[dev1024] Job Adjustments - Scarlet Delirium

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Originally Posted by Dart

i just want you two to stop and lets go back to our emo JA discussion.

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Listen man I'm just ready to go the distance to prove myself. That is the only way you can with some people. The issue with SD has been addressed. I can easily use this ability just like i use weapon bash to stun moves with precision and situational use. I just don't think our dark knight job should have to do this considering most other job abilities are beneficial most of the time. I honestly believe at this point the less we even talk about dark knight the higher chance something gets fixed but even then I still have my doubts about that.

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Originally Posted by Chriscoffey

Listen man I'm just ready to go the distance to prove myself..

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try posting a number or two than

math works wonders to prove your point when the whole games math.

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Originally Posted by Jar

try posting a number or two than

math works wonders to prove your point when the whole games math.

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What is better than physically showing you what I am talking about rather than argue about it. Surely Jar you wouldn't argue against a parse which is math in action right? I am betting even if i moved there and destroyed you that you would STILL come up with some excuse as to why I won but as Dart mentioned this is a derailed subject to this topic. I told you what i was willing to do. It's up to you to say YES or NO.

I am using math in a physical form in person to prove something to you where you can't deny it over and over like you have every other posted sentence.

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Originally Posted by Chriscoffey

I am betting even if i moved there and destroyed you that you would STILL come up with some excuse as to why I won

I am using math in a physical form

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Not a single number was said....................

fuckin bored of this now..

gimme something at least to chew on and math out this is just like im talking to a teenage girl who wants to go to the party no matter what i say .......

Edit: changed quote to stuff i laughed at.

like a kid saying ill come beat you at this but i wont do 5 min of 9th grade algebra to talk back.

and the math in physical form that's quite the way to say you don't know shit.

I have given the math already and even said I would physically come to your server and prove it. Man up and say YES or NO not intimidate me with your ignorant troll rhetoric. I have listed sets and variables and even said that certain things are situational depending on the mob you are fighting. What more should i suggest because I can't very well list every single set that I have or would use unless i know what we are fighting. Do you understand now or should i start with my ABC's first? If you can't give me that answer than i accept you don't know what the hell you're talking about and scared to parse against me.

I am very serious about coming there. I know that no matter what math i list you will troll me into oblivion and furthermore IF you had a clue about melee in general you would know to ask me about certain mob attributes vs what i would use. You are more like the girl not answering me directly about saying yes or no and trying to run around in circles about the matter.

EDIT: And your stupidity is one like scientist saying there is no way in hell that something could move faster than the speed of light and ONCE its proven with CERN they now have neutrinos that apparently do. That is the difference between your hypothetical ignorance and proven science in action. Give me an answer unless you are scared to be proven wrong in person.

With that last comment being said.. i shall refrain from derailing this topic anymore.

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Originally Posted by Chriscoffey

Listen man I'm just ready to go the distance to prove myself. That is the only way you can with some people. The issue with SD has been addressed. I can easily use this ability just like i use weapon bash to stun moves with precision and situational use. I just don't think our dark knight job should have to do this considering most other job abilities are beneficial most of the time. I honestly believe at this point the less we even talk about dark knight the higher chance something gets fixed but even then I still have my doubts about that.

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The majority of the time you don't have to use it with precision. It lasts 3 minutes so you can just have it up full time and then if you get hit it activates. And on stuff like VW you are going to get hit at some point and it's going to be for 400+. You can't stun everything and they generally have a lot of AoE moves.

Like T1 Jeuno VW Cherufe last night I just had SD up full time and at point Cherufe would either get a melee swing off on me for 400+ or Crippling Slam would not play nice and go through 3 shadows doing 1000+. Absorb Attribute was also insanely nice as you could absorb Boiling Blood Haste/Berserk. The end result was that I beat the 90 Ukon WAR every pop we did (and we did 12). The result was the same on the 1 T1 Jeuno Roc we did too.

This ability is far from crap. On anything that hits moderately hard that you can melee, it's really good. On stuff that you can't melee so well on it's still ok because all melees die pretty quick so at least when you are alive you're doing substantially more damage.

The only time it really sucks is on weaker mobs that don't hit hard enough to give a worthwhile boost.

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Originally Posted by Soidisant

The majority of the time you don't have to use it with precision. It lasts 3 minutes so you can just have it up full time and then if you get hit it activates. And on stuff like VW you are going to get hit at some point and it's going to be for 400+. You can't stun everything and they generally have a lot of AoE moves.

Like T1 Jeuno VW Cherufe last night I just had SD up full time and at point Cherufe would either get a melee swing off on me for 400+ or Crippling Slam would not play nice and go through 3 shadows doing 1000+. Absorb Attribute was also insanely nice as you could absorb Boiling Blood Haste/Berserk. The end result was that I beat the 90 Ukon WAR every pop we did (and we did 12). The result was the same on the 1 T1 Jeuno Roc we did too.

This ability is far from crap. On anything that hits moderately hard that you can melee, it's really good. On stuff that you can't melee so well on it's still ok because all melees die pretty quick so at least when you are alive you're doing substantially more damage.

The only time it really sucks is on weaker mobs that don't hit hard enough to give a worthwhile boost.

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If you aren't using it with precision then I don't see how it would not be crap, perfect execution is hardly a saving grace, but we'll count it. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt because anybody having this ability up full time is doing it wrong.




However you seem to be highlighting and agreeing with all the things that are wrong with it:

This ability only works when people are playing inefficiently and is more of an afterthought/gamble, then a tactical decision to increase one's performance.

Unreliable.

Works against basic party mechanics for damage mitigation and death prevention.

Niche use; not usable on everything like every other JA is. It could easily be made to be worthwhile on all targets.

Luck based, especially if having it up full time (I don't see how this ability is any good at all if you are full timing it.) There's too much that go wrong, getting pot shotted for 200 dmg as opposed to getting hit for a large %.

Getting hit for nearly all your health means you didn't stun and are doing it wrong, or somebody didn't stun.

*****In the chance that the move we are talking about is impossible to stun then you are relying on luck or Jedi mind powers to predict an incoming attack, because its instant and not preventable.

If you are beating people in a parse then I'd assume you have hate, last time I checked DRK parries like a person with Parkinsons and has the evasion of a Brick wall.



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This boner the dev's have for super large situational use, sucks.

So basically the only thing you said that makes sense is "Absorb Attribute is insane."

I agree.

Having it up full time is not doing it wrong. It's situational. For a lot of mobs the only hits you are going to take are AoE and unless it's diaga or something, they are all pretty damaging. So timing it is actually detrimental for those mobs because the recast timer isn't ticking down whilst you're waiting to take damage.

For example T1 Jeuno VW mobs.

Cherufe - Only Crippling Slam hits you and is unstunnable
Tawaret - Only hits you if you have hate
Yatagarasu - Only Dread Wind hits you which will get off from time to time
Agathos - Ridiculously melee unfriendly
Goji - Dark Orb / Dark Mist / Bloody Claw which it spams so can't just stun
Gugalanna - Only Mow and Lethal Triclip hits you if shadows fail but this is generally really melee unfriendly

So basically, 5 out of 6 of them you are best off just fulltiming it. 3 out of 4 if you're only counting the stuff you'd feasibly melee (Taurus may be feasible but we only did 1 kill and none of the melees could be bothered going back to change from SAM sub to NIN sub)


And so what if DRK evasion/parrys sucks? The last time I checked, a WAR is going to get slapped around just as much apart from Ukko's doesn't cure them yet Catastrophe does cure me. Yes I had hate but did I die? No. And it wasn't because I was cure spammed, I was actually cured the least out of the DD's. I just blink tanked them. Well actually I was SAM sub for the Roc and still didn't really get hit even when tanking.

And you keep saying it goes against party mechanics. If you are in range, you are going to get hit by AoE at some point. Just because I have Scarlet Delirium, doesn't mean I won't throw on PDT or try stun damaging moves. I'm not suddenly going to go 'Oh look a 1k+ move, I'll pop SD and not bother with PDT'. Of course I'm going to put on PDT/MDT and/or try stun it still. Scarlet Delirium just gives me a boost if the move does goes off which it will from time to time.

EDIT: And yes I agree it is not useful on everything but it is useful on the mobs that matter at the moment so I'm reasonably happy with it. The mobs where it sucks are generally either trash mobs or mobs where all melees are rubbish.

I honestly feel sorry for the healer in Soidisant's group...