So... um... When is SE going to stop jipping rdm?

Been a long time and a lot of talk about rdm getting some kind of decent buff.

Rdm needs more stuff... period.

Seen many different post and many request.

SE will you finally give us some sort of realistic answer about the coffin you put rdm in?

New spells, (includes ideas I have seen elsewhere)

Hastega (10% AoE)
Haste II (20%+)
Plague/Disease/Virus (whatever you want to call the tp depletion version)
Regain
Transform (likelyhood low, but I would love to turn someone into a frog)
Confuse
Reflect.... (been asked for millions of times, instead of saying it will break the game make it work like blink, 2 images with a 50% chance to activate, make it so you can cast on party members)
-ga enfeebles (maybe, I know it isn't rdm thing but still...)
Parry as a spell (targeted, not self buff, overwrites dodge/shield block spells)
Dodge as a spell (targeted, not self buff, overwrites parry/shield block spells)
Shield block rate as a spell (targeted, not self buff, overwrites parry/dodge spells)
shield block rate would also help SE with the concept of helping pld fixes, since at this moment it is ochain/aegis or gtfo, although I can see this becoming aegis pld and rdm or gtfo but less likely)
Dispell II, something that takes of multiple buffs
Attack down & defense down (overwrite each other, this way you can stack one of these spells with dia or bio, make these weaker say 10% def down added with bio III for attack down, of course if you use Attack down and Bio the stronger overwrites)
Newer stoneskin, maybe ironskin or something

Stronger forms of Blind, Para, Slow, Dia, Bio, Phalanx, Silence, Poison, Gravity, En-spells... cause seriously running off spells made for lvl 75 and under is kinda dead and has nothing to offer in endgame)

En-spells: need serious help, En-dark and En-light do way more than rdm en-spells and rdm was the first job that had enspells, shouldn't they be on top?

Blind/II: is nearly useless in endgame with all the acc that mobs get now.

Para/II: Seen this one land and get mean, but on NM doesn't have enough effect to bring a rdm to a party

Slow/II: still ok but could use a lvl 76-99 (i119) buffer.

Dia/II/III: Dia 3 good if you take a rdm, but at this point it doesn't offer enough for groups to want to take a rdm.

Bio/II/III: I would love to see a serious revamp on the dmg and the attack down effect from this spell. Unfortunately if for some psychotic reason you actually find a group willing to take a rdm to events, Dia is the merits needed not Bio

Phalanx: that dmg reduction cap is way low for end game content. (sucks enough pld and run get it give rdm a way to boost the reduction passed the cap.

Silence: I really don't know where I was going with this one. Maybe longer duration, silence II or something.

Most of rdm spells are pre-abyssea, and have yet to gain any real buffs. Where other jobs got plenty of buffs and reason to be taken to events rdm got left behind at lvl 75 content with lvl 75 spells.

Since the level cap lift we have received Break, Gravity II, and Addle for enfeeble spells. Two of which can be cast by other jobs the third doesn't offer enough -eva on mobs for rdm to come to events

Since cap we have received Temper, Refresh II, Regen II, gain spells, pro/shell V, and a couple of tier 4 nukes. Only 2 of those spells other jobs don't get and you can't even /sch accession those 2 spells for them to be worthwhile for parties. (temper and refresh II and refresh II still isn't enough to bring a rdm to party break out refresh II already)

Since cap lift rdm only received 9 job traits, and by 9 i include the higher tiers. Fast cast 4/5, Shield mastery/II (cause rdm is always in melee/tank crowds), Magic attack bonus, magic burst bonus, resist petrify, Magic defense bonus (and respectful tiers of them)

Can rdm get potency enhance job trait? Or magic acc job trait? Maybe a recast reduction rate on spells?

Job abilities, could use a little work.
Stymie was a fail and never should have been implemented if you ask me.
Saboteur is alright can't really complain
Spontaneity is mediocre at best. 10 minute recast for 1 instant cast was a joke with capped fast cast. Recast wasn't a bad idea. But for a 10 minute wait I would rather seen a job trait that reduces recast rates.

Seen that SE is trying to give rdm a dmg boost to give people a reason to play a job that they murdered with the sch boost, bringing out geo, and giving pld phalanx.

But the reason those jobs killed rdm isn't for magic dmg, it is for enfeebles and enhancing. That was what rdm was good for.

Nuking, can we add enfeebles to the nukes maybe?
Blizzard spells give frost & para,
Fire spells give burn & virus,
Thunder spells give shock & stun,
Earth spells give rasp & slow,
Water spells give drown & poison,
Aero spells give choke & silence
And so we don't break the game only a 10% chance to get the para, virus, stun, slow, poison, silence and the elemental debuffs will over write, i.e. drown overwrites burn, burn overwrites frost, frost overwrites choke etc.

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Originally Posted by Celoria

Rdm needs more stuff... period.

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This couldn't be any further from the truth. RDM, by definition, has tons of stuff. Maybe it could use better stuff, but again, that's heavily dependent on the context.

Personally, I'm just ecstatic that they actually put RDM on the Espial Gambison set. It's really sad, but it's a small miracle when SE lets RDM use a new medium armor set these days, even though medium armor is totally supposed to be our bread-and-butter. All I could ask for is access to better medium armor sets when Espial is inevitably blown completely out of the water by something else.

On that note, if your main concern is that RDM isn't being invited to whatever the endgame flavor of the month is at the moment, I wouldn't worry about that too much. Something else is eventually going to come along and obsolete that event, anyway.

(Note: admittedly your post was a bit tl;dr, but I stopped reading completely when I saw you suggest that we get Haste II. Just . . . no.)

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Originally Posted by Tamarsamar

I stopped reading completely when I saw you suggest that we get Haste II. Just . . . no.

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Even though it has been a while since it was last mentioned, Haste II was mentioned as being in a future update a while back, so~ we can expect it sometime.

I certainly hope not. Whoring out Hastes is positively one of the worst party experiences this game has to offer. Though not used frequently enough, at least Summoners can hypothetically simplify the process with Hastega. With Haste II combined our full Empyrean Armor set, though, you can kiss any chances of ever doing anything else goodbye~.

Rdm doesn't need stronger spells. Rdm is strong on its own. Its problem is that it can not bring anything to the table that can't be covered by another job that could do it better or at least similar. What Rdm really needs are unique spells that will give Rdm and certain direction that is different than the current setup.

Personally, I like the idea of Rdm as a functional front line mage. SE has been trying this for a long time and they failed at it. The frontline mage became either too weak in dealing damage or can not offer proper support. The only 'success' is Dancer but it's hard to argue Dancer being a 'mage'.

There are a few elements that can be unique to Rdm to allow Rdm to stay in the frontline, be effective as a DD but also good enough to be a support that people actually want.

New En-spell effect:
#1 Introduce enspell effect that reduce critical hit rate evasion (similar to Ninja's weapon Oirandori). Higher critical hit rate is a rare buff. This is an effect can allows the Rdm to stay in the front line and helps other DD to increase their damage. Similar to Dnc's Samba, this spell should not be resisted but it should have a short duration.
#2 Introduce an enspell effect that increases the target attack delay.

New Buff spell:
#1 Introduce a 'Rage' spell that will give a mild bonus to Attack while reduce Defense. Similar to Berserk but with a lower potency (roughly 12% to Atk and -12% to Def). This can be an "Aura" spell that can only be cast on the Rdm or a single target spell that can be used similar to Haste. I think having this spell with +50% in potency (roughly 20% increased in Atk) on the Rdm while under Composure effect would be necessary for Rdm to remain on the front line.
#2 Introduce a 'Fencer' spell that will increase evasion and accuracy but also increase critical damage taken. Also, allows an increased in potency when cast on the Rdm.
#3 Give Rdm and spell similar to earthen armor. This spell should be single target but persistence.
#4 Give Rdm the ability or spell to convert his MP into TP. 1MP for 1TP would be a little overpowered in some cases but 2 MP for 1 TP would be too weak to be useful.

Enhance current spells:
#1 Give equipments that increases Phalanx effect. Phalanx and Phalanx II were made with lv75 in mind. It would be ideal to have Rdm being able to increase the potency of Phalanx II to something more in line with lv119+

i love that the enspell2 line isn't even mentioned. cuz they're so bad as to be a non-factor. lets fix that?

beyond that, simple things like native dual wield, wider gear access, and smaller tweaks to spells we already have would go a long way.

for example: gravity 2 is already -40 evasion. +5 blade madrigal is +43 ACC, and an 11 hunters roll is +50. gravity 2 is already strong enough to matter if only it could land on the high tier stuff players actually care about acc/eva on. it seems SE is afraid of it's movement effect. they either need to get over that fear, or remove the movement effect so we can use the evasion effect.

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Originally Posted by Oddwaffle

Rdm doesn't need stronger spells. Rdm is strong on its own.

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RDM is strong when it comes to playing on it's own, in a party environment it has nothing to really offer that can't be covered by other jobs. SE like to think that RDM can somehow turn party members into demi-gods but when all of your spells are selfcast only, I'm not sure how they came up with that idea.

I don't see the fear of Haste II. Cycles are not what they use to be, we have so much enhancing magic duration bonus now and fast cast. If you aren't done with it in less than a minute, you're doing it wrong. Leaving you 5 minutes not cycling any of it. If anything, I'd advocate more bonuses to enhancing magic duration and more potent fast cast pieces on sets that have another use. I like that RDM is a jack of all trades, just wish it played like it was described in group content easier. The problem with hybrids in a system like this is balancing them so they don't obsolete others. But even if they did you're still being compared by other jobs.

Honestly, as I've said recently in another thread. They need to get away from making jobs unique in what they bring to a party and focus on unique play styles instead. We have 22 jobs now, no event can support them all and half of them aren't really all that desirable for most things. If they just focused on paradigms and had every job in that paradigm fulfill the need of the party/alliance similarly but play drastically different. You'd maintain game identity but wouldn't single people out on what's the newest bandwagon best job.

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Originally Posted by Tamarsamar

I certainly hope not. Whoring out Hastes is positively one of the worst party experiences this game has to offer. Though not used frequently enough, at least Summoners can hypothetically simplify the process with Hastega. With Haste II combined our full Empyrean Armor set, though, you can kiss any chances of ever doing anything else goodbye~.

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Well in all honesty, I think we have to really disagree here, in fact, I would go so far as to say this could be our greatest advantage. Going by the below part of your other post, I believe it is safe to assume that, like me, you appreciate the melee aspect to RDM as well as want to see it flourish more so that RDM may be as much use on the front lines as it is on the back.

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Originally Posted by Tamarsamar

Personally, I'm just ecstatic that they actually put RDM on the Espial Gambison set. It's really sad, but it's a small miracle when SE lets RDM use a new medium armor set these days, even though medium armor is totally supposed to be our bread-and-butter. All I could ask for is access to better medium armor sets when Espial is inevitably blown completely out of the water by something else.

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If I am correct and you do appreciate the melee aspect to RDM as I do then I would definitly say that Haste II would likely be a largely beneficial asset to the job. The reasons why are simple.

Firstly, I believe Haste II may have a longer duration. The reason why is because Refueling and Animating Wail are both able to be used in a way that makes them AoE, their duration is 5 minutes, but these effects can not be used on others until at very least level 75. Hastega from Garuda is able to get up to a max of 6 minutes and some seconds I believe, but again, this happens at later levels. The reason I bring these up is because Haste as a spell is learnt at level 40~48 which is fairly low overall, so if Haste II is around 90~99 its not to out of the question to think of it possibly being a 5 minute duration as the BLU spells are, or possibly even 6 minutes. This would be a great asset to helping not need to spam it over and over on a party.



Secondly, the Empyrean Armor you mentioned in a way that makes it sound like something that would be bad, but really its the opposite. Back in the day of Colibri parties and such we had a strict 3 minute duration with no way to enhance that, which basically forced us into a life of using just that spell with little else. The Empyrean Armor changed that, with our full set and the cape we get a 95% increase to the duration of our Haste on others, if you change out the hands for the newer Atrophy/+1 Gloves you get a 96/97% increase. At 3 minutes you are looking at a total of now 5 minutes 51~54 seconds, thats a long time, and if my first point is correct and the duration increase happens to give it a 5 minute duration, well, you're looking at a 9 minute 45~51 seconds.

The fact the Haste can/would last so long would be exactly opposite of what you said, rather than being unable to do anything else, we would have a lot of time to do other things, even at 6 minutes between when its cast and when it wears, if you have to Haste 4~8 other people thats only 30 seconds overall cast time which leaves 5 and a half minutes practically of time you can do anything else.

The last thing to note on this subject is that Empyrean Armor is still slated to be upgraded in the future, seeing as nearly every piece of Adoulin/ilevel gear has had Haste on it in some %, it will speed up Haste Cycles even more. Right now, we sit in nearly no recast reduction gear, casting in Empyrean +2 with no Haste or Fast Cast on it at all, while restricting our Back slot to the Cape, which leaves us only the Neck, Ears, Rings, and Belt to reduce our recast really. After the update to this gear comes, we will undoubtedly get a ton of Haste on the set, and our recast will be much lower as a result.



Lastly, if we got a new Haste spell, and they continue to give us better melee gear as well as possibly do some sort of revamp for our melee power in general, which is terribly needed especially in the direction we are going with fights(RDM can only do Normal on Ark Angels really, Difficult takes an incredibly specific and hard to obtain set), then it could help make RDM a worthwhile job again. The extra Haste from a Haste II being something like 20~25% would be a help to the job, with it and some melee gear we could see RDM as a frontline job of sorts with a valuable buff it can cast with good duration and at the same time, the job doing some nice damage on its own. To me, it sounds great, it relies on SE giving RDM the ability to melee better, and most importantly in the new content, the ability to actually land attacks, but if they do it then RDM could really shine, especially with Haste II.

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Originally Posted by Doombringer

i love that the enspell2 line isn't even mentioned. cuz they're so bad as to be a non-factor. lets fix that?

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I've always said they should act like the COR's elelment shots if they are only for the first attack

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Originally Posted by Doombringer

beyond that, simple things like native dual wield, wider gear access, and smaller tweaks to spells we already have would go a long way.

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No to this, yes to the rest. RDM shouldn't have duel wield as a native trait. While they should have the Shield Mastery Trait, even how most people just sub NIN anyway.

meh, dual wield may not "smell right" on rdm thematically: but it's a thing that already exists, that would go a long way towards solving one of RDMs problems. and since DNC, THF, and BLU got it, precedent has been set. it's an easy answer with very little reason as to "why not?"


other, slightly more complicated ideas would be:

-a job ability like diffusion or accession with, about a 3 minute recast.

this would allow for one spell to be shared full-time in potency gear, but not 2 even in duration gear. (it would be close though...) the big candidate here is temper, but gain/enspell/phalanx could all be useful given the right circumstances.

and

-an enfeebling spell that DIRECTLY reduces the damage of mob special attacks.

something akin to scherzo/earthen armor. the duration/recast would need to be such that it is full-timable. this would probably work a little differently because it's on the mob and not the players, so how does it check for hp%?
i would say make it reduce ALL the monsters special attacks, but by some lower amount. 25-30% compared to scherzo/EE at 45-50%? i think this would actually be fairly well balanced since the reduced potency still means you'll want scherzo/EE sometimes, but the lack of an HP% check means it can protect you from things scherzo/EE don't.
it goes without saying that this would have to be a reliably LANDABLE spell. nobody resists scherzo.

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Originally Posted by Zeargi

No to this, yes to the rest. RDM shouldn't have duel wield as a native trait. While they should have the Shield Mastery Trait, even how most people just sub NIN anyway.

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Well while /NIN used to be used for tanking and soloing, now days its also the only possible choice for DDing, /DNC just does not give the same DW and the lack of that 10% DW is what brings it down so very far in damage, let alone any other sub that has no DW like WAR or DRK. RDM's biggest melee flaw is the lack of DW while simultaneously lacking any form of native Attack Buff, which literally means we either pick DW or Attack, and since DW is almost always the one with a higher overall DPS, NIN is always the correct choice.

The only 3 things that would really truly put RDM on the boards in general and give it some amount of acceptance would be Fencer in high levels, Dual Wield, or a spell that grants us a ton of Attack like Temper does Double Attack. Gear alone is what we are getting right now, and before this last update we lacked even that, but that alone will not put us on the board it will only make us suck a little less, so when you get right down to it, we need something else too, Dual Wield is just the best option.

it'd have to be like, a SHITLOAD of fencer though. i feel like rdm would have to end up with better fencer than warrior has (and warrior has the most)

it'd need new tiers of fencer, or just a completely reworked fencer (which may not be a bad idea really. it's kind of a useless job trait in it's current iteration.)

Well yeah thats what I meant, even if we had WAR's level of Fencer it really wouldn't beat out the power of Dual Wield, the only thing that makes it some what more redeemable on RDM is the fact we need the Attack/Accuracy boost from /WAR so with WAR99 level Fencer it might just be worth the trade off, even that would be pushing it though. I by no means meant that a lower level of Fencer would be any good, if that were the case we could just sub WAR as it is and be well enough off, but~ no, that doesn't work out sadly.

i pray to the gods if there even listening that someone from se and others take these ideas to heart. i like the way you think and can tell you are truly an end game rdm as i have been rdm on laksmi for 11 years and agree 100% the your ideas will not break the game but instead Arise RDM from the current vampire coffin i sleep in DAILY for a long time now. RDM may not be dead dead... just the walking dead for a long time........se help us out I and many are 11 years into my favorite job/game! GEO was salt on mortal wound and nothing for RDM to compete for invites so please dont continue to injure RDM where all ready gravly wounded...any more injury and NO FIX's to RDM id say SE might as well kill us off entirely because where all SUFFERING DAILY! ... that said... but dont kill rdm, ARISE us all!!!!

ya this isnt a good response from a RDM that knows what is like. you need get to endgame and RDM jupitor, mars, maximus status and then youl wonder why you cant get into anything even close to 119 less not many SCH's for (3 stun on fracture) mabey rdm be invited (course once again GEO may be on LMAO. ONCE you beed a rdm long enough to realize why we post this stuff im sure you can give better repsonce to the real problem! if your not RDM J,M,Max'd yet and not at the endgame content you really dont sleep in a coffin like the vampire RDM where talking about. once cap fascast hit ya and you got the mac sets and heals sets (cap) etc your gonna want 119 content stuff like AAHM saber and stuff. not 1 invite for me since it came out on AAHM i made 31 of my own runs knowing no one want to bring RDM. with that said saber only seen 1 time in 119 or DIFF mode (total 31 runs) again i dont know why this is so hard to get. bad enough no one takes RDM/BLU!!

i like your ideas as well but some new stuff like the dispel II mutli buff remover, haste II, and a few others really are not bad to help RDM be invited as how many can dispell like RDM or HASTE same haste RDM has. ive seen in fracture even others dispel tojil easy. whats that all about??? again RDM not needed in fracture ive seen the 3 SCH and GEO setup for mage party = many wins!! THEY never take RDM

>_>

You need to calm down, Shantaru.

so... shantaru... nobody can tell who you're talking to.

you need to quote what you're responding to, or at least name the author. also you can multiquote and respond to multiple ideas in one post, instead of rapid firing posts.

combined with english being, and forgive the assumption here, not your first language? you kinda read like an insane person <.<

i get you're prolly just excited but uh... yah dude. settle down. nobody knows what you're talking about.

sorry