Kill the PS2 limitations end of the Dark Ages Era

It's not always just a matter of adding new chunks. Extending partitions in the home windows environment, is, relative to history, a fairly new thing. Usually before recent versions of windows, you had to reformat and lose all the data in a partition in order to resize it. Sony has to provide the software/firmware capable of doing this, if it isn't already.

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It's easier to hate things you know nothing about, right ?

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Except I don't know nothing about them. I didn't pull this stuff out of my behind.

Anyway, if for you, it being a matter of choice means "I'll stick with the inferior platform," by all means do so. But I can assure you not too many people will be sad if the ps2 support is ever dropped.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Feynman, the problem you are most likely having is you did not download the updated installer that is compatible with windows Vista/7, which is happily provided by SE on their website. Their support staff told you it's not supported because it isn't. It's not because it won't work- it will. It just means "We don't want to deal with this because we didn't design the game for it. It might work or it might not, but we don't know and we can't help you if you try." However, the reason you are having problems is nothing to do with this- they just couldn't tell you that simply because of your OS. Download the updated playonline viewer from the official site, and you should be able to install it just fine. (Even later collections of the game do not seem to include the updated viewer installer)

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Actually downloading and using the Windows Vista/7 compatible version is what I was told "may be causing more problems than its solving". The recommendation on the tech support forums here from a SE mod was to delete the version from the website and to not use it. The current compatible version is included in the Abyssea version Ultimate Edition. This is why I said they need to update their website. When the information online on longer reflects the correct procedure it needs to be changed.

And you're right, obviously it will work. By SE should support 64 bit machines, I mean if you call SE Support they should know how to make their software work on a 64 bit machine. The official answer from the company that makes the game should not be "go ask other players". The absurdity is that it makes them sound incompetent. "We don't know how to make it work but other players have found a way." I used the wording that it can't be run on a 64 bit machine because that is the wording the SE Support used. I was trying to outline how absurd that statement was.

The point I made on the thread I started asking for help about this problem was that if SE doesn't want to support 64 bit machines they need to include that on the system requirements page. "Square Enix makes no guarantee that FFXI can be run properly on 64 bit machines." Or something similar. To let people look at the available information put forward by SE, make sure they are buying a computer that matches the guidelines that SE says need to be followed, purchase a brand new laptop, and then be told "we won't help you" is absurd.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

It's not always just a matter of adding new chunks. Extending partitions in the home windows environment, is, relative to history, a fairly new thing. Usually before recent versions of windows, you had to reformat and lose all the data in a partition in order to resize it. Sony has to provide the software/firmware capable of doing this, if it isn't already.

Except I don't know nothing about them. I didn't pull this stuff out of my behind.

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You're comparing apples to oranges here. The APA system was chosen exactly to get around that problem. And because the stuff from SONY is aways based on UNIX it's like years ahead on file handling and database department. Of course considering proper dimensions, we're talking about a dated, old system (PS2) which managed to hold itself in the market for almost 12 years still being sold. It's impressive considering where we stand today. Also the same could be said about this game.

And I wasn't pulling anything out of your behind. I'm just hanging here with the general hatred feeling that most NA players have towards the PS2. It was definitely not specifically targeted at you. As I consider some of your points pretty reasonable and valid.

But most of the PS2 haters standpoints are based on misinformation.

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And you're right, obviously it will work. By SE should support 64 bit machines, I mean if you call SE Support they should know how to make their software work on a 64 bit machine.

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The reason they don't is on a business/official level, it doesn't make sense to support something your software wasn't designed for, whether or not it will actually work.

I somewhat agree a disclaimer would be appropriate, however I could see why they'd be hesitant to do so as well.

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I used the wording that it can't be run on a 64 bit machine because that is the wording the SE Support used.

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The only way this would be true is if you were running on a 64-bit only OS, with no emulation layer or appropriate libraries for compatability. But 64-bit versions of Windows, the platform the game is designed for, have the WoW64 emulation layer which allows 32-bit software to be compatible. Back when Windows went from 16- to 32-bit, a similar sort of system was in place (But as of windows Vista, the required libraries for that are no longer included with windows and 16-bit applications can't be run)

Whoever was writing the support handbook for the staff that answers the phone/email/chat should be smart enough to know that while it's not supported, that doesn't mean it cannot work. They shouldn't be telling you it won't work, only that they can't guarantee it will work.

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Originally Posted by Feynman

I doubt we'll see a major graphics revamp in the game if the ps2 is dropped. In the many posts where people argue for ditching the ps2 the point is made that you can run this game on the cheapest laptop available today. Upgrading the graphics will not only leave the ps2 in the dust but also people playing on these older PCs and maybe the Xbox (I'm not sure what it's graphics capabilities are but reportedly lower than the ps3).

I just switched from ps2 to pc because I think dropping the ps2 is inevitable. Though having just gone through the experience I will say that SE makes the change much more difficult than it needs to be. The playonline website is full of outdated information on how to set up the game. Following the instructions on the website "may be causing more problems than it is fixing" according to a Tech Support GM on these forums. SE also states many times on their website that you must own all game discs to install FFXI on a PC. There is no downloadable version. Really? Also if you buy a new computer forget about any help from SE. I couldn't get the game to run and the response I got on the phone with SE was "the game can't be run on a 64 bit system" followed by "other players have figured out how to make it work. Check with them but we can't help you on this end". SE needs to update their information, educate their support staff, and just drop the PS2!!! It's clear they are going to do it. There are known issues that are getting worse that they refuse to acknowledge. They blame it on PS2 user's internet connection. If that's the case why can my PC on the same connection play cs without black screen and interact with NPC's without freezing. Stop lying to your customers and just drop it already!

Good posts never die!!

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This, 100% this! Its funny that PC players QQ over the ps2 version not being dropped when in fact its been dropped for more than a year...Black screen cs lock means you can be stuck forever in the same looping cs with no fix other than logging on an xbox/pc version, or the epic freezing talking to a npc, that also very fun.

I too have switched to the Pc version because the ps2 version isn t playable anymore, but come on ppl open your eyes, the reason ps2 isn t dropped is because its a scape goat and its very convenient to blame it instead of you know investing more money on a 10year old game.

I'm fairly sure that if they could be bothered to write the software for the PS3, they would drop the PS2 in an instant. Unfortunately the SE PS3 software writing team is sat waiting for FF14 to be liked so they can finish writing software for that. That's never going to happen though, so the PS3 team will never write FFXI software, so SE won't drop PS2.

Offering Sony lovers an alternative platform to play on would keep 90% of them playing (and probably make over 50% of them happy). Dropping playstation support completely would be shooting themselves in the foot.

My thoughts anyway. With regards to the questionaire, it's possible that SE have given up on FF14 and brought the PS3 team to FFXI instead ^^ Think about it logically, releasing an upgraded graphics version for PS3 means a lot more games sold, so they'd get some money from it.

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

I'm fairly sure that if they could be bothered to write the software for the PS3, they would drop the PS2 in an instant. Unfortunately the SE PS3 software writing team is sat waiting for FF14 to be liked so they can finish writing software for that. That's never going to happen though, so the PS3 team will never write FFXI software, so SE won't drop PS2.

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Funny how FFXI is to hard to port to the PS3 and yet FFX which is based on an earlier version of the same graphics engine somehow isn't.

It is? News to me.

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Originally Posted by Mirage

It is? News to me.

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According to SE FFXI is too difficult to port to the PS3.

No i meant the part about FFX using an early version of the same engine FFXI use. First time I've heard of that, and it doesn't really seem all that likely, considering how different the games look.

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Originally Posted by Mirage

No i meant the part about FFX using an early version of the same engine FFXI use. First time I've heard of that, and it doesn't really seem all that likely, considering how different the games look.

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FFXI is almost certainly recycling code from FFX just as FFXIII recycled code from FFXI. It wouldn't make sense to throw away code that already works and start over from the ground up, especially on a notoriously difficult to program platform like the PS2.

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Originally Posted by Mirage

No i meant the part about FFX using an early version of the same engine FFXI use. First time I've heard of that, and it doesn't really seem all that likely, considering how different the games look.

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Don't be too surprised... As an example, Lineage II (NC Soft, MMORPG) runs on Unreal (1st person shooter game) engine.

On this age of "middleware" things like BINK Video(special video codec for videogames), Havok (Physics engine for visual effects), CRI Tools such ADX (Codec for Compressed audio) and a lot of other commercial authoring/middleware tools are common.

Square co. original strategy was use a year or two to develop their own in house tool-chain/game engines framework every time a major generation shift happened.
Then they would use that "framework" then to develop their current gen titles. Things like image compression tools, 3D model rendering/drawing engines, map editors, AI for monsters, music playback routines, etc ...

Crystal tools was what they made for FFXIII and FFXIV, using modern technologies and incompatible with their older designs so making FFXI with these would mean massive redesign.

In the end the most valuable assets on a video game are graphics and music due to the enormous amount of artistic resources and effort needed to build them up. And them being re-designed is what causes remakes being expensive to make. If SE decides that FFXI is fine how it is right now but it need a new program to run on newer platforms, it can be done. No problem. A new engine compatible with the old data formats used by FFXI would of course make it playable on PS Vita or even natively as a PS3 game.

Now that economic crisis and the Japan earthquake disaster forcibly changed their plans, if they rework their engine it could make a great opportunity to "soup up" the PC version of FFXI too. :cool:

I wish SE wouldn't try to build so many proprietary engines and tools when there are so many really good ones for sale.

I wonder when they going to give us new character models ..females with hulky hands not sexy.....

LOL @ Necro troll bump about completely different topic.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

LOL @ Necro troll bump about completely different topic.

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lol
@ Necro troll bump about completely different topic

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