New weaponskill damage comparison

Hey just made some videos comparing the new weapon skills to current ones in terms of damage.

Ninja
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvUIYjy2OEY

Dark Knight
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5U_b6c52is

Check out the rest at my channel ^^ I'll be sure to load more asap

Did you gear swap at all for those ws? or did you use the same exact gear for both ws? did you account for the fact that the ws you're comparing have completely different stat mods? Or did you just slap on full+2, tobi+2, and go ws shit?

Lol so from these videos you are showing that no one should ever get an empy and just wait for the new WS? :D

Cause thats what it mostly looks like.

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Originally Posted by Shotaro1

Lol so from these videos you are showing that no one should ever get an empy and just wait for the new WS? :D

Cause thats what it mostly looks like.

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which is funny because the accurate testing so far seems to say the opposite is true in most cases.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

which is funny because the accurate testing so far seems to say the opposite is true in most cases.

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Yea thats what I thought. Dunno why SE would make some new Ws out shine Empy and the sort after all the work put into them.

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Originally Posted by Shotaro1

Yea thats what I thought. Dunno why SE would make some new Ws out shine Empy and the sort after all the work put into them.

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Considering all the work that went into relics, and how relics have always been the #1 weapons, the fact that Empys suddenly came from no where and kicked them from their rightful seat, almost across the board, would be why. Especially since empys are about 10x easier to get.

For weapon skills with different mods I wore the accessories that would fit the best, GS = STR, so I wore the pyrosoul accessories, Shijin Spirlal = Dex so I wore the thunder ones, etc.

Well this just shows outside abyssea, so obviously the emp ws that crit are still the best since non of the new ws crit; but for the emp ws that do not crit like torcleaver /quietus/fudo the new ws can be on par at minimum.

Besides those who have emp weapons still have the aftermatch to consider for DoT

Keep in mind as well performing test damage on EP mobs just show close to full potential due to capping fSTR, pDif and acc (for multi hit ones) with only boosting the WSC for more damage

It also failed to show Resolution has an attack penalty making it weaker than Torcleaver on harder mobs. Blade:Shun is looking to have one as well.

Not bad for showing off the fancy animations of the new ws (again...), but these need actual testing on real content that matters for us to know how good they really are. As far as I can tell, I'll still be spamming Blade: Hi, Victory Smite, and the rest.

I understand what you mean, like I said these were done on EP mobs so the damage done to mobs that really matter will be very different. Besides, who wouldn't rather use Blade Hi, VS and Ukko's Fury; especially in abyssea. It was just merely meant to display damage on EP mobs because that would show almost full damage potential (mainly for fun); for ex. I torcleaver worms in La Thiene for 5k but on an NM maybe 2k.

But thank you for informing me about the damage penalty I was not aware of that.

you're not showing full damage potential if you don't gear for the ws though D:

Testing seems to indicate a 40% attack penalty on Resolution (Great Sword). That means you need 3.75x the mob's defense in order to cap cRatio. So, for example, you'd need about 1225 attack to cap cRatio against lvl 82 Greater Colibri (compared to something like Spinning Slash which would cap cRatio at about 490 att).

Of course then you need to run numbers to see how the overall weaponskill compares with its alternatives (number of hits, WSC, and the possibility of a drk being over attack cap on other weaponskills anyway). Still, it doesn't look pretty right now.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

you're not showing full damage potential if you don't gear for the ws though D:

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Lol I never said its actual full potential, I said near/close it; of course gear swapping would make the numbers higher but don't anticipate/expect +1000 dmg for adding like 50 STR when u gear swap

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Originally Posted by Motenten

Testing seems to indicate a 40% attack penalty on Resolution (Great Sword). That means you need 3.75x the mob's defense in order to cap cRatio. So, for example, you'd need about 1225 attack to cap cRatio against lvl 82 Greater Colibri (compared to something like Spinning Slash which would cap cRatio at about 490 att).

Of course then you need to run numbers to see how the overall weaponskill compares with its alternatives (number of hits, WSC, and the possibility of a drk being over attack cap on other weaponskills anyway). Still, it doesn't look pretty right now.

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Ouch 40% penalty; that's pretty harsh D:

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Originally Posted by kumo2121

Lol I never said its actual full potential, I said near/close it; of course gear swapping would make the numbers higher but don't anticipate/expect +1000 dmg for adding like 50 STR when u gear swap

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Do you understand how WSC works? It converts a % of a given stat into your base weapon damage. These WS have 100% stat mod, so +50 str on a 100% str mod ws would effectively be the same as giving your mainhand weapon an extra 50 damage (slightly reduced due to alpha, but still). If you're not gearing for the stats, you're not even remotely close to damage potential. Not by miles. It's basically about the same as wsing in a Trainee Burin and thinking it'll be close to the same ws damage as if you were using a Kannagi... lol

Basic quicky math, assuming fSTR and pDIF are at or close to cap on TW~EP crap to determine general highball range with and without proper gear:

for 1h: pDif = 2.0
for 2h: pDif = 2.2

WS Damage = WD * PDIF = ( D + fSTR + WSC) * fTP * PDIF

For Nin: Blade: Shun using Tobi+2,
(53 (Damage) + 13 (fSTR) + WSC) * 5.0 (combined fTP of 5 hits) * 2.0 (pDif)

1: Using approximate base dex for an elvaan nin/war at 99, ~95
2: Using above base+reported gear (iga+2 set, +3 earrings, +7 rings), 95+57
3: Using above base+a fully built dex set and matching gorget/belt, 95+ (Note: Nin is a bad example here due to how most of the Iga+2 set works as an acceptable Best~3rd best choice) 95+86, fTP+0.94

1: (53 + 13 + (Floor(Floor(95 * 1.0) * 0.85))) * 5.0 * 2.0 =
(53 + 13 + 80) * 5.0 * 2.0 = ~1460 damage

2: (53 + 13 + (Floor(Floor(152 * 1.0) * 0.85))) * 5.0 * 2.0 =
(53 + 13 + 129) * 5.0 * 2.0 = ~1950 damage (note: basically, what you showed)

3: (53 + 13 + (Floor(Floor(181 * 1.0) * 0.85))) * 5.94 * 2.0 =
(53 + 13 + 153) * 5.94 * 2.0 = ~2601 damage


1000 damage difference? No. However ~650 damage difference is fairly significant, and this was without throwing in dex buffs.

4: #3, but with Boost-Dex at skill cap, Thunderstorm with Stormsurge Merits, capped Dex Merits, and an extra 6 dex from (random food that gives dex);

(53 + 13 + (Floor(Floor(234 * 1.0) * 0.85))) * 5.94 * 2.0 =
(53 + 13 + 198) * 5.94 * 2.0 = ~3136 damage.

> 1k damage difference entirely due to +dex.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Motenten

Testing seems to indicate a 40% attack penalty on Resolution (Great Sword). That means you need 3.75x the mob's defense in order to cap cRatio. So, for example, you'd need about 1225 attack to cap cRatio against lvl 82 Greater Colibri (compared to something like Spinning Slash which would cap cRatio at about 490 att).

Of course then you need to run numbers to see how the overall weaponskill compares with its alternatives (number of hits, WSC, and the possibility of a drk being over attack cap on other weaponskills anyway). Still, it doesn't look pretty right now.

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Is that Resolution or Blade: Shun? They have different descriptions, one is damage the other is attack. No ones been doing stuff on the sword WS and I really don't have the time to conduct detailed testing.

Resolution is -40%, in the links I posted in the other thread Nightfyre had Blade:Shun at roughly -25%.

Theytak, yes I do know how WSC works, I personally do gear swap when I play the game; but I didn't feel like gear swapping in the video due to the aesthetics of the jobs gear. It was meant to show, prior to my knowledge of damage penalty, that, outside abyssea, these new ws might be nice or comparable to the empy ws; for ex. how Shijin does damage around same amount as a non crit VS. Just mainly for show before people get their hands on it; they can gear swap for themselves once it goes live and personally test it with the gear they actually have.

I also did a full INT gear/ absorb INT with Entropy and it put out 2.2k once; but I highly doubt many drks have access to the best INT pieces to do such a thing. For those who, now would be a time to use that gear for this ws.