What will become of Red Mage v1.0?

I'm not really sure how RDMs can still be upset with our current status. It's probably better than it's ever been.

• Enfeebles work? Check. (Abyssea sucked!)
• Good Weapons? Check. (2 weapons for Dual Wield, possible R/M/E adjustments)
• 10% Haste Belt? Check. (You can make a TP set that works. We also have a lot of accuracy choices on top of the accuracy on our weapons)
• MAB? Check! (SOOOO MUCH!)
• Access to every lvl 2 SC property? Check!

You can enfeeble, take a hit, open or close a SC, MB, Heal, or Solo. RDM has use either front line or back line, so you should think about where you will be most effective. So long as mobs don't become immune to enfeebles again, then RDM should have use in an alliance against terrible things ( F U Exuviation ). The caveat being that you can land it.

The Elemental magic adjustment is right around the corner and I suspect we will benefit from it immensely. The real reason for RDM to be up close and personal with a mob is because you can open or close any lvl 2 property WS into Dark or Light because you have access to all of them. You can then MB for hopefully even greater justice with those adjustments to nuking.

Generic arguments for why SCing isn't efficient are wasted on RDM because they aren't actual DDs. You can afford to hold TP so that you can create SCs for yourself and other nukers. Easiest way to land a hard enfeeble, MB it.

You should always strive to do the best DPS that you can, but you should never forget that there are things you can do that are better than just straight DPS. Especially if you respect actual DDs and open for them. They do a lot more damage than you do, and they always will.

So why not make their WSs occasionally deal double damage and your nukes and enfeebles land harder?

And if there is no good place for you to be up front, why not sit back and do the most good at a range that doesn't really stop you from being useful?

RDM is in a good place right now. Especially after what it's been through that last few years. You're useful again in an alliance setting.

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Originally Posted by detlef

RDM is in a good place right now. Especially after what it's been through that last few years. You're useful again in an alliance setting.

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Going from "everyone does everything you do but way better to the point you're irrelevant" to "lolenfeebles might matter in the current content" is not a good place. SCs and the thing about enspells doing extra damage on certain Adoulin mobs are gimmicks and poor ones at that.

I expect more than just scraps off the table for my job, and as such wouldn't settle for something so meager.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Going from "everyone does everything you do but way better to the point you're irrelevant" to "lolenfeebles might matter in the current content" is not a good place. SCs and the thing about enspells doing extra damage on certain Adoulin mobs are gimmicks and poor ones at that.

I expect more than just scraps off the table for my job, and as such wouldn't settle for something so meager.

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Sounds like you just aren't good at being realistic and have an over developed love of hyperbole. Be indignant, see where that gets you. Everyone else is going to point out that RUN and BLU exist and you just do don't want to play them.

RDM has enfeebles back and you are apparently getting huffy because that's not good enough and they owe you more. Well guess what? They don't. RDM is a weird mage first and everything else that it also is second and it always has been that way. Are we on all the new mage gear? Yup. That's why we aren't on Light Melee gear. We are on Scale Mail, which plenty Light Melee aren't. It's what makes us different.

No one wants pink mages because they won't cut it ever again. Be glad. They want mages that can soften a mob up. Those are called RDMs. They do other stuff too, but generally people bring them for their utility. Cry more that we have utility again, it makes the serious RDMs look stupid by association.

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Originally Posted by ManaKing

Sounds like you just aren't good at being realistic and have an over developed love of hyperbole.

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As I have repeatedly said throughout the, what, 6 years we've gone over this, I'm the type that likes to see a mess cleaned up. Not pointed somewhere else in hopes that I forget about the mess. I don't turn my eyes away from problems and forget about them. It's just a bad habit of mine both in RL and in gaming mediums where it is possible for things to get adjusted and changed.

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Are we on all the new mage gear? Yup. That's why we aren't on Light Melee gear. We are on Scale Mail, which plenty Light Melee aren't. It's what makes us different.

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Oh boy, the "different for the sake of being different" argument makes an appearance. It's not like we need the +haste, +dual wield or any of those pesky stats. Nope, +VIT and +Enmity seems to suit us just fine--oh wait.

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No one wants pink mages because they won't cut it ever again. Be glad. They want mages that can soften a mob up. Those are called RDMs. They do other stuff too, but generally people bring them for their utility. Cry more that we have utility again, it makes the serious RDMs look stupid by association.

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As I said, you're settling for scraps when this might be called a step forward if we dim the lights enough.

You're professing RDM is fine after they took a tiny step forward, and even that step is crooked due to being tied to content rather than to the job itself. You're like the starving man that grabs a stale, moldy piece of breads and declares it a banquet.

You're clearly angry because you like being angry. If you were actually playing your RDM in the current content, AKA the game, then you'd realize it's pretty well off. The content is the game. We are currently acclimated towards doing well in the game.

We have been give an extremely large cache of MAB, M.ACC, INT, MND, and Accuracy gear as well as extremely powerful weapons. We have everything a RDM needs to be useful. We don't have everything a BLU or traditional DD requires to be successful, because we are neither. Sorry you aren't good at see subtle things like what your job actually is and is not.

I'm personally very happy with what they did with RDM. There should have been extra mobs that take specific kinds of elemental damage....always. That way RDM can actually play the game, instead of having 6 enspells that are almost completely identical and 6 different elemental magics per tier that you only use blizzard and thunder from. The game is clearly getting better for RDM from the perspective of someone who actively plays the job.

If you use the word scraps again I'm just going to start insulting your lack of creativity and inability to communicate what you are upset about. Then tell you to make some food because you might be hungry. Enfeebles work and SE didn't make RDM into BLU... duh? what else? Because you clearly want attention and no one here is interested in catering to people that think they don't have to explain themselves.

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Originally Posted by ManaKing

You're clearly angry because you like being angry. If you were actually playing your RDM in the current content, AKA the game, then you'd realize it's pretty well off. The content is the game. We are currently acclimated towards doing well in the game.

We have been give an extremely large cache of MAB, M.ACC, INT, MND, and Accuracy gear as well as extremely powerful weapons. We have everything a RDM needs to be useful. We don't have everything a BLU or traditional DD requires to be successful, because we are neither. Sorry you aren't good at see subtle things like what your job actually is and is not.

I'm personally very happy with what they did with RDM. There should have been extra mobs that take specific kinds of elemental damage....always. That way RDM can actually play the game, instead of having 6 enspells that are almost completely identical and 6 different elemental magics per tier that you only use blizzard and thunder from. The game is clearly getting better for RDM from the perspective of someone who actively plays the job.

If you use the word scraps again I'm just going to start insulting your lack of creativity and inability to communicate what you are upset about. Then tell you to make some food because you might be hungry. Enfeebles work and SE didn't make RDM into BLU... duh? what else? Because you clearly want attention and no one here is interested in catering to people that think they don't have to explain themselves.

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See while I agree, I disagree. We are getting a lot of stuff, but yet again this entire expansion so far has been almost nothing but mage gear when it comes to RDM, not a single piece of melee gear unless you count the Belt, which is an extension of Phos which we were already on, the swords which fall in line with the other new weapons, the All Jobs gear, or the WS gear for Req because its a MND based skill so mage gear actually works for it. Our TP set can not really be messed with, we got no new DEX gear for CDC, we got no new STR gear for KoR or DB, all of which to me seems fairly lack luster. I am not saying they gave us literally nothing, but sometimes it feels like it to me because there is a lot of gear and we are left out of most melee things, it gives me the same nasty feeling that our Emp gear does with its fully mage stats, sure it has some use for Req and such but in the end you know you got shafted with the mage gear while your melee was pushed to the side.

If I am missing some game breaking damage RDM could pull off with the Light DD gear please show me. I have used the spreadsheets and while we would get a damage boost it seems to show RDM would still not be as strong as most other DDs with utility, let alone primary DD jobs, so asking for that seems reasonable to me. As you said, we have been given a ton of MAB, MAcc, INT, MND, and Accuracy, we have all of this gear like you said and yet, we were not given any STR, DEX, Attack, or Haste. The only gear with those stats are piece of gear which I exclude because they are either All Jobs, which is a bland way of saying everyone can have it, or gear which is literally an upgrade from something we could already wear, most notably the new Haste Belt which is basically Phos Belt+2/3.

So while you are right, we have gotten a lot, its all been for magic. As much as I know a lot of people in here would disagree, melee is a part of RDM, SE gave us some items like Brego which came from VW, it was not part of a set, which is probably why we were allowed to have it, but so far nothing like that exists in Adoulin it seems. Since we are being excluded from melee yet again we are falling further behind in DPS than we already were which is terrible in my opinion. These light DD sets would help a lot, but it will not make up for natural problems in all honesty, forced sub-jobs for Dual Wield and B Rating in sword/dagger will always bring our attack down, accuracy we can make up for somewhat, but certain natural problems exist that will cause us to be weaker even if we had access to all of the gear I ask for. As I said, if something is truly broken with giving RDM Light DD gear, show me the numbers, I am more than welcome to them.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Going from "everyone does everything you do but way better to the point you're irrelevant" to "lolenfeebles might matter in the current content" is not a good place. SCs and the thing about enspells doing extra damage on certain Adoulin mobs are gimmicks and poor ones at that.

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Agreed, its easy to see in an Alliance or even a party setting we are doing better, but that is by no means a good place, its just a less terrible place. I admit melee power would not help in an Alliance either, its more for 6 man party events and such, things like Meebles or possibly Skirmish, I wouldn't know about Skirmish, I never did it, and probably never will now as no one wants to. For back lines RDM has little to offer anymore besides Enfeebling, which is good enough to get us in a party and keep us there, people have been shouting for them lately which makes me feel more welcome in a party than any other time in the last... I don't know... 2 or 3 years. What I am trying to say is we are in a better place, not a good place, and this subject I can not really see as an attempt to help RDM in an Alliance setting, but rather a low man setting, which is not to be ignored but he is right we are doing the best we have done in an Alliance for a long while.

I guess a ton of STR attack and accuracy on really good swords just isn't good enough for you guys, even though we never got anything like them before.

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Originally Posted by ManaKing

I guess a ton of STR attack and accuracy on really good swords just isn't good enough for you guys, even though we never got anything like them before.

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We got Excalibur, Almace, MTrial Swords, Sanus, and so on. Weapons are not enough in my opinion, everyone gets weapons, not everyone gets gear to go with them, and we are one of those who got left out of it. Besides, after the Relic update those wont even be the best anymore either, it would be easier for me to get a Mandau for my Offhand than it would be to get the Sword from the HQ Dino, and it was the old best offhand so it probably still will be even without the attack and accuracy.