I already gave reasons.
More exploration when ur lvl capped with friends so you can do more contents with friends.
Less exploration when your too focused on more grinding.
You and I are veterans, so exploration for us doesn't exist in this game, assuming we explored everywhere in the game already. But I can tell you, newer people can explore more if they choose to durring missions and stuff when they reach at lvl cap since thats when you can start getting things done.
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05-18-2011, 10:18 AMArlan
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05-18-2011, 10:26 AMMeyi
Raise it to 90!
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05-18-2011, 10:36 AMAkujimaQuote:
Originally Posted by Arlan
You missed the point where Avina said things are "irrelevant" then. Irrelevant means that they have no importance anymore. The old content and old zones hold no importance for anyone who just leeched to 90, as is there is no importance for those zones to exist in endgame, they might as well not even be in the game.
Tell me, do you go to Carpenters Landing just to experience that zone for fun? Do you go to Bibiki Bay because there is something important to do there?
They really need to take more care and thought into how to develop and MMORPG. Even in WoW, when Wrath of the Lich King came out... Sure it made all the epics from Burning Crusade near worthless after that, but it didn't allow for 80% of WoW to be skipped through, just so that people could experience endgame content faster. -
05-18-2011, 10:45 AMAvinaNewer players will give up on the game for it seeming 'dead' if they don't find a truely altruistic player who will willingly help them and walk them through the hoops of getting a spot in an Abyssea party as a leech and will also help them make progress in missions. If you are such an altruistic person then really, I applaud you. We need more of you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arlan
Sadly that isn't the case for most of the veterans playing this game. People prefer to just tell the newbie what to do to advance instead of actually doing anything with the newbie. You have to realize that there are plenty of people who don't run into someone like you who is going to help them get a spot in an Abyssea leech party and help them through old content.
Why were things better for newbies before Abyssea? Because everyone had to go through the exact same steps to level up a new job; veterans, newbies, returning players, whenever any of them had to work on a new job to use in the game, they had to do go through the same steps. Veterans playing together with newbies was a built in necessity and how you met people, got invited into linkshells, and so on and so forth.
A newbie has no cruor so can't buy keys, so they can't key their way through levels. They won't be meeting veterans in exp party who can help them because all the veterans choose another mode of exping. The only shot they have at really getting anywhere is to play the game the lonely way, figuring stuff out by themselves and trying to solo to 75, or they luck out and run into a player like you. Given that this is an MMO, players will give up long before reaching 75 if they are trying to play the game alone, so their only chance is to run into someone nice. If they don't, its a tough road... and really hasn't opened up the game for them in any way. -
05-18-2011, 10:59 AMbungiefan
It took me 8 years to get my first job to 75, and I would not want to do that again with any other job. Now I have a second job at 75 thanks to Abyssea, and a couple at subjob level for when the cap is 99. Without Abyssea, I'd never finish the storylines in this game that I want to with the time I have to play.
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05-18-2011, 11:10 AMSparthos
It's already evident this game is dead to new players, what's the point of raising the cap to 70-75 when the damage is done?
There is no way to leech if you're new even if you make your own PT since you cant buy keys and FoV/GoV is an epic grind where you are going to most likely be alone for most of the journey to 75. If you picked the wrong job then you're screwed doubly since certain classes make poor soloers.
Things like Genkai, AF quests and other past times? Dead. This game is Final Fantasy XI: Offline till you reach Abyssea and hopefully connect with some older players who would be willing to give you a taste of other content like perhaps Sky, Dynamis or even things like Salvage/Nyzul.
Knowing this, what would be the point of raising the level cap? Things arent going back to 6man PTs and EXP overall has become trivial as a whole. If you want new content, that's fine but making EXP a grind in a misguided attempt to go back to the old ways or "help new players" is bunk. -
05-18-2011, 11:12 AMNeboI find this interesting because I find these reasons to be exactly why having a low level cap inside abyssea is important in today's FFXI.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avina
The game right now is very top heavy. For what actual NEW players there are coming to FFXI (lets not kid ourselves this number is very small. Returning players a more the issue), the only real way to empower them to join the existing FFXI playerbase is to allow them to reach high level quickly and participate.
Raising the level cap inside abyssea would not accomplish anything good for Square Enix (or the playerbase). Think about what it did. It was a measure to bring back/keep us old time veterans interested with less intense grinding, while simultaneously easing the integration process of new players with a top heavy playerbase.
Joining a linkshell is something you have to do in this game to get anything done and should be a new player's first priority. Linkshells do these abyssea runs on a regular basis to level up sub jobs and more useful jobs to their LS. If a LS is recruiting new members, they will absolutely level up their new players as well.
Even before abyssea, mid level parties were difficult to come by. The veterans that were leveling sub jobs or new jobs were just Astral Burning, chigoe burning, or in an East Raunfaure [S]/Qufim Island level sync burn fest.
Allowing new players to reach high level more quickly is what will allow them to join the existing top heavy playerbase. Not trying to force high level players to go back to do the low level grind again. -
05-18-2011, 11:36 AMAvinaA couple things. I do think that Abyssea has allowed for exactly what you have described to happen in some cases. But I have a pretty newbie friendly linkshell and I know that many of our own players have lamented that they want to actually play the game and not just stand around while they get exping. If they do get to 90 in this method, they then get told that they need to go and grind and skill up because they are worthless since they can't hit anything with their weapons or their magic spells are being resisted. Then they have to go and spam on monsters until they get useful. It's a sucky road.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebo
Yes, having a linkshell as a returning or new player is key in order to get things done, but it was *not* required in order to go through the simple process of just leveling up as it is now. Before Abyssea came out did not do /sea all 1-60 invite to find people search for exp party. I could do /sea all 20-30 invite and get plenty of options, as could anyone other newbie looking to get some exp, and I personally preferred to not wait around for an invite so I often made my own parties so I spent very little time, if ever, standing around seeking.
But to be honest, I have to agree with rog on a point he made awhile ago, to abolish experience points. Because really what they have done with experience points in Abyssea is make you go through a terrible and meaningless chore of trading keys or even just standing around while you hide in some corner somewhere while the party kills dolls. There's nothing to be proud of to have all jobs at 90 anymore, you probably only have three of them that are geared and know how to play and the rest you suck at anyways. So why not just get rid of exp, and get rid of the older content in the game so we can make new content? Why have these things at all if exp is just burned through like it is? SE has made it so that this game is only Abyssea and all worthwhile leveling takes place by standing around in Abyssea, so *why* is exp even there these days?
Again, I like the old game and want it back, but SE seems to have a split personality on how to deal with this issue. -
05-18-2011, 12:19 PMArlanSince you put it that way, What they need to do is add new upgrades for AF3+3 for the old contents they have to keep old contents going as far as endgames go. But raising the lvl cap for abyssea is insane and not the solution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Akujima
They could add new content on the other zones you mentioned as well for more upgradable gear.
Hmm.. I never played WoW and never will since its on PC only and im a gamer who plays on consoles.
But again, I disagree with lvl cap should be raised for abyssea. They can add useful contents outside abyssea for better gear for lvl90+ to keep the rest of the zones usefulness. -
05-18-2011, 12:58 PMPanthera
Leeches are by definition, parasites. Leeches are detrimental to their host alliance by consuming a party slot that could go to a level 75 player. The effect is that for each leech, the ally is weaker than it would be if it had level +75 members. Kills are slower, and experience points per hour is less. While having a single chest-opener is necessary, it can be handled by a Bard or Corsair, who can handle the responsibility in-between buffs. Clearly, having a Bard do double Marches while handling chest opening is better for the Alliance than having a LV30 of any other job performing the same service, but at least the "leech" is doing *something* for the alliance. Where i have a real problem is when multiple people stand around doing nothing, or when they're "helping" with keys when one handle it without assistance.
Do-nothing leeching is unfair to alliance members because higher level members do all the work, the hasting, refreshing, curing, pulling, add controlling, and damage dealing while the leech blocks higher level members from joining. What's more, leeching is unfair to the leech himself as well. Leeching takes away from the accomplishment of gaining a level 90 job. Standing around and doing nothing and then saying,"I have a level 90 Black Mage" is just nothing to brag about. Further, it takes away from everyone else who has that same level 90 job. So what? if you have a level 90 Anything, because anyone can do it just by leeching. It's climbing to a mountain's summit that makes for fine stories, not resting there and enjoying the view.