is why they added drops for jobs that needed access to movement speed but left the jobs that can use gaiters alone. If you don't like that, get the ASA pants with movement speed, its what i did.

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Originally Posted by Arcon

Oh lord. Before I start tearing you a new one, please read what I said before.

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Stopped reading beyond that sentence so feel free to "tear" me a new one if you feel like it.

Look, the movement speed equipment is out there. There's no denying that some are harder to obtain than others, but still they exist. I'm all up for adjusting drop rate, but I don't buy any argument that's being spewed as being some justification that we all apparently must adhere to. I'll settle for the truth, "I want movement speed equipment out of convenience " Is that so hard? Sorry if I still have this mentality of "equipment like herald gaiters use to mean something."

They should give every job native access to Flee, Utsusemi, Sneak, Invisible, Gravity, Bind, Sleep, Sleega, Break, and Breakga. These are useful abilities. Why should I be discriminated against using them just because I didn't bother to level a job that could?

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Originally Posted by Concerned4FFxi

The thing is, if you give jobs that use gaiters an alternative, then you are replacing one of the main reasons for tiamat. This is counter productive, that is why they added drops for jobs that needed access to movement speed but left the jobs that can use gaiters alone. If you don't like that, get the ASA pants with movement speed, its what i did.

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That's also why they left Strider Boots alon- oh wait. That's why they left Trotter boots alon- oh wait.

The fact that Fajin Boots exist completely nullifies your point. If SE is willing to release Fajin Boots they will do the same for the other jobs. There is no going back now and if they do decide to not give the other jobs more OPTIONS then that there is:

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Originally Posted by Penn

BULLSHIT!

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Strider/Trotters were never what I call "easy" farming. For people that like to farm their items and not just buy everything in the universe, it is anything but easy to obtain. More options is always better. It relieves congestion and prevents low moral. There's always going to be a market for HG but newer movement speed items are inevitable.