[dev1010] Dark Knight's Adjustments

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Originally Posted by Urteil

In all seriousness, I might not really like Karbuncle at all, but I'm pretty fucking sure I could remain in the same room with them and actually share a meal.


I hardly want to be on the same planet as Jar.

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<3 love you too

According to Thf friend DE still does better outside abyssea depending on target mob, as for KJ vs Raging I've never heard anythign good about KJ unless you had high attack/buffs. Answer is Ukko's anyway.

EDIT: and you're looking at ftp wrong, Wiki doesn't add ftp of additional hits which is 1.0 ftp. Both are 3.0 ftp at 100%, only thing different is Str mod and Raging crits.

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Originally Posted by Jar

I can agree with the THF part but still not seeing how wars lackluster crits (not with blood rage up) would pull ahead of the extra 15% str

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15-18% crit dmg is lackluster? (did war get tier 2 crit dmg trait?)

War has critical attack bonus 2. It's 8% iirc.

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Originally Posted by Neisan_Quetz

According to Thf friend DE still does better outside abyssea depending on target mob, as for KJ vs Raging I've never heard anythign good about KJ unless you had high attack/buffs. Answer is Ukko's anyway..

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he may not be building for it correctly :\. the WAR thing, I Can agree its probably very close.

Evisc's lows/highs are probably wider than DEs, but in average Evisc is Better, As long as you gear for it correctly. This means Emp+2 Legs, Loki's, Qirmiz Tathlum (optional. In the air rather its worth using outside Abyssea over Raiders. Don't think it is. Inside theres a chance). Helps if you have the DMG:+7 Crit.Dmg+6 Yahtagan, That thing is beast.

Over-all, If all you do is eyeball they'll probably look very close, but My non-SA evisc outside can peak over ~1,800 on some things, my DE will generaly hover around 1,500. (Rough rough rough Estimates)

Aside from +2 Emp he's trying to finish I can't think of much he's missing short of relic/mythic/empyrean weapon, although I don't remember what mob he was fighting so /shrug, he just complained he actually needed to use DE again.

Yah, DE seems to favor a Small Spread, its "Reliable". I.E it'll generally do a Steady amount of Damage. Evisceration Will have those "low Peaks" rarely, But averages much higher in the long run.

So I can understand from eye-balling (or lets face it, Force of Habit for using DE for like 5 years) it feels that way :X

I know i was doing the limbus the other day and my Evisc were average ~1200-ish, then popped a DE for like 1,300, and thought "/sigh" then i popped a Evisc shortly after for 1796 and remembered why I loved it, it peaks higher, and generally spreads out in the end to be above DE :P

For the record, I fully expect dark knights to be among the top damage dealers now, especially the ones with their equipment finished up. I'll have to level up my warrior a bit, so I can have both support jobs available to me (that and samurai).

Regarding the weapon skill idea, I am sick of seeing Insurgency and Guillotine. I want a new weapon skill. I even know what I want it to look like. Three hits, stat modifiers of STR 70% and INT 50%, skillchain attributes of Darkness and Transfixion, and the first hit is certain to be critical, with an increased chance (dependent on TP) of critical hits from the other two attacks. The character first brings the scythe upward diagonally from the lower right, spinning around that way for a horizontal slash, then keeps spinning into the air, slamming the scythe downward at the head of the mob. With all of this, the scythe's trailed by a black-and-purple streak of light, and the ending attack creates a spiraling black hole effect, with the mob being gravitated and twisted into it.

I have a few comments to make. Last Resort increase and the new job trait are undoubtedly nice. However, those two updates will not change nearly enough to get Dark Knight out of it's proverbial slump.

What I STRONGLY believe is that SE needs to focus more on our weapon skills and our magic (specifically dark magic) if SE plans on getting all of us Drk fans back into the game. For starters, Drk does Need a critical hit weapon skill; however, the modifiers for the majority of Drk's weapon skills NEED to be fixed as well. I seriously hope that Square Enix gets rid of the Mnd modifiers and chooses to use modifiers that are inherent to the Dark Knight job.

With regards to magic, SE needs to give us REAL MAGIC spells as opposed to the tier 3 elemental spells that we have been plagued with. Doom, Amnesia, Plague, Death and a myriad of other dark magic spells could and should be implemented. Bio III would also be a long overdue addition to Drk's list of spells. Furthermore, Dark Knight should have an A+ skill rating in dark magic. Drk's are not nukers or enfeeblers, we specialize in dark magic and we deserve to have that distinction.

I personally have Quietus and I can honestly say that it is near worthless. It angers me and everyone else that worked hard to get our weapon skills only to have them yeild little to no benefit over the weapon skills that we already had.

So to conclude, Square Enix we are glad that you have started to listen to the Dark Knight community and we greatly appreciate the effort you have RECENTLY shown. With that said, all of us Drk's primarily need you to fix our apparently broken weapon skills and for you guys at SE to give us the MUCH NEEDED attention with regards to our rather under-performing list of spells. We specialize in dark magic and I would stongly advise you to focus you're attention on that concept when contemplating the rest of the update. I fell in love with Dark Knight the moment I started playing the game and I will always be a Drk, but it feels like the EXTREMELY hard work that I have put into the job has been blatently ignored by Sqaure Enix and I am begging you not to let my years worth of hard work go to waste.

I really, really don't understand why people are still asking for a Crit WS. The new VIT-Crit calculation is OBVIOUSLY being brought in to address the crazy crit WS numbers. Anyone thinking otherwise must be worried theur crit jobs aren't going to be game breaking anymore.

No one TOUCHED Evisceration before Abyssea. It was all Dancing Edge. And King's Justice was damn good in Merit Parties Pre-lv80. Crit WS are what they are in game now because of Razed Ruin, it's simple as that.

Providing we keep the 25% haste from Desperate Blows (which I have my doubts about, I wouldn't be surprised if it stopped after 30 seconds), I think this'll easily be the boost DRK needs for it's melee damage. I'm also an avid fan of Souleater, throwing out two back-to-back SE Guillo's is more than going to make up for not getting a 6k crit WS especially as I won't be killing myself in the process. Heck I'd be happy if they left it at 5%, at least I could get 2 WS out before dipping majorly below 50% of my HP.

I suspect the first Stalwart Soul will being the HP penalty down by 5% (lv45 being subbable, people might be tempted to add 5% of their HP to their WS for a 5% boost, as opposed to adding 10% for a 5% boost, if that makes sense).

Anyway... carry on

So SE gave Drk Critical Attack bonus to nerf Critical hits?

This is a good start SE but you still need to address our 2-hour ability, its really embarrassing dncs basically have this ability to use whenever they like. Blood Weapon should not be a 2-hour but rather a regular job ability, please give us a worth while 2hr every job has a better 2hour than drk.

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Originally Posted by Kagato

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Also, it's Ignore Defense trait needs to be boosted. 10% chance at 100TP is kinda low.

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It's not a 10% chance to ignore defense. It just ignores 10% of the target's DEF. It's basically the same thing as 10% attack boost on the WS.

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Originally Posted by Sedres

No one TOUCHED Evisceration before Abyssea. It was all Dancing Edge. And King's Justice was damn good in Merit Parties Pre-lv80. Crit WS are what they are in game now because of Razed Ruin, it's simple as that.

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except no and no. Evis was becoming a rising favorite among anyone who could use it, originally it was only if you had x's, then people started figuring out its crit rate, now with all the crit dmg gear its even more obvious. Raging rush was always the top ws unless you were using mighty strikes. The only difference between then and now is that the gap wasnt hugely massive. But my point is in pretty much all cases, if a weapon had a crit ws, it was the better ws', that was true even before aby it just wasnt horribly obvious.

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Originally Posted by Sedres

No one TOUCHED Evisceration before Abyssea. It was all Dancing Edge. And King's Justice was damn good in Merit Parties Pre-lv80. Crit WS are what they are in game now because of Razed Ruin, it's simple as that.

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That's just incorrect. Before Abyssea Evisceration was better than DE with the right armor. (Admittedly it was X's Knife, and Preferably Mandau main-hand). But it had its chance to shine thanks to X's Knife. It wasn't widely known/accepted due to what was needed to make it worth-while, but it wasn't a straight universal "DE > EVIS".

Secondly, Times change my good sir. it doesn't matter what we did pre-abyssea, considering what we've gained since then. (even though the whole "DE > Evisc" Was wrong back then, Its just Evisc wasn't reliable enough to be considered superior, it did have higher damage spikes to any THF who bothered to toy with it, its just back then the relatively limited gear options for Crit+DMG and Crit-hit-rate made it undesirable)

We've gained access to a multitude of more Critical hit Damage+ armor and Job Traits since Abyssea. Outside of Abyssea, Given perfect gear for it, a THF could get +30% Critical hit Damage (OMG SAME AS RAZED RUINZZZ). Their Critical hit Rate would be lower, But not by enough to make it worse than DE.

Dominion-Jambiya Perfect x2 - (12% Crit Damage combined)
Job Trait - 8%
Loki's - 5%
Qirmiz Tathlum - 5% (according to Wiki)

So while yes, Before Abyssea it was less than desirable without the proper gear up to X's Knife and preferably a relic, Since Abyssea We've gained a lot of Armor/Traits to make use of that Ability, its not Abyssea-Specific. Out-side of Abyssea a properly geared THF will always win with Evisc over Dancing Edge.

ON topic of the VIT-Crit Nerf. I've addressed that already, Just read one of my earlier posts... Its there somewhere.

But anywho, Congratulation DRKS >.>?

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Originally Posted by Nariont

Raging rush was always the top ws unless you were using mighty strikes. The only difference between then and now is that the gap wasnt hugely massive. But my point is in pretty much all cases, if a weapon had a crit ws, it was the better ws', that was true even before aby it just wasnt horribly obvious.

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We did this math to death on BG and found out that unless you had (I believe it was, it's been a while) a 22% critical hit rate or higher, King's Justice would outperform Raging Rush on average. That required something like +35 DEX for a Mithra and nearly +45 DEX for an Elvaan on Greater Colibri (with Claymore Grip and Zahak's Mail) and even more for most other monsters. So, overall you could say that King's Justice is better, unless you have a very particular set of gear for Raging Rush.

so for the average drk this update helps but its not enough is what we are all coming to conclusion correct? an wth, when did drk forum start talking about thf an wars ws other then to admittedly q.q bout them vs us ?

Hey Therin, I see u have a map of Raleigh if thats raleigh, which I think it is. I am in Morrisville.