In the same amount of T3 jeuno/zilart and T4 sandy/bastok/windy vwnm fights, I have seen one friend get 4 different bodies, another got 3 ace's mail on 2 characters, neither can equip it. Me, I got nothing. It really is very very discouraging.
[dev1007] Voidwatch: Obtaining Spoils
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10-16-2011, 06:30 AMTamoa
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10-19-2011, 10:02 AMElanabelle
Hello! Community Developer Rep? Do you see a consistent trend here in the last dozen or so comments?
Care to respond? Would be appreciated. -
10-19-2011, 06:31 PMAtomic_SkullThe conquest point price for cells needs to be severely reduced. 2000 CP per cell is ridiculous.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakamo
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10-19-2011, 08:23 PMKristalHe already responded.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elanabelle
What really should be done, is to analyze the actual droprate on items and their distribution.
If the same very rare(1%) EX item always drops to the same person consistently on x runs, there might be a problem with said distribution, but we'd need hard numbers for a considerable number of fights, not the eyeball numbers and teasetalk that's going on right now. (/p Oh look, another (enter rare item) I don't need. ) -
10-19-2011, 11:52 PMAlderin
As much as I agree how nice it would be to be able to give your friends the 15x body pieces you have got in the chest when your friend hasn't seen one - I agree with SE's decision to be quite honest.
Lets add up how much loot gets dropped in voidwatch per fight shall we? Capped lights drop (5? or 6?) items (lets go with 5). Multiply that by 18 people is about 90 things. Although these "things" might just be synth mats - you might get lucky with a body or 2 here and there, to a lucky person - however Voidwatch rewards far exceed any other event in the game in this respect - due to the sheer quantity of items that drop.
Just cap your lights - and keep on grinding. Gear isn't meant to be given to you on a silver platter in this game. -
10-20-2011, 02:58 AMCamate
I didn't forget about you guys! I’ve been discussing all of your concerns and comments with the team regarding the Voidwatch drop system, and it has taken some time to reach a final conclusion.
It was decided that there will not be any fundamental changes to the drop system to make it possible to add item drops to the treasure pool, as the team does not believe this is not where the main crux of the problem lies.
However! The development team will be making adjustments in the future to reduce the overall length of each battle. In addition, when they add more chapters to the Voidwatch system, and introduce even stronger monsters, the drop rates for these tougher challenges will be increased beyond what is currently in place. -
10-20-2011, 03:00 AMKalilla
<.>.......
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10-20-2011, 03:17 AMByrth
Translation: "We're not going to fix the single largest problem with this system, but we're going to make it harder to kill them with pickup groups."
Sorry Camate, the Dev team is wrong about this. Being unable to move individual items to the alliance loot pool is the single largest issue with this system. If you changed it to that, the system would be fine even with its atrocious drop rates.
Kill speed is limited by proc speed. If it takes you 15 minutes to proc out and cap lights regardless of the opponent, then shortening the battle just reduces the time you have to focus on damage and makes the fight harder. -
10-20-2011, 03:21 AMDaniel_HatcherNo it's not where the problem lies, but it is the simplest fix.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
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10-20-2011, 03:30 AMQuetzacoatl[SIZE="6"]. . .[/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
SO...The Development Team insists that we keep getting crap drops, which even cannot be ADDED TO SPOILS...but they're going to make the fights shorter, thus, reducing the amount of time to proc enemy weaknesses, which leaves very little time for DDs to deal damage, resulting in make the fights THAT MUCH HARDER!? Oh, and we have to wait for the predictable "expansion of this content to raise the drop rates/lower NM respawn times so that they don't lose players!" Not to mention, players getting the same drop they have had before, while other players have yet to see their own good drops, will inhibit group progress even further to artificially increase the game's time sink!
That's it. I'm done. I'm done making suggestions and feedback. I've lost faith in the development team when it comes to making ANY reasonable changes. This is truly outrageous. I guess I'll spend my last time as a test server applicant to test out what I should use for my upcoming Almace for my RDM and BLU, and expand upon my Torcleaver sets.
Camate, I humbly respect your efforts in playing the messenger. I just think whatever Square is thinking is just flat-out wrong. How is it that "add to spoils" could not make things for Voidwatch any better? Whatever the answer is, we probably won't ever know, now that the conclusion is final. -
10-20-2011, 03:38 AMBabekekeThe only way to reduce the overall length of the battle, is to remove the proc system, or reduce the amount of procs required to cap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
Otherwise, harder battles and less time to proc the mob = noone's going to bother.
Sorry, but as Tupac said, "that's just the way it is". -
10-20-2011, 03:43 AMVold
[SIZE=7].................
Orz[/SIZE]
[SIZE=7]
[/SIZE] -
10-20-2011, 03:45 AMReardenTerrible. Why even post that shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
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10-20-2011, 03:48 AMNynja
Alright, lets be honest, SE isnt going to change the VW loot pool distribution, they're pretty adamant about it, its not gonna chance. Perhaps we could look to a solution where X player is getting 3 rare/ex bodies in 4 runs, and players A-F have yet to see one? Someone suggested on "that cesspool of bots and bots" forum a check is done where if player X already has a rare/ex item, and one is supposed to load in their chest, it will (behind the scenes) move to someone elses chest who doesn't have one of the item already.
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10-20-2011, 03:51 AMHashmalumOr make it easier to proc by removing some weakness triggers (Modus Veritas and the merit spells are particularly stupid).Quote:
Originally Posted by Babekeke
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10-20-2011, 03:52 AMVold
Maybe they don't mean making the fights shorter time wise, but with less procs.
Lol though at the conclusion that we're upset with the length of encounters. I guess encounters that are cut in half time wise = crappy drop rates are okay in our eyes. Jeez where do they get these ideas. Sure ain't from the NAs. Who here would complain less if you got the same exact system minus less time being wasted raise your hands.
I rather my time be sinked with lengthy encounters with high drop rates than doing a bunch of short encounters with low drop rates. That's just me, though. -
10-20-2011, 03:55 AMXellith
Well SE just confirmed that voidwatch is not worth the time to do anymore. Why do we play this game again? Oh wait its because FFXIV fails also. I swear this dev team has no idea what it is the players want. We ask for something and we get ignored or something that's not what we even wanted. The drop system fails. Everyone agrees with that. The evidence points to that being the case. Camate go back to those dev team people and tell them that we are not impressed. If making blatantly broken features in a game is how they expect to keep people entertained then they are sorely mistaken. Hell that 3 dollar Eve online I got looks like its going to get more playtime.
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10-20-2011, 03:58 AMDefiledsickness
voidwatch is sh** and if it wasnt for a 'few' accessories, no one would do it. sure there's bodies and weapons that are cool, but not very practical or useful. not worth the 0.00001% drop rates even with full triggers.
20 jobs, 18man allies, and losing even more then 2job's procs because you need 3blm for stun and 2pld to tank.
VW only challange was killing the nms, after you do that once its just annoying. -
10-20-2011, 03:58 AMReardenNo. If everyone checks except the person who is getting the body and he has it, then it loads to no one. This explanation is no different than the Bercus interviews in terms of total amount of tard happening from the DEVs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nynja
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10-20-2011, 04:01 AMTamoa
Poor Camate, having to give us news like that.
But yeah - that is a terrible terrible "fix" to voidwatch. The nms don't need to be easier to proc and/or kill. 30 minutes is fine, battle length doesn't need to be shortened. Upping drop rates isn't going to help our frustration at all when the same player keeps getting the same ra/ex item.
If you can't give us the add to treasure pool option, then at least do something to stop the same ra/ex item loading in the same person's chest multiple times. -
10-20-2011, 04:02 AMRearden
Yeah, like adding it to the pool.
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10-20-2011, 04:05 AMXellith
FFXIV getting bells and whistles and we are getting shafted - yet again.
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10-20-2011, 04:07 AMTamoaI totally agree but you know...:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rearden
SE SAID NO!... (and they are oh-so-wrong in thinking that's "not where the main crux of the problem lies".)Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
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10-20-2011, 04:08 AMHimuraKenshyn
hmmm. make incredible improvements in ffxiv and now slowly convert ffxi back to the days of old and let it die maybe that's the plan........
It's so simple to make drops that can be exchanged at a NPC for something worth while instead of letting things just drop to the floor. -
10-20-2011, 04:09 AMInsaniac
It's 3 kings all over again.
They know no one likes how it works. They just don't care. This 100% garbage, universally hated, worst in the history of MMOs, drop system is in place for one reason. Keep people stuck on this content so they don't have to spend money making more content. The problem is that someone there is too stupid to realize they have gone way too far.
I used to log into these forums to see what exciting new things were happening. Now I log on for new reasons to quit. So nostalgic. -
10-20-2011, 04:10 AMYinnythI must've missed the part where he said existing NMs are going to get harder to kill with pickup groups. You mean the "new chapters" with "tougher challenges"? Yeah, still not seeing any "screw your pickup alliances".Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrth
I do however see something which roughly translates as: "No, you can't haz cheezeburger" -
10-20-2011, 04:21 AMRearden
Camate, feel free to revoke my posting privileges because I have nothing nice to say and what we say doesn't matter anyway.
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10-20-2011, 04:30 AMQuetzacoatl
Again, truly fucking outrageous that they can't just implement
[SIZE="7"]Add to Treasure Pool[/SIZE] -
10-20-2011, 04:33 AMBabekeke/goodbye ^^Quote:
Originally Posted by Insaniac
You can't say that! Poor Bayohne will be even more upset if you feel sorry for Camate after giving us bad news after all the grief everyone gave Bayohne :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Tamoa
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10-20-2011, 04:37 AMByrthIf you had read the entire post . . .Quote:
Originally Posted by Yinnyth
Unless they're going to make it take fewer procs to cap out lights, a straight reduction of HP would make it difficult to cap lights without killing the monster on low tier stuff and hard to kill the monster in time with a pickup group on high tier stuff. Not to mention that you risk of forcing them below 50% HP before capping lights. I was in a pickup alliance that beat the joke that is Akvan with only 30 seconds remaining the other day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrth
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10-20-2011, 04:39 AMxbobx
so Voidwatch people are not going to bother with it, also WoE. Going to get boring fast. Hopefully they actually fix salvage etc and not make it stupid which is their current trend.
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10-20-2011, 04:42 AMQuetzacoatl
Square's never gonna learn, These forums are just an illusion in thinking that Square will actually consider what the players think this game needs, etc.
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10-20-2011, 04:42 AMcidbahamutThat is exactly the crux of the problem though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
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10-20-2011, 04:47 AMuptempoSpeak for yourself champ i for one loved the 3 kings.Quote:
Originally Posted by Insaniac
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10-20-2011, 04:50 AMBabekekeI fail to understand how anyone could possibly love the 3 kings, unless you were botting (or in a LS that heavily botted). I went back to camping Simurgh again recently (before I saw the new +18% boots) and that was bad enough for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by uptempo
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10-20-2011, 04:51 AMNynjaSooo you think everyones drops are generated the moment they check the chest? I'm PRETTY sure the game establishes who got what before they examine the chest...Quote:
Originally Posted by Rearden
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10-20-2011, 04:52 AMRearden
There are 3 options for VW and really, nothing the equivolent of a slack-jawed yokel of a DEV team comes up with is going to be as good as these 3 options.
1. "Add treasure to pool" - similar to Abyssea chests, your treasure goes into the pool for other people to lot if you do not want it. This option will only apply to items tagged "Rare" or "Rare/Ex"
2. "Point System" - similar to Assaults, Einherjar or even ISP/CP/AN. Rewards are valued at x# per Voidwatch fight. Items are valued another varied number of points. Point are traded for items, and in the case of bodies, points+trophies (similar to Dominion ops) from the specific NM for that body. Example, 20k points + 10 trophies from Voidwrought = Fazhuelo Radiant Mail.
3. "Options" - Before the fight, I select one of two options. "Personal Chest" - Everyone in the alliance gets their own personal chest or "Treasure Pool" - Any Rare-Rare/Ex item (And multiple of each can and should load not just one of each) is placed in a treasure pool to be distributed in whatever way deemed fitting.
In option 3, the PUG are protected and the LS's are protected.
Right now, Voidwatch offers zero reward for a linkshell to do the content. I can't reward any member of my linkshell with what they want because I can't use any sort of lotting system in VW.
We know that the JP like VW because it is easily done in Pick up groups, but that doesn't amend our issues with it and those issues need to be addressed.
Your job (Community Team) is to badger the DEV team until they fix this for us. They can tell you "no" 10,000 times but that is somewhat irrelevant because if your job is to represent us then that's what you need to do. Giving us a bullshit response from them as if we should accept that response is in a word, unacceptable. -
10-20-2011, 04:53 AMYinnythYou must not have understood mine. My fault there, I suppose.Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrth
Yeah, I still don't see any "screw you" in there. You can interpret it many ways... maybe they'll be reducing the amount of time you're allowed to attempt the battle, so people time out faster... maybe (like you seem to believe) they'll be reducing the HP of the mob... maybe they intend to make weakness hints easier to understand... maybe they'll increase the number of weaknesses a mob has.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
There are just as many good ways to read into that as bad. You chose to read it as a bad thing because your mind was already made up by the time you hit that point in Camate's post. -
10-20-2011, 04:55 AMRearden
I can only think of one way making the fights shorter would be beneficial and that's if lights cap faster/more lights per stagger. This is SE though, and they said "increased drop rates" which means impossible to cap lights zergs where yeah if you cap them you get items but gl ever capping them.
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10-20-2011, 04:58 AMInsaniacObviously there will be exceptions but I don't really understand how you could enjoy standing around for up to 9 hours a day with a good chance of no pay off what so ever. Admittedly though, kings were less stupid than the VW loot system and probably would have slightly more defenders like yourself. At least when you actually claimed a king you were usually gonna at least get an abj. or BB item to sell to some jobber for your LS bank.Quote:
Originally Posted by uptempo