Dancer tank gear? Help Me Out!

So what are people's tank and I guess solo set ups(Merits included.)?
(Just finaly hit 90 before the shutdown.)

My [Full] Evasion set up. You will be wanting to make a few in between set ups since NM's accuracy will vary and once you hit the cap, no more amount of evasion will help you.
Dagger:EVA Dagger
Neck: Torero Torque
Head: Empress Hairpin (Or O-hat is fine, but since I'm capped on ACC most of the time the +AGI tacks on a few extra points of Evasion).
Hands: Denali
Body: aurore
Ring: Heed
Back: Boxer's Mantle
Legs: Charis Tights +2
Feet: Ballerines

I would recommend putting Ballerines, EVA Kila and Charis Tights +2 on your priority list since those are easy to obtain and great options to TP in (especially the tights).

Torero can be replaced by Evasion Torque if you don't have a LS to kill Pankorator for you (or if you don't want to buy one from a merc), Boxer's can be replaced by Blur Mantle, Denali Hands by Derobade mittens(but you still may want to get Denali for a -DT set later), Empress by Fugacity Beret and of course you always have the option to use EVA+ Earrings, but I've never found them necessary yet (same for getting an EVA belt).

And again, don't use your full eva set for everything, mix and match and try to get the most haste out of it while just capping your evasion.

Need to start the daggers.
Never heard of the neck, have the torque.
Have the head.
The body.
The ring.
The back.
Killed all 3 of the leg seal NMs before the shutdown, but none dropped.
Have the feet.
Add: Have Scouter's Rope back from when they were 30k.

Slither Gloves are another nice alternative for hands, since they have Subtle Blow on them. And tanking, if the mob is using less TP moves then you won't die as fast.

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Originally Posted by Jesterking

Slither Gloves are another nice alternative for hands, since they have Subtle Blow on them. And tanking, if the mob is using less TP moves then you won't die as fast.

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Appearently on Siren there were 11 Slither on AH, but they were still 1m...

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Originally Posted by Alkalinehoe

Dagger:EVA Dagger
Head: (Or O-hat is fine, but since I'm capped on ACC most of the time the +AGI tacks on a few extra points of Evasion).
Body: aurore

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FAIL!

heres my Eva set

Dagger (main hand): Fusetto+2, (offhand) Parazonium+2
Ammo: Charis feather
Head: Emperor hairpin (empress hairpin)
Neck: Evasion Torque
Earring: Brutal earring, Suppanomimi
Ring: Raja, Airy Ring
Hands: AF2 (+1)
Body: Furia vest
Back: Boxers mantle
Waist: Scouter's Rope
Legs: Charis tights +1
Feet: Emissary Boots (some ppl say Ballerinas are the same)

You dont need Eva dagger and Aurore Body is allways fail!

Haha.... Aurore body has more Evasion than your Furia Vest and probably does better damage.

People have very different philosophies about how tanks should gear, often dependent upon how good the support they're used to is. I personally feel my duty is to keep myself out of one-shotting range while I do as much damage as I can safely do.

Really though, if you want to tank on DNC, just go full DD/Haste with Haste Samba and Saber Dance up and have the WHM spam heal you like how every other DD job tanks. Keep hate with Waltzes, get rid of all -ENM gear and get +ENM for them instead. Spam heal yourself for hate and anyone else in your party. Divine Waltz II pulls a lot of hate as it is so stocking up on potency and +enm is going to staple hate on you. If you're talking about soloing, then get EVA gear if not, then don't. Best thing for tanking is a full DD/Haste Set, Enmity for Waltzes and an -MDT set and you can pretty much tank any abyssea related NM.

On note of the Slither gloves, I bet there's huge undercutting going on. My server had them at 1mil for so long and then they dropped to 450k a day later. I'd be willing to bet if you tossed a lower amount of money at them you'd get them.

In Abyssea, that's exactly what I do, except that I don't use Waltzes for Enmity. Saber Dance blocks them, and they're shitty enmity/TP anyway.

The Enmity caps are low enough anyway that if you do a bit over 6000 damage you have capped hate. In Abyssea that's approximately one self-skillchain, and outside Abyssea it's two.

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Originally Posted by Jesterking

Really though, if you want to tank on DNC, just go full DD/Haste with Haste Samba and Saber Dance up and have the WHM spam heal you like how every other DD job tanks.

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^This. Though dnc af body has -enmity still use it for waltz's if you are wondering. Dmg is your best source of hate, just do the best you can. Also, Curing waltz III is your most efficient recast to HP healed ratio cure, Especially if your Anwig salade is augmented with -2 waltz timer. Abuse it.

I Strongly recommend an Evasion build like previous posters have pointed out. Something to look into is Subtle blow gear as well, keep that in mind, i incorporate it into my evasion sets on thief and dancer whenever at all possible.

Fan Dance and Saber dance are he only 2 G2 worth meriting, No foot rise and closed position are extremely limited and can be made up with gear respectively. This is my opinion.

Tanking TP build in Abyssea for me without a Bard would be:
Twashtar/Eva Kila+2/____/Charis
AF3+2/AF3/Suppa/Brutal
AF3+2/Dusk+1/Epona's/Rajas
Blur/Twilight/AF3+2/Ballerines

If I have a co-tank, obviously I switch between that set and a full-on DD TP set. I keep a full evasion set for recovering from big TP moves. My evasion set mixes in SB:
Twashtar/Kila+2/____/Charis
Fugacity/Torero/Musical/Novia
SH+1/Slither/Heed/Rajas
Blur/Scouter's/AF3+2/Ballerines

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Originally Posted by Yoku

FAIL!

heres my Eva set

Dagger (main hand): Fusetto+2, (offhand) Parazonium+2
Ammo: Charis feather
Head: Emperor hairpin (empress hairpin)
Neck: Evasion Torque
Earring: Brutal earring, Suppanomimi
Ring: Raja, Airy Ring
Hands: AF2 (+1)
Body: Furia vest
Back: Boxers mantle
Waist: Scouter's Rope
Legs: Charis tights +1
Feet: Emissary Boots (some ppl say Ballerinas are the same)

You dont need Eva dagger and Aurore Body is allways fail!

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Um... ok?

Aurore has better evasion then your body and more DD stats.... Airy ring for Eva? lulz, Torero>Eva Torque, lolfusetto, Charis tights+1???. Emissary boots??, I dunno why you called my eva set fail when yours is worse.

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Originally Posted by Kaeoni

Fan Dance and Saber dance are he only 2 G2 worth meriting, No foot rise and closed position are extremely limited and can be made up with gear respectively. This is my opinion.

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No it's 5/5 closed possision, 2/3 No foot rise(You don't need more then that.) and 3/5 fan dance. You don't make up for closed possition with gear, you add gear on top of it. Plus, adds emnity. And spoogy? Realy? I've never waste any gear slot for 1% dual weild. Might as well drop your scouter's for a sarashi while you're at it.

Sarashi is our only access to 1% Dual Wield. Neck is 3% (and 5 SB), Suppa is 5%, and Body is 10% (and 10 SB).

I like 5/5 Saber Dance, 2/5 No Foot Rise, 2/5 Closed Position, 1/5 Fan Dance, but I'm used to having good enough support that Fan Dance is genuinely only for very severe situations where my party basically needs a break in the middle of an NM (maybe I need to backwards tank and wait for them to unweaken, etc).

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Originally Posted by Byrth

I like 5/5 Saber Dance, 2/5 No Foot Rise, 2/5 Closed Position, 1/5 Fan Dance, but I'm used to having good enough support that Fan Dance is genuinely only for very severe situations where my party basically needs a break in the middle of an NM (maybe I need to backwards tank and wait for them to unweaken, etc).

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I end the one tanking ironclad whatever while everyone else is... well, dead. So I need fan to be always up.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

I end the one tanking ironclad whatever while everyone else is... well, dead. So I need fan to be always up.

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Yeah... I'm not! If we're fighting Ironclads, generally my group is doing it for Red !! proc anyway, so I go WAR. I'm not sure I've ever fought an Ironclad on Dancer. I'm minorly interested in trying to solo Alfard on DNC. But . . . . lazzyyyy

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

No it's 5/5 closed possision, 2/3 No foot rise(You don't need more then that.) and 3/5 fan dance. You don't make up for closed possition with gear, you add gear on top of it. Plus, adds emnity. And spoogy? Realy? I've never waste any gear slot for 1% dual weild. Might as well drop your scouter's for a sarashi while you're at it.

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You're right, i worded that wrong. What i meant was, the evasion and accuracy given isn't needed. Not only that, it doesn't benefit you 24/7 in every situation and role a dancer fills, so it IS in fact limited if you do decide to merit it. This is my personal Opinion if you did not notice the last sentence i wrote.

No foot rise has no use in my opinion because there is simply no point. You need these extra steps because? Your reverse flourish is on a set timer so you are not gaining any extra TP once you begin to melee. If you're saying you need to because you can't get TP on a mob, you shouldn't have come dancer to the fight in the first place. The only benefit No foot rise gives a person is that once you begin doing said activity you instantly have 5 steps to reverse flourish after gaining 10TP. For the rest of said activity it loses its usefulness because you have TP and steps if you're doing your job right.
Furthermore Dancer has this wonderful Job ability called Presto that can be used every second step rounding out your Step maximum capacity.
The entire reason is that I can gain 5 steps about 2-5 seconds or so faster than i can reverse flourish them so having extra steps does me no good.

My point is, the only reason to have No foot rise is if you can't melee a mob, in which case you shouldn't have shown up to the fight as a dancer.

If you can justify yourself other than just saying "No" please do, otherwise i have no reason to take anything you just said into consideration.

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Originally Posted by Kaeoni

You're right, i worded that wrong. What i meant was, the evasion and accuracy given isn't needed. not only that, it doesn't benefit you 24/7 in ever situation. It is my personal Opinion if you did not notice the last sentence i wrote.

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And just because something isn't a constant effect, in my case closed possision is a near constant, don't make it something worthless.

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Originally Posted by Kaeoni

No foot rise has no use in my opinion because there is simply no point. You need these extra steps because? Your reverse flourish is on a set timer so you are not gaining any extra TP once you begin to melee. If you're saying you need to because you can't get TP on a mob, you shouldn't have come dancer to the fight in the first place. The only benefit No foot rise gives a person is that once you begin doing said activity you instantly have 5 steps to reverse flourish after gaining 10TP. For the rest of said activity it loses its usefulness because you have TP and steps if you're doing your job right.
Furthermore Dancer has this wonderful Job ability called Presto that can be used every second step rounding out your Step maximum capacity.
The entire reason is that I can gain 5 steps about 2-5 seconds or so faster than i can reverse flourish them so having extra steps does me no good.

My point is, the only reason to have No foot rise is if you can't melee a mob, in which case you shouldn't have shown up to the fight as a dancer.

If you can justify yourself other than just saying "No" please do, otherwise i have no reason to take anything you just said into consideration.

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No Foot Rise has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with TP gain. When you're standing around with no mob and no finishing moves, where are you going to get them? But on the note of TP, presto/step/foot/reverse instead of step/step.

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No Foot Rise has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with TP gain. When you're standing around with no mob and no finishing moves, where are you going to get them?

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Please tell me the situation you're describing. It's going to be very, very few where you're surrounded by no mobs. Even then, can't you just build FMs on whatever you're going after? Takes 30 secs max to 5/5...

NFR merits are just for convenience, they aren't usefull at all.

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Originally Posted by Alkalinehoe

Please tell me the situation you're describing. It's going to be very, very few where you're surrounded by no mobs. Even then, can't you just build FMs on whatever you're going after? Takes 30 secs max to 5/5...

NFR merits are just for convenience, they aren't usefull at all.

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Standing around, means not fighting, not nothing to fight. Starting of with finishing moves means starting off stonger. And how is TPing during idle unusefull?

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Standing around, means not fighting, not nothing to fight. Starting of with finishing moves means starting off stonger. And how is TPing during idle unusefull?

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Why not fight something then? =/ You get FMs before the fight, starting off "stronger" and don't have to waste merits on NFR. You could also use a regain atma if you're in Abyssea too. Though it's really not hard to pop Saber Dance before whatever you're gonna fight, do your steps/gain TP very quickly.

Again i never said Closed position was worthless, i said it was limited. therein lies the difference.

No foot Rise has a lot to do with TP gain being the only Flourish worth spending your steps on besides Violent Flourish and Reverse Flourish.
Presto/step/14sec/Evisceration/step/reverse/Evisceration/presto/step ect ect. Is generally how mine works, Though when i use anything with an animation i pair it with something else so as to maximize my Output of dmg.
Animation delay is reduced. Keep them in pairs, any higher it counts as 2 ie. 3 animations in a row.
It's also on a 3 minute timer so you can't keep that rotation up. Standing around with no mob with no finishing moves? if you took a break from exp or something why can't you keep the same rotation i just specified? why is it you're in dire need of these finishing moves exactly, you should have some TP and can get 5 finishing moves in 15 seconds once you engage a mob.

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Originally Posted by Alkalinehoe

Um... ok?

Aurore has better evasion then your body and more DD stats.... Airy ring for Eva? lulz, Torero>Eva Torque, lolfusetto, Charis tights+1???. Emissary boots??, I dunno why you called my eva set fail when yours is worse.

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If you think so! But i bet i can tank you out.

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Originally Posted by Yoku

If you think so! But i bet i can tank you out.

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Apart from the fact that I have more evasion AND more DD stats than you... I'd say you'd be losing.

Eva and DD gear is not all to be a good tank.

Speaking of which. WHat is your guys' WS sets?

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Originally Posted by Yoku

Eva and DD gear is not all to be a good tank.

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And you can gauge this through my gear? r u a wizard?

Evisceration in Abyssea: http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/169187
Rudra's in Abyssea: http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/194288 (Earring is TP Bonus +25/Atk+4)

I'm fairly sure those are current and optimal with Red Curry Buns as a Taru DNC/NIN. My offhand dagger varies based on what I'm doing and where I am.

Also, I use No Foot Rise to replace my Finishing moves so I can go Evisceration -> Striking Flourish -> NFR -> RF -> Rudra's Storm and close with the better WS.

It seems people are overlooking the positional requirement of Closed Position... But Anyways, I did 5/5 NFR because I like to have the freedom to burn through my FMs whenever I want. It's not about TP gain, although I do use it for that when I'm running around pre-fights and such. I don't use Regain Atmas anymore so I like to have TP before the fights start. But you can't deny the utility of using your FMs and TP on a WS and then getting hit with a lot of damage and being able to instantly pop NFR->RF for 87 TP (AF3+1 Gloves) and cure yourself, and with that amount of TP you can use any of the 5 Waltzes. I WS when I solo stuff, cuz I'm sick of things taking forever so I like being able to pop FMs on whatever. It's easy to get them and easier to spend them. My ACC is fine, my EVA is fine. I'd rather having something with more utility then Closed Position. I never have problems hitting things, honestly most people shouldn't at this stage in the game. I evade like crazy as it is, I have a nice evasion set that also has a lot of accuracy on it. 2 more points into Closed Position is hardly going to make a difference. You can cap out evasion and accuracy with just gear, so there's really no reason for 5/5 CP. If things really go awry, I have a -PDT/MDT set as well as Fan Dance to fall back on. Nothing wrong with blood tanking on DNC, with all the ways we have to mitigate damage.

There was more I had to say but I got distracted and forgot, I'll amend this post if I remember or post a reply if somebody reminds me.

EDIT: Here's my WS Set Currently: http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/199717 the Etoile Mantle switches with Nifty Mantle for Evisceration. DNC is what I consider my main, so I'm working on fixing my gear constantly.

STARTING THE POST with the TL/DR part: Evasion is mostly useless for Dancer tanking.

Read the post fully, don't skim, for the rest of the info. I know it's daunting, but I tried to keep it simple.

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For TP I typically go Charis +2 for everything but gloves, which are Ocelot.
Weapons are Phurba and Kila +2 (Evasion (Irony sure to follow)) And Charis Feather in ranged.
Filling in the gaps is pretty obvious, Rajas, Epona's, Twilight belt, Charis Neck, Suppa, Brutal, and Atheling.

I pop on a hunk of Evasion/fastcast/haste for casting/recasts, usually Mini Expansion Gear with Fastcast/Evasion Augs. Stuff like that.

Weaponskills are pretty straight forward too. Start with the relevant Weapnskill Gorget & Belt, and go from there for dex.

Aias Bonnet, Soil Gorget, Pixie Earring(lazy atm to get anything better), Brutal, Loki's, Charis Hands+2, Rajas, Eponas, Vigilance Mantle, Soil Belt, Tumbler Trunks, Charis+2 Feet.

I been thinking of using the Issen Hachimaki over the Aias Bonnet while in Abyssea, just because Conserve TP seems a lot more noticeable in there than 8 Str and 8 Dex... But I just can't seem to bring myself to do that yet.

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I merited 5/5 Haste Samba, Reverse Flourish Effect, Fan Dance, and No Foot Rise.
Of those only Fan Dance and No Foot Rise have really proven to be useful to me. (Being honest here..)
I always got Fan Dance up while tanking, I'm always tanking; so Haste Samba provides little benefit to me. I use Wild Flourish every 60 seconds, which makes Reverse Flourish nearly useless to me(while fighting).

But the merits I got keep me versatile. So If I am in a party, and before I pull hate(lol) I can do other stuff.

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I guess the good marker of success is what I've killed right? And normally I'd agree, but Dnc is such an annoying job, it CAN solo stuff, but there's a massive difference between 'soloing something' and 'boring something to death'... Killing Div-e Sepid is one thing... But taking 30 minutes to do so is another. I tend to gear towards the killing end of the spectrum... I usually see these 'Pink Dancers' boring things to death in way too much evasion and not enough haste(insert obvious haste bias joke here).

So what should you gear for?

When gearing to "tank" or "solo", it's really easy to lose sight of what you NEED versus what you think you need. I am reading the build people are posting here, and not to start any fires, there's a few flaws I see. All pointing to Evasion.

Outside or inside Abyssea, how much evasion you need weighs heavily on what you're fighting. If it's Tough or higher, you're dealing with a level correction that typically makes added evasion useless, as there's generally a minimum you can evade, and usually most players are already there with basic gear/buffs/job traits. It it's not tough or higher, you're fighting stuff that's EM or lower in which case you're capped on evasion practically nude. Inside Abyssea is pretty much the same story, only you add +60 Agi minimum from Crour buffs typically, and considering the mobs are VT-ish, both scales slide, but in opposition to one another.

In either case, Evasion Gear is not really needed; it DOES help, but not as much as folks think it does. a TW mob is guaranteed a 5% chance at hitting you, a Tough typically 10 - 20%, Very Tough to Incredibly Tough you're talking in the range of 30 - 60% accuracy; whether you have +5 evasion or + 3,000 evasion. It's just how the game is coded.

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Originally Posted by Frost

Read the post fully, don't skim, for the rest of the info. I know it's daunting, but I tried to keep it simple.

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Can I get an abridged version or a book an tape?

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Can I get an abridged version or a book an tape?

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Lol....

Short Story: Level Corrections make the "Your Evasion vs. Monster's Accuracy" challenge favor DD gear, in almost all cases. I.E. with normal gear, you should be at the evasion cap, or near it.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Can I get an abridged version or a book an tape?

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made me lol irl. XD

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Originally Posted by Frost

Lol....

Short Story: Level Corrections make the "Your Evasion vs. Monster's Accuracy" challenge favor DD gear, in almost all cases. I.E. with normal gear, you should be at the evasion cap, or near it.

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So we'll work in the other direction because I like closed possision. 5/5 CP and 4/4 eva merits with a pair of +20s. Where dose that leave the gear?

It depends a lot on the monster. Your best bet is to have several Evasion set levels and use whatever seems appropriate. Obviously you can't wait for a statistically significant sample size before you change (aka you'll be eyeballing) but you can probably do pretty well. You want to wear the most DD gear you can while still not having trouble keeping up shadows.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

So we'll work in the other direction because I like closed possision. 5/5 CP and 4/4 eva merits with a pair of +20s. Where dose that leave the gear?

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You can "like closed position" but why? You're not even using it. Idk if you missed the point or are just being snooty.

What's the point of asking for advice/help, if you don't even want to read said advice/help?

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Originally Posted by Frost

You can "like closed position" but why? You're not even using it.

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I think you're missing the point of I am the person constanty face-to-face with the mob so there is never a point where it is not working.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

I think you're missing the point of I am the person constanty face-to-face with the mob so there is never a point where it is not working.

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Except you're capped on accuracy and you're capped on evasion. So no, you're not using it...

If you're not looking for advice, and you're more bent of displaying the merits of your choices in the face of conflicting information fine, carry on.

But that's tantamount to one saying "What tool should I use on screws? Don't tell me to use a Screwdriver, I already want to use a hammer!"

This is one of the drawbacks of not reading what people post, I've already explained why you shouldn't typically need/use Closed Position and/or Evasion gear while tanking, but since you've glazed over it and missed the point, you just look like a fool now. The information is on this very page, if you chose not to read it fine, but it's ill advised to peruse a position that's already been proven inferior or false, especially when it's you looking for advice.

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Originally Posted by Frost

Except you're capped on accuracy and you're capped on evasion. So no, you're not using it...

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So you're saying that when my base evasion skill by job, hits it's skill cap. Then merits and gear do nothing for it.

No, what he's saying, I believe is that, once you hit a certain level of evasion, it doesn't matter how much more you put on, your evasion will stay at that level. It's like how the perfect gear Haste cap is 26%, you can stack all the haste you want and get up to 50%, but you won't swing any faster at 50% then you would if you only had 26%.