Sooo.... Emps?

All three weapons are a grind.
For mythic you grind out the Alexandrite, repeat assaults, Ichor and nyzul isle tokens.
For relic you grind out currancy.
For empyrean you grind out a few NMs.

Out of those, Mythics and Relics (moreso mythics) are the biggest grinds. Yet at 85 and 90, Empyreans were better than their mythic counterparts (with a few exceptions like Kenkonken and Ryunohige) for melee. Why does an "ultimate weapon" thats stronger beat another "ultimate weapon" that takes significantly more time?

As I said before, this is SEs way of leveling the playing field, to make the time:reward ratio more sensible. This is the cockblock that will leave most empyrean holders at 85 or 90. And that's good, because empyreans are not-much-time:one-hell-of-a-reward compared to relics and empyreans.

I hope shit continues to get harder. I'm bored of grinding out easy mode. Abyssea is just grinding out the gear I'm missing still, I'm kinda over it and want a challenge again.

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Originally Posted by Catsby

Perspective. There is plenty wrong with making a dumb new item that drops somewhere and saying "yeah collect 1,500 of these and be thankful we didn't make it 30,000 like alexandrite". Another problem is that this 1500 turn in shouldn't even be a surprise since the test server has been out for weeks. Why the flying fnck didn't anybody notice this earlier?

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They did notice, but the test server was only open a couple weeks and it takes co-ordinated groups to reach the higher levels of voidwatch. No one really had time to get there.

Yeah, I noticed it was 1,500 Heavy Metal Plates while on the test server. I didn't think it would be a huge deal since with a number like 1,500, it should be a fairly common drop. Especially since it's on every single empyrean. This does not seem to be the case, however.

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1)Obtaining a colored abyssite
2)Defeating Yilbegan
3)defeating Dawon
4)Clearing Walk of Echos( confluxes up to that release)
5)Defeating all Visions bosses
6)Gaining hero status in Visions zones
7)Defeating all Scars bosses
8)Gaining hero status in Scars zones
9)Winning bastion defensives in all Scars zones
10)Obtaining 60 Atmas
11)Obtaining all 6 demilune abysites

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I understand what you're trying to say. The quest could have been more inspired than "kill x mob y times" for ever single trial. However, with the exception of 1-4, everything you listed is a bi-product of obtaining something else in abyssea. So people don't need to be required to complete these tasks to obtain an empyrean. They also aren't repeatable for the most part, so additional empyreans would be very easy.

I'm not knocking your ideas. I'm just pointing out they don't really replace the trials in a very balanced way.

Relics, Mythics, and Empyreans all have their share of grinds. Mythic quests aren't better designed simply because they require fun content on top of said grind.

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Originally Posted by Kysaiana

Especially since it's on every single empyrean. This does not seem to be the case, however.

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Looks like we need to start coming down harder and sooner on development.

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I understand what you're trying to say. The quest could have been more inspired than "kill x mob y times" for ever single trial. However, with the exception of 1-4, everything you listed is a bi-product of obtaining something else in abyssea. So people don't need to be required to complete these tasks to obtain an empyrean. They also aren't repeatable for the most part, so additional empyreans would be very easy.

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Well yeah it was just a thought I tossed out at the moment. The idea is that you aren't doing something completely redundant or counterproductive to the new content. I'm sure there are people out there that wanted to go get drops from (insert abyssea NM here) but couldn't because their trial NM was due and they were 2/3. This way you get drops, atma and another step closer to empyrean should you decided to complete the rest of the quest.

I don't really think a quest chain like this would be any less prohibitive than turning in another 100 drops. All you would have to do is change obtaining 60 unique atmas to turning in 60 unique atmas and it would be just about the same. As they are I don't think empyreans are really difficult to get (I have two) just mind numbingly boring. In my opinion the mythic and relic trials need to be toned down a bit since the quest results in a level 75 weapon and even by the standards back then it was way too hard to obtain.

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Originally Posted by Buffy

They did notice, but the test server was only open a couple weeks and it takes co-ordinated groups to reach the higher levels of voidwatch. No one really had time to get there.

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Oh that's good. Let's open a test server to do large scale QA but not do large scale QA and release content regardless if it works or not :/

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Originally Posted by Catsby

That's a whole shit ton of meaningless redundancies. You can't tell me you actually enjoyed standing in some deadend zone waiting for your lottery NM when you could have been doing quests/content that would grant you immediate rewards and ultimately gain you an empyrean weapon. Quests/content like;

1)Obtaining a colored abyssite
2)Defeating Yilbegan
3)defeating Dawon
4)Clearing Walk of Echos( confluxes up to that release)
5)Defeating all Visions bosses
6)Gaining hero status in Visions zones
7)Defeating all Scars bosses
8)Gaining hero status in Scars zones
9)Winning bastion defensives in all Scars zones
10)Obtaining 60 Atmas
11)Obtaining all 6 demilune abysites

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I would lay a carepackage of a hydrogen bomb in front of SE Japan if they did this. Also you speak of the original being redundancies, obtaining all VNM triggers is redundant as hell.

"Whether or not they are "worth it" is a matter of personal opinion. There are probably people out there with the mythic katana or axe that are perfectly content with them."

idk man I spoke to owner of a katana and after he got it he said he was preety let down. major dissapointment

while i do agree more times than not its about the journey and not the destination, If i was driving to disney world and the park was closed I'd be sad panda

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Originally Posted by Falseliberty

"Whether or not they are "worth it" is a matter of personal opinion. There are probably people out there with the mythic katana or axe that are perfectly content with them."

idk man I spoke to owner of a katana and after he got it he said he was preety let down. major dissapointment

while i do agree more times than not its about the journey and not the destination, If i was driving to disney world and the park was closed I'd be sad panda

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Yup yup. The important thing is that the drive can be fun if it's designed to be and the park doesn't have to be closed(Mickey could even be there at the gate to shake your hand and give you a mouse head shaped balloon).

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Originally Posted by Elexia

obtaining all VNM triggers is redundant as hell.

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as redundant as building and killing bukhis 25-50 times? also, it was an example I whipped up with what was available at the time. I'm sure I could make something better or amazing even but that would require me to be reborn JP and get hired onto the dev team.

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Originally Posted by Catsby

1)kill low level NM 3 times
2)kill low level NM 3 times
3)kill low level NM 3 times
4)kill low level NM 4 times
5)kill low level NM 4 times
6)kill low level NM 4 times
7)kill T2 VNM 6 times
8)kill T2 VNM 6 times
9)kill gray path T2 VNM 8 times
10) Turn in 50 Visions NM trophies
11) Turn in 50 Scares NM trophies

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Your list had a few mistakes for Emp to 85.

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Originally Posted by Zagen

Your list had a few mistakes for Emp to 85.

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Right, thanks.

Facepalm. You have to bring 18 persons, half of the peeps get single plates. You need 1500. There is NO chance that a LS will be able to collect from all other members because the treasure pool is individual so you will need to do exactly 1500x2 fights and use exactly 3000 stones on each char. Wtf is this.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

Facepalm. You have to bring 18 persons, half of the peeps get single plates. You need 1500. There is NO chance that a LS will be able to collect from all other members because the treasure pool is individual so you will need to do exactly 1500x2 fights and use exactly 3000 stones on each char. Wtf is this.

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That, by itself, sounds incredibly retarded. I'm guessing it will come down to the pouches, how many they give and how to obtain them. 99 per pouch would make the whole thing a lot more feasible.

yeah keep dreaming that pouches will be easier to get and will yield 99 ^^.

highly doubt it im betting on it being salvage style 20 max per pouch , and in 2-3 updates they will admit it was unrealistic and lower it to 500

Thing I don't get is, Emps right now are massively overpowered in easy to clear trials. They add a stupidly hard and long trial now for 90-95 (seemingly) and the upgrade is junk, why bother? You can keep your emp at 85 and be almost the same as someone with a 95 emp.

I understand they are trying to make FFXI have more longevity again and that means back to the old horrible ways but this is update is filled with nonsense. They are making us work far harder to get upgrades/new gear and spells in this update and they are almost all vastly weaker than what we've got before.

Has anyone actually obtained any plates yet btw? I've yet to see any confirmed drops still.

http://i.imgur.com/32G2z.png

from BG

and 10-1 they are tying to buy time and keep people from flying there the new "content"

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Originally Posted by Gokku

http://i.imgur.com/32G2z.png

from BG

and 10-1 they are tying to buy time and keep people from flying there the new "content"

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See: FFXIV and surplus.

or FFIV: crafting. How to reach max smithing level? craft 2000+ of the same recipe over and over.

Right now if this only comes from VW, nobody will be able to get 1500 on their own, which means like alexandrite, you' ll have to buy.

Someone on my server was bazaaring a HMP for 1m. Not that it's worth that much or that somebody would buy, but can you imagine? 1.5 billion for your level 95 empy.

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Originally Posted by detlef

Someone on my server was bazaaring a HMP for 1m. Not that it's worth that much or that somebody would buy, but can you imagine? 1.5 billion for your level 95 empy.

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JP's... JP's will pay it... and ill love them for it.

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Originally Posted by Arcon

No one is whining about Emps. They're whining about the new upgrade choice, which puts Emps right at where Relics and Mythics are right now (possibly short after Mythics, but before relics in annoyingness).

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Ok so help me understand the Emps were supposed to appeal to the more casual player or not?

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Right now if this only comes from VW, nobody will be able to get 1500 on their own, which means like alexandrite, you' ll have to buy.

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so many people have emps, it will be a long long long time before anyone sells them.

Honestly, I'm more pissed at this point that the jump from 90 to 95 is absolutely trivial in terms of performance gained.

At least the 90's all got decently improved stats, but the 95's are just a complete slap in the face for the effort required. This update just reeks of laziness on SE's part and I for one, think I'm finally done with this game.

I never thought I'd see the day where XIV is looking more promising than XI.

It's pretty much how I called it. The killing part is, people will still do the trial, someone or a few people will get 1500 plates, SE will see this and figured players will do anything they throw at us.

Just like if no mythics were completed, they'd have long adjusted it. While they do have to space content out, I really do think they throw a random number out there for certain things >.>

While Emps are in no way hard, just annoying IE CHORLIS PATH, but there's realistically zero reason to have to collect 175 items. I item from each is enough at the end of the day.

1500 I bet if not serious was just a filler number no one can do in the time it takes them to complete the next set of content, then it will be 1200 plates.

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Originally Posted by Neonii

Ok so help me understand the Emps were supposed to appeal to the more casual player or not?

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Truth be told, I don't think S-E themselves are sure about this anymore. I sensed the curveball at around the 85 cap rise when they required Scars NM items and then stuck it to Bards and Paladins with the Iron Plate/Colorless Soul conditions for their trials.

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Originally Posted by Malacite

Honestly, I'm more pissed at this point that the jump from 90 to 95 is absolutely trivial in terms of performance gained.

At least the 90's all got decently improved stats, but the 95's are just a complete slap in the face for the effort required. This update just reeks of laziness on SE's part and I for one, think I'm finally done with this game.

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Many people keep saying that, but honestly I don't think that's true. I object to the 1500 Heavy Metal plates needed, because that's a completely insane number, but the increase of the stats itself, I have no problem with. I'm pretty sure they did this on purpose to even the playing field between Emps, Mythics and Relics, and in that regard, it's quite a success.

Also, remember that this is just for Lv95. The boost at Lv99 might be quite large again, which means, everyone will try to do this still when that time comes. And I'm still finding it hard to believe that our current knowledge is the only way to obtain the plates. Either there's another way we're not aware of yet, or SE just screwed up on the requirements and will fix it sometime soon, because at the current rate it's just unrealistic.

All the trials of the magian weapons got sweet f*ck all for upgrades this update, it's not just empyreans. Most only got like a few DMG+, cure pot staff got 1% potency, the str/dex/agi/etc weapons only got +2 to the stat and no extra pdt/acc/att etc.

Dear SE,

You meant 150 plates instead of 1500.

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Originally Posted by noodles355

All the trials of the magian weapons got sweet f*ck all for upgrades this update, it's not just empyreans. Most only got like a few DMG+, cure pot staff got 1% potency, the str/dex/agi/etc weapons only got +2 to the stat and no extra pdt/acc/att etc.

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That's really the strange part of all of this. OK, 40 geodes isn't that big a deal except for Flame Geodes (where's the heat, S-E? At least up the drop rates during the matching days), but it really makes no sense to have so little return for the requirements given. I am dreading to find out the Avatar leg's requirement for Staff Trials.

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Originally Posted by noodles355

All the trials of the magian weapons got sweet f*ck all for upgrades this update, it's not just empyreans. Most only got like a few DMG+, cure pot staff got 1% potency, the str/dex/agi/etc weapons only got +2 to the stat and no extra pdt/acc/att etc.

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The sword line only got +1 to stats.

Geode drop rate is tied to weather actually...