Job Manifesto discussion RE: Summoner

Btw Camate. Can you get any word at all about the future of spirits?

Mainly wondering if the developers are aware nobody uses them and never has, except when they need to use Elemental Siphon. And as a follow up, if they want Summoners to use them or if they should be considered old abandoned content.

You've done a good job making Sky and Dynamis and other places active again. Could you manage to get spirits active again as well? There are mainly a few irks that cause them to become useless.

- Assaulting sets their spell timers to max. This prevents you from "preparing" for a battle by having a spirit out.
- The delay being 50 seconds base and then shortened by skill is a bit rough.

So what happens when spirits get updated and its not to your liking?

Only way they could make me dislike the update would be if they made them worse by making it "only during full moone" and "Costs 500 MP to cast paralyze" and similar updates. It is hard to make something worse than useless.

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

Btw Camate. Can you get any word at all about the future of spirits?

Mainly wondering if the developers are aware nobody uses them and never has, except when they need to use Elemental Siphon. And as a follow up, if they want Summoners to use them or if they should be considered old abandoned content.

You've done a good job making Sky and Dynamis and other places active again. Could you manage to get spirits active again as well? There are mainly a few irks that cause them to become useless.

- Assaulting sets their spell timers to max. This prevents you from "preparing" for a battle by having a spirit out.
- The delay being 50 seconds base and then shortened by skill is a bit rough.

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Bolded is what is implied. They were never there to be long term solution of being a SMN. So, they left it as is. If any SMN doesn't have all the avatars by the time they reach 75, then they are playing the job wrong.

Spirits are fine as they are, because they were not designed to be end-all in SMN. Just be glad that they haven't increased perp cost on them to keep them out when we do summon them for Elemental Siphon.

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Originally Posted by Korpg

Bolded is what is implied. They were never there to be long term solution of being a SMN. So, they left it as is. If any SMN doesn't have all the avatars by the time they reach 75, then they are playing the job wrong.

Spirits are fine as they are, because they were not designed to be end-all in SMN. Just be glad that they haven't increased perp cost on them to keep them out when we do summon them for Elemental Siphon.

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Exactly.

People seem to have forgotten, or just weren't around back then.... Spirits were there to fill the void when you didn't have all your avatars. Because frankly, back then, it was't easy to actually HAVE all your avatars. Siphon gave them a nice purpose again (Aside from a quick OMG summon something now so I live cause I got aggro lolwtfbbq1!!1!).

If they make any changes to these things, really it should be to update the AI to not spam the same Debuffs over and over (burn, burn burn burn burn burn.. oh yeah... fire 3!) and to add the newer high level spells to their repertoire. Making them closer to be on par with avatars? No thanks, no thanks in any shape, form, or way. We have avatars for a reason, they are our bread and butter. Let our spirits be our salt and pepper.... no our salt. Just enough for taste... too much and it's bad for you.

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Originally Posted by Tannlore

Exactly.

People seem to have forgotten, or just weren't around back then.... Spirits were there to fill the void when you didn't have all your avatars. Because frankly, back then, it was't easy to actually HAVE all your avatars. Siphon gave them a nice purpose again (Aside from a quick OMG summon something now so I live cause I got aggro lolwtfbbq1!!1!).

If they make any changes to these things, really it should be to update the AI to not spam the same Debuffs over and over (burn, burn burn burn burn burn.. oh yeah... fire 3!) and to add the newer high level spells to their repertoire. Making them closer to be on par with avatars? No thanks, no thanks in any shape, form, or way. We have avatars for a reason, they are our bread and butter. Let our spirits be our salt and pepper.... no our salt. Just enough for taste... too much and it's bad for you.

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Even adding the higher tier spells won't increase their usefulness, but you have a point about the A.I.

Although many people have not even had their spirits out to attack anything anyway.

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Originally Posted by Korpg

Even adding the higher tier spells won't increase their usefulness, but you have a point about the A.I.

Although many people have not even had their spirits out to attack anything anyway.

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Probably not, but they should have these anyhow. Oversight on their part that should be fixed. But on the list of things that need fixing for smn? Spirits aren't exactly up there as far as I see. I'd rather see attention put to other issues.

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Originally Posted by Tannlore

Probably not, but they should have these anyhow. Oversight on their part that should be fixed. But on the list of things that need fixing for smn? Spirits aren't exactly up there as far as I see. I'd rather see attention put to other issues.

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Which is why I have been so adamant against fixing spirits.

Why fix a squeaky wheel when the whole engine needs to be replaced?

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Originally Posted by Korpg

Which is why I have been so adamant against fixing spirits.

Why fix a squeaky wheel when the whole engine needs to be replaced?

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Which is why I am asking the mechanic for his opinion and cost estimation.

And unbeknownst to both of you, the mechanic has never worked on a car in his life. He only knows how to fix mechanical bulls and electric nose-hair trimmers.