Colonization Reive and Lair Reive Feedback

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Originally Posted by dasva

While that is technically true if you mpk afk people you are at the mercy of those afk people when they get back. Lucky for the assholes thinking it's funny to mpk people on purpose most wont make reports. But I will. Stay classy and have fun with those bans fellas

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You can't prove someone intentionally mpked you once.
<GM> why did you die near <afkplayer>
<PK> I had too much link, and went there because i hoped they help me, or can RRsafe

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Originally Posted by hiko

You can't prove someone intentionally mpked you once.
<GM> why did you die near <afkplayer>
<PK> I had too much link, and went there because i hoped they help me, or can RRsafe

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Seems like people spend a lot of time trying to think of ways to get away with being dicks to other people who aren't doing anything to them in this game....

I wonder why people would rather AFK than play with them?...

True you can't just check log and see one guy doing that once. But that's true of basically most rule violations including botting and such. GM actually has to catch them in them doing it or get lots of reports/check chat logs. Believe me if you are seen talking about mpking people and then you do it and there seems to be a pattern of you just happening to die next to players flimsy excuses wont mean a thing. I've known people who thought it would be funny to mpk rolanmarters who got in trouble back in the day. Or people claiming to trying to help this ls beat nidhogg by cure bombing the tank. Hell got one guy banned who though it was funny to run around the dunes back when people actually ptd there as a 75 but anon naked with red hp asking for help/cures to kill people. Will you get away with it a few times? Damn right you will. Do it enough get a few reports on you and you get seen doing it and you will get in trouble

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Originally Posted by dasva

Believe me if you are seen talking about mpking people and then you do it and there seems to be a pattern of you just happening to die next to players flimsy excuses wont mean a thing.

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Yep. Like for instance if say, you went and posted about how you could get away with MPKing people on the official forums and then did exactly what you said you were gonna do in the game... I'm pretty sure that counts as evidence and it doesn't even require scanning chat logs.

You guys are so defensive of players afking in colonization reives. Once you afk in a battle zone you put yourself at risk to anything that happens, and you really have no right to complain about mpk, intentional or not. Everybody fighting mobs wants to be in a safe zone, away from respawns. If you afked at KB and got killed by somebody else's meteor, would you call a GM (note that I can't remember if meteor hits people without hate but I recall that it does)?

Aside from that, I've talked to a GM about a GEO intentionally using concentric pulse to wake slept mobs (there weren't many people at that reive, so we could barely make any headway on the rocks with repops without sleeping mobs). The GEO even laughed at me in /say, and it was the third time he had done it. But nothing happened, and I'm sure he wasn't penalized. I highly doubt that GMs are going to go out of their way to protect the rights of afk players.

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Originally Posted by detlef

You guys are so defensive of players afking in colonization reives. Once you afk in a battle zone you put yourself at risk to anything that happens, and you really have no right to complain about mpk, intentional or not. Everybody fighting mobs wants to be in a safe zone, away from respawns. If you afked at KB and got killed by somebody else's meteor, would you call a GM (note that I can't remember if meteor hits people without hate but I recall that it does)?

Aside from that, I've talked to a GM about a GEO intentionally using concentric pulse to wake slept mobs (there weren't many people at that reive, so we could barely make any headway on the rocks with repops without sleeping mobs). The GEO even laughed at me in /say, and it was the third time he had done it. But nothing happened, and I'm sure he wasn't penalized. I highly doubt that GMs are going to go out of their way to protect the rights of afk players.

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Except that these people are afk in places where mobs wouldn't normally kill them. People are going out of their way to kill them just because they hate to see the next gut get something for free. You can justify it any way you want, but the fact of the matter is that you are griefing another player. The only reason you are doing it is to screw the next guy. It has no tangible benefit to the game at large other than to satisfy your desire to watch the world burn.

And feel free to MPK me. Just know that when I see you guys in Wildskeeper reives and I'm dressed in twilight armor that it's because I'm about to drag a hundred mobs over to the summoner / mage parties over and over for the next 6 hours and That I'm taking the same moral stance that you did when you killed me. "They shouldn't have been standing there. They had it coming".

Is that what you want? Does that sound like the right way to play the game? When most servers have lost half their population in the last couple months should we really be going out of our ways to find new ways to screw each other?

There hasn't been a Yorcia wield wildskeep reive on my server in like a week. Can you really fault people for doing everything in their power to get a shot at these things before they go the way of campaign? Has it ever occurred to you that if that guy were fighting, that you would be getting less bayld? The more people afk for their incredibly slow bayld, the less you have to deal with them Fell cleaving all the rocks etc. It's actually better for everyone, since these things clearly don't support the number of people who do them in general.

I'm not advocating MPK or griefing. I'm just saying that if you wake up and you're in Adoulin, you really can't complain.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Seems like people spend a lot of time trying to think of ways to get away with being dicks to other people who aren't doing anything to them in this game....

I wonder why people would rather AFK than play with them?...

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If I could, I would do nothing but MPK anyone and everyone, afk or not. It's not like there is any "legal" content worth doing.

If you couldn't get banned for doing things that entertain you... the game would be a completely different game.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Seems like people spend a lot of time trying to think of ways to get away with being dicks to other people who aren't doing anything to them in this game....

I wonder why people would rather AFK than play with them?...

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I spent something like 5min to get away with that but never bothered MPK anybody in reive because its a waste of time/xp/bayld (get less bayld if i'm dead/weak than if i fight)
I don't care about people AFKing in CR area is big enough, but in some LR there is not a lot of safe place and i might fight close to afk because i don't have choice if i dont want to link/agro or get knoked away from reive

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Originally Posted by hiko

I spent something like 5min to get away with that but never bothered MPK anybody in reive because its a waste of time/xp/bayld (get less bayld if i'm dead/weak than if i fight)
I don't care about people AFKing in CR area is big enough, but in some LR there is not a lot of safe place and i might fight close to afk because i don't have choice if i dont want to link/agro or get knoked away from reive

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I'm not talking about people legitimately fighting mobs. I'm talking about people saying "Let's MPK these guys!!" and "Let's call a GM on these guys for cheating!!".

These people afk in the same spot all day unharmed. For the most part, It's pretty obvious when they die what happened.

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Originally Posted by detlef

You guys are so defensive of players afking in colonization reives. Once you afk in a battle zone you put yourself at risk to anything that happens, and you really have no right to complain about mpk, intentional or not.

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Actually I have every right to complain about someone breaking the rules in ways that hurt other peoples game play. Hell the main option under GM calls is to complain about rules violations. And will people stop bringing up examples of unintentional mpk. That's not the argument being had and has nothing to do with it.

Actually, MPK was one of the BIGGEST complaints, prior to the recent changes.

It was almost impossible NOT to mpk someone in reive. Now that the first couple zones are changed, mpk isn't an issue, but it still is in the newer zones.

Using the colibri to mimic aga3 to mpk people = hilarious. That is the almost literal use of "mpk". The only better use is waking a slept enemy with an action weak enough to claim it purple, yet not gain enough enmity to have it chase you and kill the sleeper instead.

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Originally Posted by dasva

Actually I have every right to complain about someone breaking the rules in ways that hurt other peoples game play. Hell the main option under GM calls is to complain about rules violations. And will people stop bringing up examples of unintentional mpk. That's not the argument being had and has nothing to do with it.

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Oh absolutely. If you feel it's an issue then you should certainly bring it to SE's attention. Call a GM if you go to bed in Marjami and wake up in Adoulin. Griefing other players is not something that should be encouraged.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

I'm not talking about people legitimately fighting mobs. I'm talking about people saying "Let's MPK these guys!!" and "Let's call a GM on these guys for cheating!!".

These people afk in the same spot all day unharmed. For the most part, It's pretty obvious when they die what happened.

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Well, GMing afk people is obviously stupid. MPK also does not benefit anybody. If you mpk somebody you're either locked out of reives for 5 minutes or weakened for the same amount of time. So there's not much reason to do it intentionally other than to be malicious.

Again, I don't think it's right to grief others. I just think that when you afk in an area that is not 100% safe, you have to take the bad with the good.

I accept the unintentional bad. That is part of the risk you take anytime you step out of town. The intentional shouldn't exist

I'm willing to bet SE will make some kind of change with this soon. There is no way SE will let it's player's just stand there afk and benefit.

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Originally Posted by Twille

I'm willing to bet SE will make some kind of change with this soon. There is no way SE will let it's player's just stand there afk and benefit.

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I know right? I mean I had to zone a few times to get enough points for these behemoth pops.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

I know right? I mean I had to zone a few times to get enough points for these behemoth pops.

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I agree... It's not like they'd give something to people for doing nothing except for logging in and keeping their character in one place...

Yeah and I totally can't just sit in a spot selling stuff while afk either.

What I find funny is all the mpking is just making people figure how to set up some kind of auto reraise with twilight lol. 1 cheating to counter another not that I'm promoting such things.... but ironically that actually makes it so the afk people can get more xp/balyd and since they get an actual eval from taking dmg a chance for capes

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Originally Posted by dasva

Yeah and I totally can't just sit in a spot selling stuff while afk either.

What I find funny is all the mpking is just making people figure how to set up some kind of auto reraise with twilight lol. 1 cheating to counter another not that I'm promoting such things.... but ironically that actually makes it so the afk people can get more xp/balyd and since they get an actual eval from taking dmg a chance for capes

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That's actually GMable though. I've heard on a forum (therefore it must be true of course...) that people in WKR have been GMed/jailed for setting up an auto-reraise script.

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Originally Posted by detlef

That's actually GMable though. I've heard on a forum (therefore it must be true of course...) that people in WKR have been GMed/jailed for setting up an auto-reraise script.

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That would be pretty hard to prove unless the GM just sat there killing them over and over while attempting to talk to them just to see if they would RR while ignoring him. That's not exactly the sort of thing you do to customers.

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Originally Posted by detlef

That's actually GMable though. I've heard on a forum (therefore it must be true of course...) that people in WKR have been GMed/jailed for setting up an auto-reraise script.

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True but if you aren't an idiot it's even harder to prove than the mpking. Plus you'd basically have to mpk them over and over for it to be obvious that's what's going on and how exactly does that GM call go? So I was repeatidly killing this guy and all he does is get up with rr...

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Originally Posted by dasva

True but if you aren't an idiot it's even harder to prove than the mpking. Plus you'd basically have to mpk them over and over for it to be obvious that's what's going on and how exactly does that GM call go? So I was repeatidly killing this guy and all he does is get up with rr...

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Ha. Okay that's a fair point.

Can we at least agree that while afking in reives is harmless, auto-reraising yourself while afk is gaming the system?

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Originally Posted by detlef

Ha. Okay that's a fair point.

Can we at least agree that while afking in reives is harmless, auto-reraising yourself while afk is gaming the system?

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Of course it is. I mean you have to use 3rd party tools to do it. And even if it is only being used as a counter measure against other people breaking the rules it is still breaking the rules and I'd report it just the same.

I just find it ironic that all these people on there high and mighty horses about regular afking in reives and taking things into their own hands and breaking the rules can and from what I heard is being beaten by those people resorting to actual rule violations and in the end the mpkers are actually helping the cheaters and only hurting the regular people who were afking to make of for lack of play time and such

just did a yumcax run. <2h, but would have been even faster if stupid DDs were AFK instead of pulling mobs on CORs and PKing em

Please put the Yahse and Ceizak colonization and lair reives back the way they were before this update. The colonization reives were perfect. Now they have so little hp that more than one person fighting anything is too many. The lair reives are so weak I duoed one SMN and THF and only the THF got any credit. Please give the colonization reives in Marjami more hp. A small group takes them down so fast it's hard to get evaluations, especially if you're a mage having to nuke for credit because no one is taking damage. I actually liked fighting reives in these zones, mostly farming bayld, but now it seems if I want bayld I'm going to have to go back to doing skirmish bayld runs (enter > hit noetic for bayld > exit, because the weps aren't really worth it and the box is too random) instead because I can barely get 500-1k bayld per reive unless I'm the only one fighting it (which isn't likely). Very disappointed in these reive changes.

Did SE fix the AFK abuse in reives? Apparently you get no more rewards for being a visual obstruction, but I never AFK in reives and the update notes are a bit vague on the issue. Not seeing any AFKers anymore though.

I've spent atleast 8 hours doing colonization reives in Marjami Ravine this week. Usually in that amount of time i obtain a mantle or cape, but that wasn't the case for this week. Has the back piece reward been alterated?

Yes, they killed the AFK bayld farming in reives. On the bad side, they hit it so hard that sometimes even if you do participate, you still don't get anything.

The drop rate on capes was horrible before the update anyway. I've only seen two capes drop, one in marjami colo reive and one from the tree wildskeeper. Now colo reives (especially in marjami) don't have enough hp for everyone to get evaluations in order to get drops if there's a group of 6 or more there.

So far i gotten three before the update. Two for jobs I don't use (BLM and DRG) and one for a Job i retired since the addition of level 100+ equipments (NIN). I miss my NIN with + 39% Double attack on gear only ; ;.

It's probably just a bug. If you check the bug forums it says they already investigating

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Originally Posted by Kaeviathan

So far i gotten three before the update. Two for jobs I don't use (BLM and DRG) and one for a Job i retired since the addition of level 100+ equipments (NIN). I miss my NIN with + 39% Double attack on gear only ; ;.

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I got something like 12 capes, with a record of 4 within 2 hours, although it can go days without a single one. No PUP cape, although I did get a lolRDMmelee cape just prior to update.

Apparently someone spread the rumor that lair reives don't drop capes, because I keep running into people that are surprised to hear I got most of mine from lairs.

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Originally Posted by Kristal

I got something like 12 capes, with a record of 4 within 2 hours, although it can go days without a single one. No PUP cape, although I did get a lolRDMmelee cape just prior to update.

Apparently someone spread the rumor that lair reives don't drop capes, because I keep running into people that are surprised to hear I got most of mine from lairs.

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4 capes within 2 hours. Wow, that is hard to believe lol.
Got one cape today, but for another job that i'm not using (PUP).
So that is 4 capes so far for jobs I don't use.
Also, i've done a couple of Lair Reives, and heard from others that they got drops (NIN piece to be specific).

My FEEDBACK: I'd prefer to obtain a reward of my choosing instead of it being random so I can get this phase over with and move on to get my Delve mega bosses wins.

Can you please make Lair & Colonization rieves separate? (Like "You are unable to enter the Next Lair Rieve for 5 minutes") its pretty annoying to have to go thru an empty Lair rieve (since most of the time no one does them) and then sit out of a colonization one that goes down in less then 5 mins cause of zerg zombies just attacking the roots and nothing else, and with that sometimes you can get no exp at all if all everyone does is chop up the roots >_>

Marjami IS a great alt to Zerg zombie battlegrounds...if there's enough to participate and not lazy bums who just stand there and expect pet jobs to do everything.

Lol dammit! I've obtain my 6th cape last night, all for jobs I don't use. When will this streak ever end? ; ;

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Originally Posted by Kaeviathan

Lol dammit! I've obtain my 6th cape last night, all for jobs I don't use. When will this streak ever end? ; ;

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An option to trade 3 capes for one you want, perhaps? Like they did with empyrean feet drops.

- Fix reive evaluations (jeez, how hard can it be to finally get these right?) so that whatever work is done between your last evaluation -> destruction of the reive target is not lost.

As it stands, if you start getting evaluations, they happen every 60 seconds. If you get an evaluation, keep participating in the reive for the next 59 seconds, and then the reive ends, everything you did in those 59 seconds does not get credited to you in any way.

Or even worse, if you haven't even gotten any evaluations yet (which can easily happen in reives with enough people participating such that the reive target gets zerged down in short order), it's possible for a reive to end with you getting absolutely nothing, because it ended too quickly for you to even receive one evaluation.

- On that note, do not do any more reductions in max HP for reive targets. If anything, they needed to get more HP so that evaluations have more of a chance to happen.

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An option to trade 3 capes for one you want, perhaps? Like they did with empyrean feet drops.

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A useless feature for those who want to collect all the capes, as it would just increase the amount of work they'd have to do. The only way to make it not useless for these people would be to remove the RARE tag on the capes, or give us a storage slip that holds these capes so we can obtain duplicates (yeah, in fact, why haven't we gotten a storage slip 15 for Adoulin gear yet, SE?)

With AF3 feet it was different, because after upgrading a feet (or placing it on storage slip), you could then collect the NQ piece again.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

A useless feature for those who want to collect all the capes

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Useless for people who want all of them, unless you can mule them or a storage option was added at the same time, but what about everyone else? What about someone like me who gets an item or two but has no use for it? Those people get an awesome helpful update. Can you really tell me because its a useless feature for those people, it shouldn't be done, or is itself useless?

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Useless for people who want all of them, unless you can mule them or a storage option was added at the same time, but what about everyone else? What about someone like me who gets an item or two but has no use for it? Those people get an awesome helpful update. Can you really tell me because its a useless feature for those people, it shouldn't be done, or is itself useless?

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I'd rather they just get it right the first time rather than come up with a half-baked plan and calling it a day for several months/years because they think everything is all fine after that. All I was really trying to do was throw out the warning that unless something is done about the capes being rare with no current storage slip option, the "fix" wouldn't really be comparable to what they did with AF3 feet.

Example: the set storer NPCs. The ones that give you claim slips for a full set of NQ armor, and NQ only. Needed the full set to store it, and could only take it out as a full set, and was even charged a small handful of gil every time you did. Could not use any HQ pieces at all, not even a full HQ set. Was it useful for some? Sure, probably. Was it extremely cumbersome for most others? I'd bet so. Was the system also forgotten entirely once the far superior storage slip system came out? I sure hope so.

Greetings,

Below is a message from Producer Akihiko Matsui about future plans for colonization and lair reive adjustments.

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Originally Posted by Akihiko_Matsui

Thank you for all the feedback.

Based on the opinions everyone has been posting, we've been looking into future adjustments, and I would like to share our plans with you.

Please note that this is all still in-development and there is a possibility that changes are made. Also, not everything will be added during a single version update and we appreciate your understanding.

• Addition of ally NPCs and revamps to momentum bonuses
  Similar to campaign, we will be adding NPC participants to colonization and lair reives. Amongst them, there will be NPCs that act as tanks, those that deal damage, and others that support you with various buffs. Also, we'll be making it so each NPC's parameters increase depending on the rank of the Peacekeepers' Coalition.
  
  Additionally, we will be revamping momentum bonuses.
  
  These features are scheduled for implementation in the fall version update.
  
  
• Addition of ways to avoid colonization reive obstacles
  We've been seeing feedback that as a result of the adjustments made which reduced the HP of obstacles and lairs in the July/August version updates it has become difficult to gain Bayld.
  
  As it's very difficult to address feedback asking to make it possible to avoid colonization reives and other feedback asking to make it so Bayld can be obtained better in colonization reives, we'll first be making it possible to get past colonization reives by fulfilling some kind of requirement without having to destroy the obstacles.
  
  Once we have a method in place for avoiding colonization reives, we'll be modifying the strength of enemies and returning the HP of both enemies and obstacles to the state prior to the July/August version updates, which will make it easier to obtain Bayld.

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Im on my 8th cape for jobs I don't use.