On WoE weapons.

Now that the development team has ascertained that Empyrean weaponskills will be unlockable by getting WoE weapons to 99, it leaves one question.

Are the WoE weapons themselves getting a damage bonus similar to their R/M/E counterparts?

WoE weapons on the whole possess nowhere near the same amount of damage potential as Empyrean weapons due to stat increases and aftermath. However, WoE weapons have had very similar damage ratings compared to them, such as 99 Brunello being only 5 base damage less than 99 Almace.

I feel that people who cannot obtain the Heavy Metal/Riftcinder for a 99 Empyrean weapon and have made a level 99 WoE weapon will not benefit from the proposed change to WoE weapons.

As a request, I would propose that WoE weapons receive a damage/stat bonus that keeps them powerful weapons, yet relatively weaker than Empyrean weapons as they have been in the past.

Thank you for reading. :)

Um... WoE weapons being able to unlock the WS hurts those Emps in many cases even with the damage acc/atk (assuming ratk/racc too) increases/additions.

the empy weapons are high end weapons regardless of the WS or not. In most cases you aren't getting the empy weapon just for the WS. there's still plenty of reason to get them (hell they're arguably easier to get up through level 90 just because nobody does WoE).

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

(hell they're arguably easier to get up through level 90 just because nobody does WoE).

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You can 2box most of WoE now with the difficulty nerf from the last content update.

Not a bad alternative to finding 1500 HMP + however many dross/cinder in a post-VW FFXI. Get the WS unlocked you want from WoE weap, then move onto using it with a Delve weapon assuming they go with their current proposed thoughts. Lack of aftermath will suck though, unless Delve weapons will eventually get their own down the road on a fully-upgraded path.

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Originally Posted by Zagen

Um... WoE weapons being able to unlock the WS hurts those Emps in many cases even with the damage acc/atk (assuming ratk/racc too) increases/additions.

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How can they 'hurt' Empyrean weapons??? The WS does not make the winning formula here, if you compare a 99 WOE side by side with the 99 Empy, the Empy wins - they both have the same WS.

If you are thinking Delve weapons with Empy WSs are going to break empys, again you are wrong (until we know the full extent of what the R/E/M updates will be at least). There are many factors to consider including base dmg, + ODD Aftermath/glow etc. Everything does not hang on the WS alone.

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Originally Posted by Tarquine

If you are thinking Delve weapons with Empy WSs are going to break empys, again you are wrong (until we know the full extent of what the R/E/M updates will be at least). There are many factors to consider including base dmg, + ODD Aftermath/glow etc. Everything does not hang on the WS alone.

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No, but I can assure you, if I was going to use an Emp WS, most of the time I would rather use it with my Relic than with my Emp. Look at any of the current weapons at 99, so far as I know the Relic H2H beats Vere, with VS being stronger than SS a Relic MNK would have access to the same WS, more attack, less STR but really not that big of a deal by compare to that mass Attack and Counter spike. The same idea goes for GA, Sword, and GK, once their WS gets out and you can use them with other weapons I think the idea will be to use Emp WSs with Relic weapons when they are better than Relic and Merit options. This becomes even more of a threat once you include Mythics, Occasionally Twice and Thrice on CDC? Ukko's? Fudo? These would be insane I believe, and would easily surpass other options. I am not sure of any of it, but I am thinking thats why, I myself wanted a 99 Almace before for my RDM, now, not at all, Ill just CDC with my Excalibur and smile.

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Originally Posted by Tarquine

How can they 'hurt' Empyrean weapons??? The WS does not make the winning formula here, if you compare a 99 WOE side by side with the 99 Empy, the Empy wins - they both have the same WS.

If you are thinking Delve weapons with Empy WSs are going to break empys, again you are wrong (until we know the full extent of what the R/E/M updates will be at least). There are many factors to consider including base dmg, + ODD Aftermath/glow etc. Everything does not hang on the WS alone.

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Armageddon, Gandiva, Masamune, Almace (PLD/RDM), Hvergelmir, and Gambanteinn all lose their appeal when the weapon skill is unlocked. The stat boost, ODD, and Afterglow aren't what makes these emps appealing, it's the Weapon Skill.

Masamune and Almace still have valuable ODD attached to them.

I agree that Ranged Emps take a hit under these proposed changes but ranged Relics balance this out by being unique.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

Masamune and Almace still have valuable ODD attached to them.

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ODD is great on BLU due to how it does most of it's damage, however on PLD and RDM that's less notable especially when you factor in the alternatives of PDT ToM, Excalibur, Burtang, or Murgleis (not that I see these much) for example.

If a SAM's damage was more on the TP phase over WS I'd agree but it's not. Does it help? Sure, but not enough to ditch an X-hit build with a better GK in order to stretch out the TP phase.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

Masamune and Almace still have valuable ODD attached to them.

I agree that Ranged Emps take a hit under these proposed changes but ranged Relics balance this out by being unique.

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Almace is only good for BLU, Excalibur would be the best weapon for all 3 jobs on Almace if they could all use it and CDC with it because the DMG and the Attack on it are far more valuable for damage than the 20DEX is. As for Masa I have to disagree as well, I would think the 60 Accuracy would be farm more valuable especially given new content where people are eating Accuracy Food, something which could be avoided with that 60 Accuracy on a weapon, where as 20 Accuracy may be leaving you eating good ol Sushi. Fudo was the only advantage Masa had over other higher DMG weapons so far as I know, without that, Masamune falls to the side while the Delve GK and Amano right now would stand at the top I believe.