Classic server, what's the argument against it now?

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Originally Posted by nekroturkey

There were more people playing classic XI than there are currently playing XI now. Numbers don't lie, people preferred the older style of gameplay. Please provide evidence to the contrary, otherwise everything you say is just opinion/supposition.

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This is a really dumb conclusion to draw, that the ONLY reason more people played in the past was because they liked things like taking 9-12 months to level a job, or waiting 3 hours to have a chance to claim a Notorious Monster, or liked needing a full alliance to do anything, or liked that endgame linkshells were basically pyramid schemes where the earliest joiners got the best items while later joiners spent countless hours grinding or camping an NM for a hope at the scraps.

As Analenhem said, there are a host of reasons people likely left: less time due to real life commitments, simple boredom, being drawn to another game. I've known dozens of people who quit, and not a one of them did so because Abyssea or Adoulin era content was too easy. You're simply attributing your preferences to large masses of people to support your thesis.

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Originally Posted by nekroturkey

I'm not saying that I believe a classic server would be successful because it's what I want, but rather that a classic server would be successful, due to the success of classic/progression servers in other MMOs. My opinion isn't fact, but it's based on fact. The facts that I've provided (with sources) are the basis for my belief.

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This sounds like the exact same fallacy that TV executives make when they rip off some popular show (like Friends or Sex in the City) to make another show (like Joey or Lipstick Jungle). They believe that the basic format will instantly guarantee success. But it fails more often than not.

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Originally Posted by Isal

If you're going to say that FFXI was better back then because more people were playing back then, then it suggests that these MMOs with classic servers are actually better games on their standard servers than on their classic servers, because more people are playing on the standard servers than the classic ones.

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There are more people playing on Project 1999's server than any single server of Everquest. Darkfall Online (1.0) had more players than Unholy Wars (2.0) currently does. There are currently more people playing on the Lineage 2 classic servers in Korea than there are people playing on the standard servers. Once Lineage 2's international classic server is released, we'll see how well it does over here.

So actually, you're mistaken.

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I started this game when I was 19. I'm now 32. I don't have the free time I did as a youth, and I wouldn't start a game like FFXI again now if it had the grind that the original game did.

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This is almost exactly my selfsame story (I was 18 and now 31 :p). And I still drop in on the game often even if I'm not continuously active. It's largely a matter of time to play. You have to remember just how much time has passed since many of us fell in love with the game. A lot can happen in that amount of time that has literally nothing to do with the game itself. Even the youngest players of the game when it was new are now full fledged adults.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Even the youngest players of the game when it was new are now full fledged adults.

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Most of the people who played Everquest when it came out were adults to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Zarchery

This is a really dumb conclusion to draw

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No, it isn't. If they were paying to play, then chances are they were enjoying themselves. If they weren't enjoying themselves, then chances are they would've stopped paying to play. What's dumb is paying to play a game that you hate, which it sounds like you did, which is quite odd.

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Most of the people who played Everquest when it came out were adults to begin with.

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And.....?

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What's dumb is paying to play a game that you hate, which it sounds like you did, which is quite odd.

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He's not saying he didn't like the game. He liked the game in spite of what he saw as flaws looking back. And I agree they were flaws. There are so many enjoyable parts to the game, both back then and today, but the extreme grind and competing with 100+ people for the chance to fight a monster was really not the best part of the game to me. Even when I was doing it; the endless waiting around doing nothing didn't take long to outweigh the thrill of winning the pull (which was pure luck, pretty much)

The biggest draws for me, especially in the earlier years, were the strong storyline, the wide range of classes, the core mechanics of the combat system, and just the feel of the world itself. For the most part all of those things remain today. The biggest negative is in progression becoming more vertical (however, it's still not nearly as much so as any other MMO I've played), but that didn't push me away. Mostly it has been a free time issue, and there are so many single player and other non MMO games that I want to play that I just can't devote the same level of time to an MMO (any MMO) that i once could.

You need to accept that people come and go for different reasons. Just because some people (like myself) have come and gone or play much less than they used to, that doesn't mean that the reason for it is because they miss the old game and can't get it back. There is no way I (and zarchery and others without forum representation) would play on a classic server, largely because there are too many fun things that have come out since the early days. The things I would want most that I don't have now would require me to literally go back in time- a classic server today wouldn't fix my issues. E.g. I want to go back in time to when Ballista enjoyed some popularity. The people I see most wanting the classic server almost definitely do not want it for that reason and therefore I would have the same problem there that I do now: Nobody does Ballista anymore. Only a time machine would fix that (Even fixing ballista up wouldn't fix that because most people have made up their minds).

You may find it crazy, you may find it irrational, but all it takes is a scanning of this thread (and the other ones before it) to realize that there's hardly a united front on this issue. The players who stand to benefit the most are the hardest of the hardcore. I'm not trying to suggest they don't deserve to have as much fun as anyone else, but if you can't please everybody, why would you prioritize the tip of the bell curve rather than the mass in the middle? Some people want it, some people don't. Great- But should we really fracture the already small community just for the sake of trying to make SE some extra money ?

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Great- But should we really fracture the already small community just for the sake of trying to make SE some extra money ?

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I'm still not sure which direction you're going. Do you believe a classic server would divide the community, or do you believe that no one would be interested? Because you're flip-flopping a bit.

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Originally Posted by nekroturkey

I'm still not sure which direction you're going. Do you believe a classic server would divide the community, or do you believe that no one would be interested? Because you're flip-flopping a bit.

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I never said that "no one" is interested, therefore I'm not "flip flopping." What I *did* say is it's primarily one specific segment of the player base that has the most interest.

If you remove that one segment (which is integral to the health of the community regardless of size) and place it in it's own little world, you are damaging the health of the community that you took the population from.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I never said that "no one" is interested

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Further, nobody wants to roll back their character years and years

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If you say so.

Would they really have to do much other than make a new server, not allow transfers to it, and disable limit breaks above lvl 75? Personally I think that would be pretty cool and I'd make a character on it.