The requirement for 18+ people at SoA events is a cool option, but since it's exclusive to big-party events (no low-man options), it's a huge step backwards from some of the content opportunities earlier FFXI offered (such as in Abyssea, where a small group could go seal or +2 farming).
It's much easier to coordinate and orchestrate lowman parties. They also take less time to put together, and that's a big appeal. Big 18-man events are a nice option, but for many of us that's a weekend event, and gives little to do through the week.
Some suggestions:
- Make more scaleable content where number of participants effects the rewards (proportionately).I.e. you could enter a fracture with 6 people, and get 15 plasma a kill instead of 50, (with adjusted monster levels too). This is just a quick example.
- Make specific lowman content in SoA. BCNM style or more open.
- Integrate SoA content with previous content. So for example, allow plasma to drop from big bosses in Abyssea, Voidwatch, Dynamis, Sky, older BCNM/KSNM, etc (even if a small amount). In some ways I like this suggestion the least because ideally with a new expansion you get to see the new content, but right now the irony is that many people are excluded as it is.
I'm considering low-man 3 to 6 players.
Need more lowman content in SoA
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05-23-2013, 01:39 AMOakrestNeed more lowman content in SoA
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05-23-2013, 01:44 AMMirage
Plasma from non-SoA content is dumb, but I am totally in agreement with mini-delves for smaller groups.
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05-25-2013, 01:08 AMHawklaser
As long as it doesn't end up with a 3 person minimum to attempt like assaults, all for some low man based content that is challenging.
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05-25-2013, 03:28 AMdetlef
Skirmish is a pretty low-man friendly event, but that's about it. I recall Matsui saying that Delve plasma farming was envisioned to be done by a party but until some sort of parallel fracture intended for small groups is introduced, alliance farming is the way to go.
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05-25-2013, 05:25 AMDreamin
you can farm fracture in small group, just it isn't as efficient as when you have a full alliance, that's all. since the more and faster you kill, the more plasm you get. So until there's a change in that, people will always try to get a full alliance when plasm farming.
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05-25-2013, 05:45 AMdetlefYou're also severely limited in the number of mobs you can safely pull due to the presence of NMs. If you get unlucky with NM placement your whole run could be a waste of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamin
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05-25-2013, 05:50 AMDemon6324236Not really seeing as that's why parties bring a sacrifice puller, someone to wear Twilight and die in a corner over and over for the duration, holding the NMs away from the party while a THF pulls any other NMs back to them and the DDs just kill stuff for Plasm, seeing as you get Plasm even when dead it works out for everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by detlef
Edit: If I read what you said wrong I apologize, it seems I might have. -
05-25-2013, 05:51 AMDreaminYes. I did say it's not very efficient, didn't I?Quote:
Originally Posted by detlef
If going in this small group (thinking maybe 6), you'll probably be looking at a very competent PLD with a SCH as his helper. Another SCH or WHM as the main healer and a BRD or COR as support for those and 2 DD. All just farm the main room in Morimar. Being in the main room, you wouldn't have to pull and the BRD can probably run between the PLD+SCH and the main group that would be farming in the main room. Again, it's very do-able just not very efficient at all and hence why no one in their right mind should be doing it. [But then again, if you get a bunch of crap PUGs than you'll probably be better off sticking with this small group configurations]. -
05-25-2013, 06:15 AMdetlef
Well then we pretty much have agreed from the start that it's not very good.
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05-25-2013, 06:18 AMdetlefYeah, you can do this (and I've seen people use this as a legitimate tactic for holding NMs) but my original point was that Matsui stated that plasm farming was going to be something that could be done at a PT level. If he is going to make that kind of statement, holding with Twilight gear can't be something necessary to make things worthwhile. It is a good tactic though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon6324236
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05-25-2013, 06:20 AMZagenTo further expand on this if the 2 DDs are MNKs (or any DD if you do Magic > Physical instead) you can take down Volatile Matamata for an extra 500 plasm, 6+ Airlixir/+1, and gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamin
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05-25-2013, 08:57 AMZumi
Volatile Matamata is duoable with MNK and a WHM or SCH. Probably the fastest way to farm airlixir.
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05-25-2013, 09:00 AMZagenMaking claims without proper context like this leads to people calling you a liar.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zumi
A highly pimped out MNK + Healer can duo it sure, an average MNK + Healer isn't going to come near the 2.2mil damage needed to kill it. Even when you factor in the potential nukes from the healer. 2 decent MNKs + Healer on the other hand is more plausible. -
05-25-2013, 09:02 AMZumiYou got to be kidding me. Anyone will tell you this is a joke NM. I know several people who duo box it all the time. Your hitting it for 20-40k a hit and like 80k crits.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zagen
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05-25-2013, 12:21 PMYinnythThe time limit is 20 minutes killing him out on the surface. That's enough time for you to get 2-3 shots at him taking full magic damage. Well, 2 shots because of cooldown on formless. Besides which, you can just bring a third person along and still call it low-man. I've always wanted to try kaustra on him when he's taking 128x magic damage...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zagen
As for the OP, the only real stuff you can't lowman is the end-battles. WK reives, Delve bosses. Those things require you to do other farming activities that are easily done lowman. So you do the grunt work lowman, then once you've gotten that out of your way, you find other people to come help take on the WK reive or farm inside the fracture. The majority of this update has been lowman friendly, it's just that everyone wants the best stuff in the game, so they're looking at delve and how to get as much out of delve as fast as possible, and that involves a group of 18. -
05-25-2013, 03:16 PMZagenQuote:
Originally Posted by Zumi
I know how the NM works I also know how much damage various gear level MNKs can do. Decently geared is pushing 750k-1mil in 2 magical rounds. A well geared MNK is pushing the numbers Zumi mentioned however that still only pushes them into 2.2mil in 1-2 rounds depending on luck (though that's more bad luck leading to 2 rounds).Quote:
Originally Posted by Yinnyth
As to bringing a 3rd person I did say:
Like I said failing to add proper context leads to people calling you a liar. For example had I not checked Zumi's profile I wouldn't have seen that his/her MNK falls into the "pimped MNK" range more so than decent MNK.Quote:
2 decent MNKs + Healer on the other hand is more plausible.
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05-26-2013, 12:06 PMDreaminQuote:
Originally Posted by Zagen
Zumi isn't making some baseless claims. It CAN be done. It is being DONE. Certainly isn'g going to be possible with just any MNK off the street but rather a MNK that knows what they're doing as well as having the gears to back it up with. -
05-27-2013, 08:35 AMRunespider
I think they thought the new expansion would bring back tons of players, that's why they designed it for so many.
Didn't happen though so they need to rework a lot of the content. -
05-27-2013, 09:28 AMOmnysValefor
The only problem with this thread is people's idea of lowman. I'm in a friends-only shell. We do stuff, and we join pugs as needed but we are definitely low-man, so I definitely feel your pain.
Still, if SE makes content for 10 people, the 6 man groups will feel left out, if 6, the 3 man groups. If 3... 3 is just a bit odd. I'd enjoy it, but 3 is odd.
That said, yeah, in this stage of the game, alternate instances that function similarly, but allow less people maximum would be enjoyable. I'd enjoy six man delve farming with my pals, but that would basically mean either less nm's in the zone or significant reduction in the nm's strength.
6 man naakual could be fun. Optimized for setups like Tank, Healer, [brd/whm, cor/whm, or dnc), DD, DD, DD. So that the dd could go and kill some of the fodder for buffs while the mage stuck with the tank. That is, of course, if they address the many issues with naakual. -
05-28-2013, 12:47 AMXerius
One thing that's important to remember about Abyssea is that it's lowman content now, it wasn't when it first came out and the level cap was just only raised to 80~85~90 and no one had abyssites for hints. I remember having a whole alliance wipe to Chasmic Hornet (not our best moment) a mob that can easily be soloed by many jobs now.
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05-28-2013, 07:06 AMMirage
What's that got to do with SoA lowman content?
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05-28-2013, 12:00 PMTsukino_Kaji
It's relevant if they add atma and and another 24 levels to SoA content.
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05-28-2013, 12:04 PMDemon6324236
Well really Adoulin things can get easier, I would say OP gear is the new Atma, if we get some new weapons even stronger than we have now, it will become easier, and eventually it might be low-manned, same as Abyssea was once we got more powerful Atma and characters.
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05-28-2013, 02:08 PMOmnysValeforThat's easy. His point was that abyssea wasn't designed as solo or lowman content, merely that outleveling it so far and gaining such powerful atma made absolutely none of it require more than 4 people, and 2 really is enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirage
Calling Abyssea low man content isn't that different than calling Kirin lowman content. They both are, for largely the same reason.