FFXI DESPERATELY NEEDS BAN HAMMERS!

Isn't more the elephant in the room that no one is talking about is WHERE the gil that these people who are buying stuff from merc are coming from. Most likely it is BOUGHT gil, which is against SE Terms of Service. If they didn't have the gil, they couldn't buy from merc.

As lets face it, anyone with alot of gil that is legitimate either already has the gear or is well geared enough that they can do the events to obtain new gear and not have to pay merc to obtain them.

So it again either comes down to enforcement by SE, upbringing of individual(ie thinks it's ok to buy gil), or the community as a whole(that gilbuying seems accepted and not shamed anymore)

Could we just add an "Add to Blacklist" (and friend list) option to the context menu you get when selecting somebody's chat in the full log window? This feature was added to the game a while back (something that FFXIV had day 1 so I was glad to see it) and h as options to send tells, target, or join their party, but it seems logical that an "add to blacklist" button should be there.

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Originally Posted by VoiceMemo

Isn't more the elephant in the room that no one is talking about is WHERE the gil that these people who are buying stuff from merc are coming from. Most likely it is BOUGHT gil, which is against SE Terms of Service. If they didn't have the gil, they couldn't buy from merc.

As lets face it, anyone with alot of gil that is legitimate either already has the gear or is well geared enough that they can do the events to obtain new gear and not have to pay merc to obtain them.

So it again either comes down to enforcement by SE, upbringing of individual(ie thinks it's ok to buy gil), or the community as a whole(that gilbuying seems accepted and not shamed anymore)

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I can't believe you can be this ignorant at how easy it is to make gil on ffxi. You have no idea at all what you're talking about with what you just typed so just stop.

It's really easy to make a few million gil to buy a drop from a merc.

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Originally Posted by Sirmarki

Which is why we need instant moderation of the yell channel. I have never been to a forum or place of public discussion that doesn't have some form of live moderation.
Otherwise toxic yells spiral out of control and just escalate further and further making the game toxic. Nip it in the bud so to speak.

I know exactly where you are coming from. I too have logged off simply due to the mind numbing/offensive/political nonsense that flies down my screen.
I have no option to block it, my /blist is full, and if I turn /yell off, I'm cutting myself out of the 'possible' (although seemly rare these days) content yells (*cough* everything has been or is being "merced").

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No, their shouts should be classified as spam IF they are spamming. Nothing else, what you just suggested is the start of a slippery slope where everyone gets muted over anything.

RMT shouts happen, but if they start spamming on cooldown then they should be stopped for spam alone.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

No, their shouts should be classified as spam IF they are spamming. Nothing else, what you just suggested is the start of a slippery slope where everyone gets muted over anything.

RMT shouts happen, but if they start spamming on cooldown then they should be stopped for spam alone.

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All we really need is a fast and easy (and legitimate) way to silence these players client side. As I'd suggested elsewhere, a context menu command to add someone to your blacklist when you select someone's chat in the log window, similar to how other MMOs allow you to click on someone's name in the chat to perform actions on them (i.e., right click > blacklist)

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Originally Posted by Pixela

I can't believe you can be this ignorant at how easy it is to make gil on ffxi. You have no idea at all what you're talking about with what you just typed so just stop.

It's really easy to make a few million gil to buy a drop from a merc.

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I'm not talking about the ones that pay 1-2 mil for PL, I'm talking about people that spend 20m to 50m on a single gear

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Originally Posted by Clou777

Its almost impossible right now to get a decent CP party, every zone is FILLED to the brim with RMT botters selling JP! and with the CONSTANT yelling in towns of people advertising their websites for buying gil what the hell is anyone doing about it? I dont even want to try to master a job right now because it's a battle to compete against botters pulling mobs.

we need a john wick GM!

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...091#post620091

We really need to stop out of this mindset that everyone selling things are RMT, mercing is a legit form of gil making to build rema and things you know?

Sure some are, sure some are even 4-5 boxing but that doesn't meant they are rmt.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

We really need to stop out of this mindset that everyone selling things are RMT, mercing is a legit form of gil making to build rema and things you know?

Sure some are, sure some are even 4-5 boxing but that doesn't meant they are rmt.

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Mercing is only RMT if they're charging real money. Which has been known to happen.

Regardless of whether or not a FFXI account is being used for RMT purposes the utilization of 3rd party programs to script automated farming, resource claims and/or enemy claims especially within shared zones is a major ToS violation that incurs a penalty of permanent account termination should SE elect to investigate properly.

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Originally Posted by TullemoreAsuraFFXI

Regardless of whether or not a FFXI account is being used for RMT purposes the utilization of 3rd party programs to script automated farming, resource claims and/or enemy claims especially within shared zones is a major ToS violation that incurs a penalty of permanent account termination should SE elect to investigate properly.

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Windower is a 3rd party tool, be careful what you wish for cause you might just get it.

Again, is SE were to listen to someone like you the game would be dead in a week. The goal is to enforce the rules with an even hand and not a zero tolerance hand.

I do not use windower. To the best of my knowledge from conversations i have been privy to; there is nothing within the basic interface of windower that creates or implements "Bots".

@ Pixela: Wrong perception about ToS. ToS is supreme as it concerns FFXI conduct. Staffing levels and financial resources directed towards FFXI by SE being low is the true culprit why those who violate ToS are not properly jailed or having their accounts terminated.
The apathy of SE, player leadership and population at large as it concerns to blatant cheating is the reason subscriptions became and remain dismal.
When exactly did you first install FFXI? Have you ever qualified for end game content ever? Just how many hours have you given deep thought and philosophical analysis of the complex consequences and interactions of honest vs corrupt behavior? My guesses would be years after WotG expansion, no or just barely recent and a fraction of an hour or none. For those interested; I am a true original resident on the Asura server since North America launch (That means Zilart, well before CoP). I have witnessed the vast amount of infestations of corruption throughout all facets of content. The highest popularity of FFXI occurred when players had content and an environment that they considered to be fair and evenly equalized for each character. I can not emphasize this position any more clearly; FFXI is not a single player concept, FFXI is not a concept where cheaters are interned within their own seperate environment. ToS violations within a MMO title have detrimental consequences that adversely influence the gaming atmosphere that everyone else on that server is connecting to. These are the facts.

Thank you all for your opinions and information.

Asura is supposed to be my home server since I originally started on Pandemonium in 2003. I remember I paid my dad a lot of quarters to get that game because I wasn't old enough to have my own credit card. I was so lost and stuck in Port San O'dria for hours. I imagined how big this Vana'diel is going to be when I entered West Ronfaure for the first time. In 2004, I moved to PS2 for a better experience because my PC sucked. In 2006, I moved to Xbox 360 for better graphics (couldn't play Besieged with that lousy port). I was a leader of Japanese exp party a lot (thanks to my unique name I guess) but that should explain my ability to play without Windower.

In 2009, I came back to PC. Unfortunately, 2009 was definitely the worst year for both Square Enix and players. I lost my account to a RMT hacker. I detected a keylogger inside a hidden iFrame tag in the outdated HTML official webpage, PlayOnline.com. Even though, Firefox's NoScript can prevent that. I called SE and explained to them that I am the owner of that stolen account. After many days of waiting, they emailed me stating that my account already got banhammered and can't be restored without a confirmation code (I didn't have one?). Oh well, I should have registered my security token sooner though. I wasn't surprised why Square Enix got sued for $5 million dollars by their players.

In 2010, I decided to come back with my new account on a different server and didn't know where Pandemonium was after it got merged with Asura. I became a glorious PC gaming master race and my hair was so pure white enough to end the console service. I can run multiple FFXI clients and FFXIV on the same machine. Just you know how old and low specs FFXI is. Both games run off my 3.0 USB flash drive. Just plug and play. FFXI will be registered on the registry automatically if needed so I keep all my macros, synthesis history, AH's sorted list and more without needing to spend so many hours reinstalling and updating the game. I am genius right? (laughs)

To be honest, I wouldn't come back but all thanks to the QoL updates my process got so much faster. While FFXI isn't FFXI it used to be, I personally think multi-boxing is a new experience and biggest challenge I want to do for my linkshell members whether we run Ambuscade or farm Divergence. Therefore, having two characters require time to gain gil to improve my equipment. I know I am not alone doing that!

I am sorry, I speak mainly in my native sign language. I truly thanked FFXI's community for improving my English skills. :o

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I wasn't surprised why Square Enix got sued for $5 million dollars by their players.

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Citations please? I'm not aware of any lawsuit tied to RMT bans.

25 June 2009
According to the Courthouse News Service, Square Enix is being sued by a customer for not being open about the fees and late-payment penalties for playing its MMO Final Fantasy XI.

Esther Leong from San Francisco has brought a class action lawsuit against the US arm of the Japanese RPG giant, claiming that Square Enix deceived 100,000 customers by lying about or concealing "its monthly fees, penalties for late payments, interest, restrictions, and other things that should have been fully disclosed at points of purchase".

The suit seeks damages of over USD 5 million on behalf of players and alleges "unfair business practices, false advertising, and unjust enrichment".

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Originally Posted by Isola

25 June 2009
According to the Courthouse News Service, Square Enix is being sued by a customer for not being open about the fees and late-payment penalties for playing its MMO Final Fantasy XI.

Esther Leong from San Francisco has brought a class action lawsuit against the US arm of the Japanese RPG giant, claiming that Square Enix deceived 100,000 customers by lying about or concealing "its monthly fees, penalties for late payments, interest, restrictions, and other things that should have been fully disclosed at points of purchase".

The suit seeks damages of over USD 5 million on behalf of players and alleges "unfair business practices, false advertising, and unjust enrichment".

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What does this have to do with RMT? Nothing. It's about improper practices related to service fees. It further has nothing to do with your issue. (that "confirmation code" had nothing to do with a security token btw, its something that gets sent to your registered email)

(Also, a lawsuit being filed doesn't mean the filers won. Something smells really funny here because SE doesn't and never did charge late fees. They simply deactivate your account if payment fails, until you provide a working payment method.)

He never said it had anything to do with RMT

Never said they won either. Just that they were sued. (they lost, by the way)

Stop complaining about RMT and play the game, they are nowhere near as big a problem as you think they are.

I'm seeing people quit over RMT going unpunished. You're wrong.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

Stop complaining about RMT and play the game, they are nowhere near as big a problem as you think they are.

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Originally Posted by Isola

He never said it had anything to do with RMT

Never said they won either. Just that they were sued. (they lost, by the way)

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Of course they did. SE CS may be hit or miss but they haven't lied about payment issues. Late fees were never a thing lol (Perhaps they're really talking about chargebacks? I don't know.... But SE's policy is basically the same on that os other MMO makers- you can't play til you resolve the chargeback.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I'm seeing people quit over RMT going unpunished. You're wrong.

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No one is quitting because of RMT. You see a bunch of whiners making empty threats, but they're still here posting all the time. People are quitting because its 20 years old and there is a noticeable content drought.

They are justified complaints though, crafting spheres and actual armies of bots with 24/7 RMT shouting is not a good look for SE.

Rank the reasons people quit ffxi
Bored/Better games
Don't want to play on asura, but home server is ghost town
"Asura"
Absolutely no job balance/SMN burn/bandwagon the current "best"/Meta onry
Crafting system is broken bottom to top
"got everything" come back when theres new stuff and quit again
and at the bottom is RMT

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I'm seeing people quit over RMT going unpunished. You're wrong.

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No you're not, you're seeing people quitting over other reasons and saying it's that. That's human nature.

Back in the day if someone said they were quitting over RMT dominating in sky and nobody else was able to farm sky triggers then I would give complaints some credit, that directly impacted the game and stopped you doing content.

RMT these days is just a visual annoyance if you're looking for it, they don't have a big negative impact on the game at all.

Normal people.
"these flowers are so pretty and they smell lovely"
Weirdos
"no, the bee is buzzing! look at the bees, the noise!! the bees ruin it, I'm leaving because of the bees!"

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Originally Posted by Isola

No one is quitting because of RMT. You see a bunch of whiners making empty threats, but they're still here posting all the time. People are quitting because its 20 years old and there is a noticeable content drought.

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One of the reasons I cancelled is because mercs dominate content (aswell as bots/rmt/cheats blah blah). No players are getting together anymore so it seems, because mercing has become the new norm. I mean people merc (and sell) items from even the likes of Tenzen. I've raised by concerns over it before, bending of the treasure pool and such. If people want to play that way, and thats the style of game they like, then so be it. I just won't be a part of it.

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Originally Posted by Isola

Rank the reasons people quit ffxi
Bored/Better games
Don't want to play on asura, but home server is ghost town
"Asura"
Absolutely no job balance/SMN burn/bandwagon the current "best"/Meta onry
Crafting system is broken bottom to top
"got everything" come back when theres new stuff and quit again
and at the bottom is RMT

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These generally aren't my reasons for un-subbing. I don't play a newer game, and I actually liked FFXI and would of carried on playing, if it wasn't for the reasons I've already stated.
The final push for me was seeing an entire LS I was in justify botting, as if someone that doesn't do it is in the wrong and not "normal"... I was backed into a corner.

The game balance is way off, and it's not for job adjustments or anything like that - It's down to a degree of players contributing to the downfall with actions that don't exist in the retail version of FFXI.

I'm sure I'm not alone in my thoughts. Of course, everybody's patience levels vary - mine ran out.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

RMT these days is just a visual annoyance if you're looking for it, they don't have a big negative impact on the game at all.

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Are you sure about that?

They have a derogatory effect on the game. Money generated from RMT in real life generally doesn't go to good causes whatsoever.
I mean there are entire threads of new/current people trying to exp or other and have 30 RMT running in circles all over the zones?
I know, I've seen it more times than I care to mention.

I suggest reading through some of of the Japanese threads with 30~40 likes completely contradicting what you are saying.

Ok so there is a distinction between botting and RMT. While they are not exclusive, there is a difference.

RMT itself is just the visual annoyance. While it has negative impact, it has equally positive impact, seriously. Just having extra gil that you want to "share" and generating more gives you a reason to keep playing for example. The way that these particular RMT choose to generate gil (botting spheres) is a problem. If they were not blocking actual content like mission progress, it would be completely inconsequential. If someone wanted to go farm slug eyes in foret 24/7 it would only be a positive. No one would ever go kill those, they add eyes to the AH for coalitions, they sell to players who are to lazy to earn. Absolutely no downside.

Who do you think keeps the entirety of the synthesis materials on the AH? Bots. And who buys the products? RMT. They move the game. Undeniably.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

No you're not, you're seeing people quitting over other reasons and saying it's that.

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Are you really being serious here? What would these people's motiviations be to lie about something like this? You have no credibility, I would take almost anybody's word over yours.

Seriously, just give it up, nobody buys your nonsense about banning RMT being a bad thing. I don't want more players if they're all cheaters, and I don't think any other legitimate player does either.


RMT are more than just a visual annoyance, they in many cases disrupt the ability of legitimate players to play the game normally, thus pressuring them to buy gil to pay them to do the things that they're being prevented from doing. You're living in a fantasy land if you think the only annoyance presented by the RMT is the shouts/yelling.

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Ok so there is a distinction between botting and RMT. While they are not exclusive, there is a difference.

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The only distinction is you don't have to be RMT to bot, while most if not all RMTs are botters. Yes, botting doesn't automatically mean you're RMT, but that doesn't mean it's any less undesireable.

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Originally Posted by Pixela

No you're not, you're seeing people quitting over other reasons and saying it's that. That's human nature.

Back in the day if someone said they were quitting over RMT dominating in sky and nobody else was able to farm sky triggers then I would give complaints some credit, that directly impacted the game and stopped you doing content.

RMT these days is just a visual annoyance if you're looking for it, they don't have a big negative impact on the game at all.

Normal people.
"these flowers are so pretty and they smell lovely"
Weirdos
"no, the bee is buzzing! look at the bees, the noise!! the bees ruin it, I'm leaving because of the bees!"

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No and yes, RMT's Back than did not sell you a relic for 50 dollars, everything was very expensive and RMT's couldn't farm you merits too i honestly blame the new updates on windower for gearswaps and lua botting, for all of this crap. Even the players are botting 24/7 during campaigns. RMT Sky is nothing compared to what we have now, atleast than 100 million was what like 1300 dollars or more? now its 30 or 50 or something like that. I think Square has to bann windower, they were right about it all these years, if you cant play A PC game without addons and auto generated scripts PLEASE PLAY A MOBILE GAME, am sick of what people have made online MMO into. Skills dont matter anymore your ingame macros gearset dont unless you have gearswaps, this game is really in a bad state right now, and no il never stop paying for this game or quit, but this windower needs to ***** go its so easy to program human like botts these days with updated windower + lua files, SQUARE NEEDS TO RECREATE A WHOLE NEW UI AND BANN WINDOWER dislike as much as you want i dont care this is concreet proof why the botts are rampant. Thank god i moved out of Asura that server is plagued by botts. thats why people dont want to yell and do content other than BUY BUY BUY BUY GEAR and thats a reason why i would want to play in an official classic server, Atleast than your gill and grouping up has meaning TIME=gear.