Auction house and Dynamis Money

Are there any plans to introduce these items to the auction house?

yes please, add currency to ah.

Sure, I can see it now. Byne Bills, T. Whiteshells, O. Bronze Pieces, 100's, M. Silver pieces,and Lungo Jadeshells will instantly double, triple or quadruple in price. So, no, and simply for those people who are still interested in aquiring relics.

Sounds like a bad idea.

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Originally Posted by Octaviane

Sure, I can see it now. Byne Bills, T. Whiteshells, O. Bronze Pieces, 100's, M. Silver pieces,and Lungo Jadeshells will instantly double, triple or quadruple in price. So, no, and simply for those people who are still interested in aquiring relics.

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I see this also.

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Originally Posted by Octaviane

Sure, I can see it now. Byne Bills, T. Whiteshells, O. Bronze Pieces, 100's, M. Silver pieces,and Lungo Jadeshells will instantly double, triple or quadruple in price. So, no, and simply for those people who are still interested in aquiring relics.

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Sounds like a good idea to me.

would be a pain due to stack sizes

Don't see it happening. For being an exclusive market I wouldn't like to see my relic-building friends be annoyed about the price spiking that would occur.

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Originally Posted by Quetzacoatl

Don't see it happening. For being an exclusive market I wouldn't like to see my relic-building friends be annoyed about the price spiking that would occur.

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Agreed, I myself have just started my relic weapon and currency on my server has jumped alot since most ppl don't do dyn like they use to.

When B.bills go from 7k to 10-12k since the change its harder to justify lvling the weapon but putting them on the AH will just make it even more difficult for those that are willing to take the time to actually make it to the end.

I wouldn't mind having Ancient Currency (maybe also Ancient Beastcoins) available on the Auction House. Sure, the price will probably spike for maybe a month? Of course though, there will be those dreaded undercutters, and the price will bottom out at current (as of today) or maybe even lower (before the "Neo-Dynamis" patch) prices.

I say put it on the AH. Some people buy currency, and some sell it. There is no reason for anything that can be bazaared to be restricted from the AH. It just makes comparing prices more time consuming by checking every single AFK mule in Jeuno, and to what end? Currency still gets bought and sold.

Remove the hassle. Put currency on the AH.

Does no one realize just how much of a pain in the butt it would be to actually put AC on the AH?

You only have 7 AH slots. If you have 50 Byne Bills, you're putting 7 singles up at a time. Heaven forbid you craft, or have other things that you want to sell.

Just shout to sell it for 2-3k below the going rate and someone will want to buy it in like a min.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Does no one realize just how much of a pain in the butt it would be to actually put AC on the AH?

You only have 7 AH slots. If you have 50 Byne Bills, you're putting 7 singles up at a time. Heaven forbid you craft, or have other things that you want to sell.

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They could stack currency to 12 or 99 and for 100s a simple 12 stack would suffice.

Really, prices wouldn't spike too high due to the chance of being undercut. You'd have the initial price rise but eventually prices would reach equilibrium.

You could always simply sell your currency off AH regardless of the change.

I don't think it's even possible for an item to stack to 12 or 99, just one or the other. If it stacks to 12, people who carry lots of Currency will get screwed on inventory space. If it's 99, the AH will be flooded with singles and the invisible hand of the free market will discombobulate everything.

If there's one thing I wouldn't mind seeing on the AH, it's Ancient Beastcoins; There is only one type, and they're generally only needed/used by starting players since most long-term players have their Brutals et al already. I don't feel comfortable radically altering the way Dynamis Currency is exchanged this late in the game.

I'm probably one of the few who thinks currency costs would go down if AHable. As is, the reseller market introduces a bloat I'm sure relic upgraders aren't fond of. Those sitting on a small amount of cash looking to sell tend to accept the quick sales just to unload it and be done with it since they'd otherwise need a mule to AFK bazaar or try to shout sell or AFK bazaar their main. And if looking to the AH seeing 100+ of an item listed, I imagine everyone's first instinct would be to try and undercut a little.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Sounds like a good idea to me.

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sounds like not a good idea to anyone who wants a relic. Do you really think relics should cost billions? Nothing in the game should cost billions IMO.

Billions Tahn? Get real. Quit your fear mongering, ya commie.

OK OK OK several hundred million. Ignoring the fact that more than 10-20 million is more than out of the average player's reach, what difference does it make? The point is there.

Putting these ancient currencies on the Auction House will not do anything to help with the price. It won't make the currencies cheaper. There are too many limitations with the Auction House to even justify putting the coins on AH. That said, currencies are fine as it is.

Remember people will regularly buy and sell coins en masse, especially the relic holders. Given the limitation of the Auction House, it wont' do anything to fix that. If anything, putting coins on the auction house will defeat the very purpose of currency market in the first place, due to the said limitation.

You can only sell up to 7 items. Whether they are 7 stack of items, or 7 indvidual items. Currencies stack at 99, so you can only either sell single unit currencies or all 99 at once. That said, it's not economically efficient to distribute single unit currencies on the auction house. I'm sure on average, relic buyers (and even people upgrading their Relic AFs to +1) will buy coins in any numbers, that they can afford. Bottom-line is, when it comes to single unit currencies. It will not do anything to help, period.

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They could stack currency to 12 or 99 and for 100s a simple 12 stack would suffice.

Really, prices wouldn't spike too high due to the chance of being undercut. You'd have the initial price rise but eventually prices would reach equilibrium.

You could always simply sell your currency off AH regardless of the change.

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Let's assume they even change it so you can stack the coins to 12 units. It will NOT help at all. Also, it should be noted that stacking single units to 12 will make it impossible to convert single units to 100 unit, since you can only trade 8 items at a time, stacked or not, so therefore, can only trade up to 96 units, making it impossible to convert to 100 unit. So no, absolutely not.

Now, let's even assume they do put currencies on the AH. the only type of currencies that might help would be the 100 units. IE = Lungo-Nango Jadeshell, 100 Byne bills, and Montiont Silverpieces, since those people will tend to buy in small amount, usually one or two at a time, unless the person have a hell of a lot of money.

Now, consider the 'fee' for selling the items, we'll keep it at Jeuno since that's where everyone tends to hang out at.

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Single item fee = 1% of the seller's asking price +50 gil.

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So assuming you sell a Montiont Silverpiece at 1,300,000, it will cost 13,100 gil to sell it. Even thinking of selling a stack of Montiont Silverpieces (which even if this happen, would never happen) would be scary. The fee for that would be about 643,900.

Bottomline is: The currency market as it is, is fine. It's incredibly inefficient to distribute the currencies via AH. 100 units on AH MIGHt be feasible, but If (God Forbid) this was ever done, I'd still be sticking with bazaars and shouting.

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They could stack currency to 12 or 99 and for 100s a simple 12 stack would suffice.

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Don't 100s stack to 99 already?

The auction house only offers the stack size the item already comes in.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Don't 100s stack to 99 already?

The auction house only offers the stack size the item already comes in.

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They already stack to 99, yes, and like the single units, it also needs to stay that way as well. To finish the relic for the last stage, you need to convert the 100 unit into 10,000 unit, which requires, a hundred of hundred unit currency.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

There are too many limitations with the Auction House to even justify putting the coins on AH. ...If anything, putting coins on the auction house will defeat the very purpose of currency market in the first place, due to the said limitation.

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What limitations? What "purpose" of currency? New items are added to the AH at every update. Unless you're talking about this:...

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

You can only sell up to 7 items. Whether they are 7 stack of items, or 7 indvidual items. Currencies stack at 99, so you can only either sell single unit currencies or all 99 at once.

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So I can sell a maximum of 7 items. Depending on what I'm selling, this can be more or less in Gil value than I'd sell normally anyway. What's your point? How does that "defeat" the purpose of currency? as you say.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

That said, it's not economically efficient to distribute single unit currencies on the auction house. I'm sure on average, relic buyers (and even people upgrading their Relic AFs to +1) will buy coins in any numbers, that they can afford. Bottom-line is, when it comes to single unit currencies. It will not do anything to help, period.

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So you buy single units off the AH like anything else, and buy as many as you can afford. It makes it so you don't have to check every mule in Jeuno and Beyond to get the best price. That helps, period.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

Now, let's even assume they do put currencies on the AH. the only type of currencies that might help would be the 100 units. IE = Lungo-Nango Jadeshell, 100 Byne bills, and Montiont Silverpieces, since those people will tend to buy in small amount, usually one or two at a time, unless the person have a hell of a lot of money. Now, consider the 'fee' for selling the items, we'll keep it at Jeuno since that's where everyone tends to hang out at. So assuming you sell a Montiont Silverpiece at 1,300,000, it will cost 13,100 gil to sell it.

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Welcome to the world of selling expensive things. Would I put invest 13k for a 1.3m profit? Yes. Items sell for over 1 million on the AH all the time, and I've bought and sold such things. Or, I could be smart and sell it in a home nation, and pay a lot less in fees. Putting it up on the AH gets the seller's item noticed faster and sell quicker. Putting it on the AH saves buyers time and energy.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

Even thinking of selling a stack of Montiont Silverpieces (which even if this happen, would never happen) would be scary. The fee for that would be about 643,900.

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Since this would never happen, the fee cannot be scary.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

Bottomline is: The currency market as it is, is fine. It's incredibly inefficient to distribute the currencies via AH. 100 units on AH MIGHt be feasible, but If (God Forbid) this was ever done, I'd still be sticking with bazaars and shouting.

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It's inefficient to wander around checking mules and shouting for buyers who might not be there. The AH is smart and efficient. The bazaar is fine in addition to the Auction House, but not in place of.

And while they're at it, put more things on the AH. Why not ABCs? Why not items for Empyreans? The game should make being a smart business man important again.

Being able to sell coins on the AH would result in a masive drop in price, due to the massive undercutting. I don't know why people think it would go up.

Look at what happened in FF14. At start you only had bazars, pretty much like ff11's bazars. It takes too long to check each individuals so people buy stuff whenever they see a price they like. I made Millions within a few days just selling cystals at retardedly high prices. A few weeks later they introduce the search function, making bazars pretty much an auction house. Price of crystal was divided by 10, because everyone was undercutting.

Dynamis coins on auction house is meh... seriously, id rather buy individual units off the bazaars if i wasnt buying stacks at a time, finding a mule selling is to me easier than having to click about over and over to buy stacks. Screw that seriously, not to mention it would in fact destroy the market for those who make gil off people trying to make relics. No thanks.

For those grumbling about the 99 stack, it's not like currency couldn't get the quiver treatment where you could trade a leather pouch and 12 coins to one of the goblin and get 1 pouch where, when used, gives you the 12 coins back. In terms of casual acquisition (auto-falled from Dynamis or randomly acquired in campaign), people looking to sell 99 isn't going to be all that common. And I still think the reseller market is more harmful to relic upgrading than the AH would ever be as your random Joe just won't know what people are and have been paying. Feels like resellers would fear this more because they'd be losing their suckers, and in turn, rather effortless gil.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

sounds like not a good idea to anyone who wants a relic. Do you really think relics should cost billions? Nothing in the game should cost billions IMO.

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Sounds like a good idea to ppl who farm currency for gil, though.

Don't have that much gil? Farm the currency yourself.

It would be easier to find them on the AH that's for sure. It would greatly reduce the amount of gil people make from buying low and selling high. I think the current system actually encourages people to rip each other off. There are people out there 24/7 hoovering up cheap currency and jacking up the price. Good luck to you if you have the time honestly, I'm sure you're very rich.

I think relic prices would drop to be honest and it would be much easier for people to find what currency is out there. Ancient Beastcoins don't become usable until you hit Sea so I really don't see the issue with putting them up on the AH.

I like the idea of pouches of currency, that makes a lot of sense to me.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Sounds like a good idea to ppl who farm currency for gil, though.

Don't have that much gil? Farm the currency yourself.

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Prices would likely crash or stay the same, they would certainly not go up. Right now people get away with selling it for what prices they are because its not on the AH, with the AH comes undercutting and now those 99's and singles you see in bazaars will all be flooded in 1 place, the AH, which will bring about people undercutting.

I've always wanted Currency to be AH'able, that kind of time-saver/convenience would help both sides, sellers and buyers. It would be 100x more convenient to check the AH for currency than browsing Ru'lude Bazaar's hoping to see some.

And for sellers they wouldn't need to afk-zaar in Ru'lude or mule it to sell it overnight, they could put it on the AH and forget about it.

I'm all for this addition, if only for the convenience of not having to browse hundreds of bazaars for the item i want.

For the record, I do dynamis as well.

I wouldn't want to deal with posting the currency 7 at a time or 42 at a time with my mules too much work bazaar is good enough for me as a farmer and seller of currency

The Casual-Dynamis player would have less use than those who do dynamis with groups/sell currency in larger numbers.

This would be more for the people who end up with ~200 coins a night from a Dyanamis, can easily turn those into 2 montiont's/Jades/100's and put them on the AH and continue playing, rather than worry about having to bazaar them overnight.

to be more to the point, me. I've been doing dynamis lately for currency, but windurst sucks, and all prices are the same, so i usually do Beauc or Sandy for currency, Sell what i don't need, and Keep what i do. Generally on a good run (no 100's) i can walk away with ~250 coins, being able to take 200 and put them on the AH as 100 pieces, and just use the other 50 in bazaar would take a load off my mind...

I understand it wouldn't greatly benefit every player (nothing would!) but i think it would be a convenience for some, which, if simple enough to introduce, should be enough reason for consideration! So long as its not a huge undertaking of dev time.

Allowing AHable coins would lower the price. It increases available suppy and access. Not everyone bazaars their coins and not everyone has a mule for doing so. The 7 slot restriction would do a few things. First coins would sell very fast, 2nd sellers would put coins up for sale at aggressive prices to increase their turn rate.

Everyday I see bazaars with singles or very few coins in them. (CB coins, pick up FL dyna runs etc) AHing them would add 1000s of coins to the access of all.

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So I can sell a maximum of 7 items. Depending on what I'm selling, this can be more or less in Gil value than I'd sell normally anyway. What's your point? How does that "defeat" the purpose of currency? as you say.

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Allow me to refresh you on how currencies and making relics work:

LEt's take Mandau for example. Upgrading a relic comes in several stages.

Stage 1 comes in form of the base relic weapon. In this case, Relic Dagger.

Stage 2 comes in form of Malefic Dagger, this requires 400 Byne Bills

Stage 3 comes in form of Dynamis Daggger, this requires 1400 Ordelles Bronzepieces

Stage 4 comes in form of Batardeau, this requires 6100 Tukuku Whiteshells.

Stage 5 comes in form of Mandau, the last stage, requires 10,000 byne bills.

The fact of the matter is. When you're doing Dynamis, you're going to get tons of coins if you do it right. The fact is, Being able to sell only 7 currencies at a time is way too little to even justify putting them on the auction house. Selling 99 coins, is way too much. You might as well buy 100 unit currency instead. Most people are still going to be selling coins via Bazaar because of this.

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So you buy single units off the AH like anything else, and buy as many as you can afford. It makes it so you don't have to check every mule in Jeuno and Beyond to get the best price. That helps, period.

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I get on average 200+ coins per run in Dynamis, on the daily basis. Let's say I do want to sell all the coins. Let's go hypothical with currencies. Let's say SE do allow people to sell currencies on Auction house.

Let's say I split the all the coins to everyone involved, and there are 4 people. Everyone gets 50 coins. Sure, all 4 of the people will put 7 whiteshells, myself included. I'm not gonna wait til my currencies sell then put another 7 more. I'd still going to put the currencies in my bazaar, and I'm sure many other players will as well. That said, there will still be several mules in Jeuno and beyond selling Currencies. You can either sell only 7 at a time, or 7 stacks of currencies. Again, you might as well convert the 7 stacks of currencies into 100 unit.

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Welcome to the world of selling expensive things. Would I put invest 13k for a 1.3m profit? Yes. Items sell for over 1 million on the AH all the time, and I've bought and sold such things. Or, I could be smart and sell it in a home nation, and pay a lot less in fees. Putting it up on the AH gets the seller's item noticed faster and sell quicker. Putting it on the AH saves buyers time and energy.

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People avoid selling expensive items on Auction house for that very reason. Why do you think you'll see cursed gear +1 in bazaars more so than AH. Because the cost to sell them (and repeatedly resell due to undercutters) will add up. Sure, some would sell 1 million + Np, but fees DO add up, and some expensive gears can take time to sell.

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It's inefficient to wander around checking mules and shouting for buyers who might not be there. The AH is smart and efficient. The bazaar is fine in addition to the Auction House, but not in place of.

And while they're at it, put more things on the AH. Why not ABCs? Why not items for Empyreans? The game should make being a smart business man important again.

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Look at the number of currencies required to make currencies. In the case of Mandau you need 17900 (or 14900 if you get a loan for the final 3,000)single currencies overall. Relic buyers will buy currencies en masse off the bazaars. Inefficient yes, but the auction house is more so. Sure, if this gets implemented, I will still look for currencies off the AH. However, it would make a very, very small dent in the progress because I would only expect to get very small number of currencies off the AH.

In the long run, this will make absolutely no different to the market. People will still be selling majority of currencies, via bazaars and shouts, simply for the fact that the Auction House have too many limitation to support the currencies market. It's also not going to drive the prices down or impact the prices at all because there will still be a majority of coins sold via bazaar, rather than Auction House, and it will be the bazaar selling trend that will govern the price of the AH.

Don't get me wrong, in any case, I really don't mind the addition, but I can't just seeing this making a huge different in the currencies market period, especially not for single units. However, the 100 unit might make a different. In any case, it'll be just another mean to buy currencies and make progress on relic, even if it's little. Personally I'm overall neutral on this. It won't bother me if this gets added or not.

I don't think putting coins on the AH is a good idea simply from the buying standpoint. When I upgraded my relic, I'd buy as many as I could afford to (which was usually a fairly random number) when I made some money off an event or selling something I had farmed. Sometimes it'd be 7, or 42, or 106.

The problem with the AH is whenever you get down to the single units, you'd end up having to wait 3 seconds to check if your bid was successful before you can make another bid. If I'm buying 77 it could take 15 minutes to do what took 5 minutes of bazaar hunting and buying the currency I wanted in 1 shot. Waiting to buy a stack may not make too much sense either, because if you're offsetting buying currency with your own dynamis farming, you may not need the even numbers to complete a stage, or maybe you want currency to upgrade an AF2+1, which takes less than a stack as well.

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Originally Posted by Vyvian

I don't think putting coins on the AH is a good idea simply from the buying standpoint. When I upgraded my relic, I'd buy as many as I could afford to (which was usually a fairly random number) when I made some money off an event or selling something I had farmed. Sometimes it'd be 7, or 42, or 106.

The problem with the AH is whenever you get down to the single units, you'd end up having to wait 3 seconds to check if your bid was successful before you can make another bid. If I'm buying 77 it could take 15 minutes to do what took 5 minutes of bazaar hunting and buying the currency I wanted in 1 shot. Waiting to buy a stack may not make too much sense either, because if you're offsetting buying currency with your own dynamis farming, you may not need the even numbers to complete a stage, or maybe you want currency to upgrade an AF2+1, which takes less than a stack as well.

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This makes a very valid point, and i agree with it completely.

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

This makes a very valid point, and i agree with it completely.

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Never stopped me from buying ~50 unstackable fish one at a time.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Sounds like a good idea to ppl who farm currency for gil, though.

Don't have that much gil? Farm the currency yourself.

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if its that easy to farm, then it shouldn't be worth as much as you and other currency sellers want to charge for it.

And I most certainly would not tolerate the AH fees being passed to me as the buyer when bazaars can supply the currency without those fees.

I pretty much completely agree with Panthera on this one. Adding dynamis currency to the AH would serve to facilitate trade, and that would be a Good Thing. That isn't to say that bazaaring or shout-trades won't still happen, because they will. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. People will use the AH where it is convenient for them, and will bazaar where that makes more sense. Just like they do for tons of other items now.

BTW, I say this as a linkshell leader who has sold well in excess of 1 billion gil worth of dynamis currency, so I have a pretty good idea how this particular market works.

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Originally Posted by Monchat

Being able to sell coins on the AH would result in a masive drop in price, due to the massive undercutting. I don't know why people think it would go up.

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Probably because they lack the same understanding of supply and demand that you do. Facilitating trade does not change the supply or the demand. The only thing that it will do is even out some of the variations in price, but the average will remain the same.

Just because coins are auctionable doesn't mean you have to sell them that way. You could bazaar them until you get a stack and then sell the 100 piece. Most people get 200+ a run as stated, thats 2 100 coins and the odd left over you could save or place on the AH.

I honestly want to know how people are getting 200+ a run... is there a guide somewhere? In a six person party we are averaging about 20-25 coins each...