Legion, current playerbase and endgame content

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

I say selfish because of the massive amount of things you waste. Cinder for instance, I remember having a talk on here with Mdk about how Cinder was hard to find, I wonder how its hard to find, only drops from 2 NMs in VW which are not the most commonly done NMs, and 1 player was taking 3000 of them to themselves for a worthless upgrade... Seems a bit selfish. I feel entitled to judge because I know stupid things when I see them, I watch people on this server shout for days at times, trying to get cinder or dross for upgrades, if someone is hoarding them for Afterglow, they are not only a fool, but selfish for hoarding 3000 items (50 upgrades worth) to themselves for an upgrade that is no where near worth it while people shout all over needing them.

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That's a fairly retarded conception of the game. This is not communism. By your logic anyone with more than 100M gil should start giving away because there are plenty of people that are poor ? Oh and accorrding to the 2012 vana census the amount of people upgrading to a level 99 is very limited. I remember that on average you had 1 monk per server and 1 war every 2 servers at a given time.

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250 x 16Million = 4Billion
4Billion divided by 135Million(Aprox price of a relic) = 29.6
So you could have instead funded nearly 30 relics or you could have made about 18~19 lv99 Relics. These could be made by friends, LS members, anyone you know, instead, you got some glowing hands... Congratulations.

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Glowing is so much better though.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

You see there is a difference. Afterglow is a cosmetic upgrade with nearly no benefit what to ever, thus, a waste. Your going much to far into what your saying. For instance, my Excalibur does more damage for my RDM, thus, worthy investment. A Mythic NIN does more damage, again, worthy investment. Aftermath MNK gets glowy hands, not a worthy investment. Afterglow WAR gets a giant glowing Axe, again, not worth it. If afterglow improved stats, I might see it as worth it, and not selfish.

Now if the stats were
99:DMG:+52 Delay:+86 Attack+40 Enhances "Counter" effect V "Final Heaven"
99-2:DMG:+62 Delay:+86 Attack+50 Enhances "Counter" effect VI "Final Heaven" Afterglow
Might have something there, an increase in DMG, Attack, and Enhancement. However your comparison is bad imo because your talking about real improvements vs visual improvements.I still see any afterglow as a selfish use of supplies & resources, simple as that.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...Version-Update



Lv 99 Vere: STR+20 "Victory Smite"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage

Lv 99+ Vere:
STR+20 "Victory Smite"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
Afterglow (Increases critical hit rate)

According to the text on the weapon, a lv 99+ empy does gives more dmg to entire pt(depend on the weapon your pt member use though), thus it's not just visual improvement.
It does make a difference in terms of your pt output.

When everyone bash on afterglow, there are 2 main reasons. First being majority of player can't afford it while other gears more affordable, 2nd being the improvement is other pt member, not the user(and not every weapon gets benefit). However, even if user couldn't improve dmg, you still can't deny that entire pt's output increased with afterglow.Which is situational, like how you liked Excalibur on your RDM. I guess it's just so hard for you to grasp the concept of team performance. If you can't grasp the concept of team performance or situationally gets benefit, then of course afterglow is useless to you.

I can argue that getting excalibur for RDM is pointless too considering currently there are no real reason to use melee RDM over other alternatives. Of course you won't agree with it, like how I disagree with afterglow being useless. It's situational, just like excalibur for RDM melee. Just becase YOU think it's not worth it, doesn't mean everyone else thinks the same way. How about I tell you that I don't think excalibur for RDM is not worth it and anyone building it is a waste of currency when it can go to Rag, because it's not worth spending 100M+ on a melee weapon for RDM when I can just use empy if I want to melee(which is never), how'd you feel?

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

.If I had the 250 Marrows to do it? Yeah, I would sell 200 of them and use the gil to buy my best friend his Alexandrites for his Ryuno, buy the Alex for my GF's KKK or Nirvana she wants, finish my Excalibur & Almace to 99, possibly make the RDM Mythic, and after all of that which is about... 2 Billion of the gil, then finish the Bravura, Aegis, Apoc, Rag, and Anni that are being built in my LS as well as 99 them all with the remaining Marrows I didn't sell, along with 99 the 2 relics in my LS currently. That would run down the gil to leave about... 10 Marrows & 300~500Mil gil, which would go to more Relics, Mythics, or Emps that need it later. This would take my LS from its current... 4 Emps 2 Relics, to 4 Emps 7 Relics & 3 Mythics, a massive improvement in group strength. See, the flaw is, I don't have 250 Marrows, so this is all hypothetical

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If I'm as rich as Bill Gates, I'm going to spend millions and millions to help the poor, because I don't need that much money to live, and all those rich bastards in the world never donate enough money to help the poor ;(

But see, the flaw is, I am not as rich as Bill Gates, so this is all hypothetical and I can never help the poor ;(

Assuming Pchan's gil didn't came from RMT and he farmed all himself, you're assuming all his gil just rain down from sky, that he didn't spend any effort to farm for it, and anyone that can't afford relic/empy/Mythic are entitle to get a share.

The fact is, he probably spend more effort to farm the gil than anyone else, by doing research, finding a way to lowman ADL efficiently, and farm ADL daily and so on, which is undeniably a lot of work. Unless you spend as much effort and farm that much gil as him, and give it away, you don't have right to act like a justice freak and point finger at him since you never spend the effort and time to farm gil to begin with. Why should anyone not spending the time and effort get a free share of gil so they can start showing off their gear in PJ and sell account when they're bored of FFXI? Why can anyone not spend the time and effort to farm gil can start lecturing others who spent the time to get that much gil?

Bill Gates probably work 10x harder than average ppl to earn the money, like how rich ppl in FFXI probably worked 10x harder than avg ppl to farm the gil(unless you RMT), why'd they give all their hard work away and get nothing? If you're really into saving the poor and help ppl, spend 10x more effort to farm the gil and give it away before you want to point fingers. Whoever spent most effort deserves success and wealth, and right to decide what to do with their wealth, not those who just sit there and do nothing.

If someone wants something, earn with your own hands. I rarely hand out gil to newer players when they need gil for spells too, because that would spoil them and take away all the fun in FFXI, which is to accomplish things by themselves. I tell them how to farm gil best of my knowledge, but I don't hand stuff to them. I sure have enough gil to buy a newer player all the spell he needs, but doesn't mean I think it's right thing to hand out free stuff, and I don't think not handing out free stuff when you earned it in the first place is selfish. Efficient way to farm gil from ADL has been posted and discussed on BG, you should be thankful that at least some ppl didn't keeping their hard earned gil making method secret and anyone can follow the strat.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

Now if the stats were
That comment was mainly thrown in because it seems as though Pchan likes to say every event that comes out has shit for gear, but fails to mention that really, thats because only counting MNKs gear

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Sounds more like you are against his person, instead of using logic. Whether event has shit gear and worth doing or not is his choice and opinion. Just like how you think you'd want every relic for all your jobs if you're rich, and give away all the gil to others is your choice. You can think afterglow is not worth the gil all day and refuse to work on one if you want, and nobody is going to stop you or point finger at you. Same reason why I will never point finger at you for using currency on excalibur(instead of your friend's DD weapon), because it's your choice and your gil. However, just because someone didn't give 3 billion gil away, doesn't make them selfish as long as he didn't use other ppl to make his gil. Just because you think you're a saint and can give all your gil away if you have that much, doesn't make anyone not doing the same selfish.(if you really want to be a saint that much, spend 10x of effort to farm for gil and hand them out before you talk about it) Like how nobody is allowed to point finger at me for not buying spells for newer players with my gil. The moment you call others selfish for not handing out free gil, you're just not much different from the ppl you look down to.





I think it's pretty selfish to ask rich ppl who worked 10 time harder to hand out free gil to those who doesn't work for it too.

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Originally Posted by Afania

If I'm as rich as Bill Gates, I'm going to spend millions and millions to help the poor, because I don't need that much money to live, and all those rich bastards in the world never donate enough money to help the poor ;(

But see, the flaw is, I am not as rich as Bill Gates, so this is all hypothetical and I can never help the poor ;(

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Originally Posted by Afania

And giving out gil to LS/friend? Lol. How about you give out 1 relic worth of gil to your LS and friend and see how'd you feel.

Before you point fingers to others, calling others "selfish", how about you show yourself that you're not selfish and willing out to give 30 relics to friends.

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You put this question into play, I answered you honestly what I would do in the case I had that choice, I can do nothing more.

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Sounds more like you are against his person, instead of using logic.

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I simply added it in because the fact he constantly says events have shit for gear does annoy me due to the fact he seemingly ignores all gear that MNK can not use. Perhaps if he were to use another job, he may learn to gear it, and then he could see their use. The remark was not so much to say "Go play some other job even if you don't want to just because you have the money to!" but more to say "If you wanted to you could have even put the money to use like this, so that you may see why gear from events is good, and even give you more to do in the game as you would have more rewards you actually see worth your time."

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

My new pimpass afterglow spharai is benefiting from +5% crit from mdk's afterglow (all this because final heaven sux)

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So your not using Final Heaven anyways, making your Afterglow pointless...

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

You put this question into play, I answered you honestly what I would do in the case I had that choice, I can do nothing more.

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As I said, I do believe you that you would do it if you have that much gil suddenly pop in Dbox, but the point is you choose not to farm that much gil or you don't have the ability to farm that much gil.

Thus you're not entitle to call others with the ability/will/determination to farm that much gil selfish.

If someone doesn't have the ability to do charity, nor having the will to withstand the ordeal of gaining ability to do charity, then calling others out for not doing charity is nothing but hypocrisy.

If you really want to help friend so much, then abandon your social approach of this game and get hardcore, withstand the ordeal and mental torture of daily ADL and pay for extra monthly fee for mules, so you can get everyone relic and Mythic in your LS. But since you choose not to get hardcore, then what give you the right to call others who went through all those ordeal selfish? You choose not to farm that much gil in the first place, not you have 3 billion and choose not to give away. You only look at all the gil, and thinks they just rain from sky and whoever has it have to give it away, but never thought of all those gil requires determination, effort and time to get in the first place.

As I said, if you really really REALLY want to be a saint that much, then you will choose an approach to play this game that gives you the ability to become a rich saint that can give relics away. But you'd rather let others do the work, lol.




I see no real benefit to sacrifice this much for LSmate anyways. Ppl come and go way too fast those days, and often sell account. Also you won't die on the street if you don't have gil in a MMO. If it's real life close relationship ppl such as wife maybe can, since I can probably get some benefit from it. But someone I never meet irl? Get real, 99% of player isn't going to farm 3 billion worth of gil to get them relic when they're going to change LS or quit/sell account someday.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

I simply added it in because the fact he constantly says events have shit for gear does annoy me due to the fact he seemingly ignores all gear that MNK can not use. Perhaps if he were to use another job, he may learn to gear it, and then he could see their use. The remark was not so much to say "Go play some other job even if you don't want to just because you have the money to!" but more to say "If you wanted to you could have even put the money to use like this, so that you may see why gear from events is good, and even give you more to do in the game as you would have more rewards you actually see worth your time.

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He plays MNK, and not interested in playing other jobs, thus it's not illogical that X event is worthless for him to do. Back then when I tried to make a NNI static, I couldn't convince a BRD to come SCH for us too, because all the NNI gear he isn't interested even though his other jobs can use it.

I don't see there's a big problem of playing and gearing for 1 job, and not doing event or doesn't care about event for gears his job can't use. Some ppl likes to grind all the situational gears for one single favorite job that only shines in very, very VERY rare situations. Some ppl would rather skip all those situational gears for more inv and resources for more jobs for broader and wider access for different events. Different ppl different strokes, just because you would rather spend more resource on different jobs, doesn't mean everyone would enjoy it, nor make you "smarter".

If you feel annoyed because someone doesn't care about other jobs, why don't you just ignore? You're just way too easily affected emotionally by others opinion.

I started my legion group and went through all the mental torture for it so I can get snapshot feet, which doesn't make a damn difference in terms of performance without 3rd pt tool. I already got it but still experience mental torture for making full ally every week(since I can't just bail after I get my shit). And guess what? First page of reply on this tread told me Gallu drop is worthless when I started everything and went through a lot just for it.

Do I get annoyed? No. Because different gears have different value in different player's mind. Why would I get annoyed if the gear I value a lot is worthless in another player's mind and vice versa? It's not like he takes my valueable gear away just by thinking that way. If I disagree with his POV, I simply state my opinion and that's it.

Maybe you liked X gear, and Pchan doesn't care about the gear you value a lot, but why does it matter to you? X gear is still in your inventory and many ppl already explained why other gear isn't worthless too. If someone thinks X gear is uselss, explain why it's useful. But really no point to tell others to play another job they're not going to care anyways.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

."So your not using Final Heaven anyways, making your Afterglow pointless...

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Relic afterglow is a lot harder to take advantage than empy afterglow. One way I think that can work is before you pop the NM(probably a pop NM like VW or ADL), you use Final Heaven on another fodder and get afterglow, so when NM is popped all pt member gets afterglow for a while.

Also in an acc way under cap situaitons, if you pt with 4 other DDs and nobody close to capping acc, final heaven may*(I'm not 100% sure about this though, need math) be worth using over merit WS just so that everyone else gets acc and increase a lot of output, considering acc is one of the most important melee state, the increase dmg from 4 other DD may add up more than the WS dmg lose from using Final Heaven.

However, it's Pchan's weapon, so how he take advantage of it is his business and he is the one that should worry about it, not you nor me. If he can't take advantage, then he wasted effort/time and it's as simple as that. Not like the effort/time/gil he wasted is your gil/time.

It's his time to spend as he wants. Now his weapon glows! That's a lot of dedication and effort. Two guys with 3 accounts each farming for 2 hours a night to make many times the amount of gil (or at least value) that most people in game will ever see? Awesome.

Also, it's better for himself, his server, and everyone else that he got his gil by farming Marrows rather than Cruor farming. Cruor farming would have inflated his server's economy and pumped the price of marrows up much more substantially for other buyers.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

So your not using Final Heaven anyways, making your Afterglow pointless...

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Mdk is which means I'm getting the afterglow boohoo. You're slow.

Funny how we went from talking about how gear from Legion is good or useful, to me judging others & being hypocritical because of my general outlook on Afterglow in response to what Arcon said... Suppose I should have just said Afterglow is meaningless to me in every way and would not change my outlook at what I perceive as someones ignorance toward gear.

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Originally Posted by Afania

He plays MNK, and not interested in playing other jobs, thus it's not illogical that X event is worthless for him to do. Back then when I tried to make a NNI static, I couldn't convince a BRD to come SCH for us too, because all the NNI gear he isn't interested even though his other jobs can use it.

I don't see there's a big problem of playing and gearing for 1 job, and not doing event or doesn't care about event for gears his job can't use. Some ppl likes to grind all the situational gears for one single favorite job that only shines in very, very VERY rare situations. Some ppl would rather skip all those situational gears for more inv and resources for more jobs for broader and wider access for different events. Different ppl different strokes, just because you would rather spend more resource on different jobs, doesn't mean everyone would enjoy it, nor make you "smarter".

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Your right, not everyone is interested in gear for every job. Going back to what he originally said that caused me to post the gear that stands out when I look through Legions rewards, was this.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

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Originally Posted by Afania

Reward wise, legion is actually pretty balanced IMO. The fact that Gallu/Rex on wave 3 has 100% drop slot pretty much offers good reward for more effort.

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Which ? And for what job ? The entire thing looked like "a pile of worthless crap or sidegrades in certain situation that never happen" kind of gear, when they released it. Meteor and arise serve no purpose in the game and if you ever want some they cost 5 M at bazaars (2 dynamis run farming if you suck).

The only reason I don't do it is because the drops are crap. The event seems to be an excuse to make arise/meteor drop or skilling up crafts. If SE wants people to have interest they need to give great stuff for every job first, which you don't seem to emphasize in your post. Aside from that I entirely agree with the other parts. However I fear that the incoming embrava and PD nerf is going to end up in a trivialisation of the event such has displacers for voidwatch.

Another threat is going to be the new salvage gear probably (both because of quality and player friendly environement).

Let's be honest ?

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To me this post looks to imply he is judging all gear, not simply MNKs actually. The underlined statement is what leads me to think that is what he was saying. Either way I don't care much anymore.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

Mdk is which means I'm getting the afterglow boohoo. You're slow.

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Mdk is using VS, your getting the afterglow from VS, not Spharai, thus making the afterglow on Spharai unused & pointless at that time, unless your WSing with Final Heaven, its not doing anything, unless I misunderstood how Afterglow works.



My spacebar broke a few days ago & I have been wasting my time posting on here to reply in a pointless argument to explain what I think of afterglow, you all can continue with your talking about Legion. I agree it should be easier to pull a group together, as otherwise I will probably never do the content, past that I don't care much, Ill miss out on some of the best gear for my RDM unless they make it available otherwise, which will hurt me, but nothing I can really do at this point. I think Legion was designed poorly anyways due to the reliance of PD & Embrava, however at the same time I understand why it was made in that way, its because the playerbase would use them anyways and make it easy. Thats about all I have to say on the topic really.

So you think making 15 relics is not stupid, and making one afterglow is stupid. That's your opinion. I think it's the other way around. Why? People make multiple relics or an after glow for show off. Making a relic is not an accomplishment anymore; I'm going as far as saying that making a relic at level 75 was more an accomplishement than making a glowing one today; with the speed at which I farm marrows I could make one lv99 relic every 6 days basically. Cool story? I'll be the 1,000's person to do that relic weapon.

Btw, I contemplated making a mythic instead, because even though they all are inferior to empy or relic depending on job, except SAM and DRG, making a mythic is harder than making a glowing weapon: if I started now, I would not get it for another 6 months, because it requires do do so many things every day with 3 to 6 man (Nyzul, assaults, einherjar,ZNM, farming alexandrites) : you're looking at least at 2h pr day for 6 months. Instead I could use those 2 hours a day to make 2 more glowing weapons.

yeah honestly if you are good at farming adl and sell marrows, alexandrites farming is a joke ("only" 500M or 36 marrows), so in reality the hardest thing to do would be an afterglow mythic. Too bad they all suck kindof.

Dont know where else to post this but was wondering if there was a suggestions box type thread to post in. Either way I wanted to point out that the dev team should probably work on fixing the existing areas when adding Seekers of Adoulin. Would be nice to have some HNMS drop different gear and maybe get lvl uped. or add missions to all areas especially Aht Urghan since last I checked nobody goes there except for NEO runs. They really need to bring the game back as a whole. well I said my peace