New 99 trials

I'm fine with this. With the small number needed I imagine people will farm ADL and sell for around 10 million gil each. Each ADL kill would be guaranteed 10-20 million gil.

10x20=200 million gil. This is attainable for most players that already have a relic.

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I'm fine with this. With the small number needed I imagine people will farm ADL and sell for around 10 million gil each. Each ADL kill would be guaranteed 10-20 million gil.

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We know it's attainable, and we know people will do it (hell people were shouting to buy the stuff as soon as it was leaked/dat mined). It would of just been nice if they added a trial we could take part in, like kill counts or something instead of buying the crap off mercs or rmt.

Oh well, a handful of people are going to get very rich from this. Hopefully they can find a good RMT site to sell all the gil on.

Somehow I can't see people farming Arch Dynamis Lord for the purpose of selling the upgrade item. If so, it's going to be sold for a lot more than 20mil. Otherwise I'd say it simply won't be worth it, and each person in the alliance would make more doing less work by farming currency.

I know many people still want Shadow Gear, Archon Gear and Sagasinger, so it isn't quite "18 people fighting for 1 person" as there are other drops to go around. Nevertheless, I take issue with SE's misleading statement that the trials will be accessible by the majority of the playerbase. Only large LS's do ADL, and the mob is not susceptible to PUGs.

If they added VW final tier mobs that are DL and PW clones it could work I guess.. lol

On the bright side, we now know that SE isn't trolling any one job or event but they're trolling everyone.

At least it's BALANCED now. Everyone gets trolled on.

i'm sure this is in retaliation to certain players getting a lot of attention for saying the game was "too-easy" with [A]

you can thank them <3

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

I'm fine with this. With the small number needed I imagine people will farm ADL and sell for around 10 million gil each. Each ADL kill would be guaranteed 10-20 million gil.

10x20=200 million gil. This is attainable for most players that already have a relic.

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10M for a marrow is just not enough. The price is more fair at 18-20M which would mean 400M to finish a 99 which is more than getting a relic in the first place.

You think 400M for a single upgrade is reasonable?

Further, there will be supply issues make no mistake. Even at 20M/marrow very few LS will waste their time doing this with the chance of failure always present and the manpower just not being there in todays FFXI for most shells. 20M sounds like alot of motivation to run Xarc but that also means sacrificing other runs to get the buyer their drop.

tl;dr This trial is epic fail.

Seen 2 different bazaars selling Umbral Marrow, both for 30 mil. Worst thing is, I'm certain there are players out there that will buy them at that price.

Ok so assume every person on Bismarck that has a relic weapon wants to upgrade it to 99. Then assume that each person had 17 other people that would help them everyday. They each pop ADL at 15 minute intervals. All poped drop one item. Ok so it would take the 240 relic weapon holders a total of 3,600 minutes to all pop one and get one item. It would take them 72,000 minutes to pop them all and everyone have 20 items. 72,000 minutes is equal to 1,200 hours or 50 days. Now this is saying they each went in and no one was already there. They were able to walk right in kill ADL and leave. And that they did this every time they were able to enter on their alloted 15 minute time period. This is why it needs to be changed to kills rather than items. Because realistically its going to take an average person 8 months to finish this one trial.

It shouldn't be kills either. These trials shouldn't involve ADL or PW at all. Think about 6 months from now when people are finishing new relics and everyone else in their LS is done. Those people are largely fucked.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

I'm fine with this. With the small number needed I imagine people will farm ADL and sell for around 10 million gil each. Each ADL kill would be guaranteed 10-20 million gil.

10x20=200 million gil. This is attainable for most players that already have a relic.

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Please stop crapping thoughts out of your head. LSs able to kill ADL will have relics to upgrade. 9 of 10 umbra that drop will go directly to the delivery crate. The ones that don't will be sold for 20-30 mil.

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Originally Posted by Chikamatsu

[...] This is why it needs to be changed to kills rather than items. Because realistically its going to take an average person 8 months to finish this one trial.

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I consider myself an average person, and I can tell you right now I won't ever be able to get in and kill ADL 20 times for my item. I'm not in HNMLS and doubt would join one again to slave out DKP points for 2+ years for my turn at upgrade. Of people I'm acquainted with, that are competent relic holder you could maybe make a 12-man alliance, but they are all in different LSs etc. The rest is either blisted for NM dramas or I've never spoken to. There are maybe 5-6 NA+JP LSs on my server that could consistently fill in 18-man alliance to farm ADL on daily basis, but they are the Dragon's Aery elite. They will cater only to themselves and looking at this trial conditions, no one should be surprised. One VW run I was in, a leader of such group was openly talking that they hate inviting outsiders for Botulus/Ig-alima to hand out free clears to noobs. Also, he was telling all outsiders, they would be kicked from party if not playing properly.
LS capable of killing ADL/PW will never bazaar out items. Low-manning this trial is impossible, getting pop set and making PUG group is impossible (no one will join for free and even if they do join for some reason, good luck coordinating everything perfectly for the zerg with inexperienced people.)

Empyrean trial is by far the easiest and actually achievable, people do Ig-Alima/Botulus every day and you can repeat this fight to your heart's content and people will gladly join because everyone has a shot at treasure pool from box.
If zeni plates are changed to 1000 points per plate, I can see PW trial getting achievable too before your grandchildren grow up, albeit you can't low-man/PUG this fight either because there are no rewards for participation to 17 other people.

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Originally Posted by Camate

[...] this is considered to be the weapon’s complete form and is also the one the developers expect most players can achieve. They don’t want to dangle a carrot in front of everyone saying, “you can make these weapons even more powerful!” and then make it so only small fraction of players achieve this.

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Yeah, right... if I quit my job, family and friends, maybe.

The Relic/Mythic 99 trails are a huge slap in the face to the remaining FFXI players with these weapons. Relics especially.

Here is the problem most people do not have a big linkshell but rather a small group of friends that still play FFXI.

You can pug people easy for stuff like VW and the Empyrean weapons since everyone is getting something out of it and people are use to joining pick up groups for VW. Also you can just buy the Empyrean items because a random person who not upgrading them will want to sell them. I seen a lot of these selling for 300k.

Nobody is going to farm ADL because the alliance all agreed they want gil from selling his drop.

But there is no way you can pug a bunch of people to kill ADL, you won't getting people willing to waste their dynamis lockout helping you, when they could be making 1.5m solo getting currency.

These trails are no way attainable by most people except the Empyrean one, just based on how the game works now which has been much smaller groups.

It would be a lot more reasonable if the Relic/Mythic trails were changed from drops to kills. That way I can shout for people with relics team up with them all get our trails done. Its a logistical nightmare in FFXI now to kill a NM 20 time for 1 person that requires almost a full alliance and 20 days of work. Then doing it all over again for whoever else in the alliance needs the drops.

This may just be the straw that broke the camels back, if this goes live I probably won't be playing this game any longer.

To SE you really need to start listening to your player base instead of flat out ignoring them.

I don't think people understand that items or kills, nether relic or mythic stage 1 should be Arch DL or PW. Those should stay as stage 2 only. Stage 1 in relics case should be DL. In Mythics case something aside from PW. Most people won't even be able to kill Arch DL 20 times per weapon/shield/horn. Changing it from items to kills still doesn't change the fact that most won't get this trial done if it is still Arch DL. So don't kid yourselves if you think 20 Arch DL kills is obtainable by most.

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Originally Posted by Dew

I don't think people understand that items or kills, nether relic or mythic stage 1 should be Arch DL or PW. Those should stay as stage 2 only. Stage 1 in relics case should be DL. In Mythics case something aside from PW. Most people won't even be able to kill Arch DL 20 times per weapon/shield/horn. Changing it from items to kills still doesn't change the fact that most won't get this trial done if it is still Arch DL. So don't kid yourselves if you think 20 Arch DL kills is obtainable by most.

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The fucking trial should just be lowmanable period.
I would rather go through 10000 metatron killshots to normal mobs solo again (pre nerf trials) then molest my shellmembers with these fucking trials.

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Originally Posted by Dew

I don't think people understand that items or kills, nether relic or mythic stage 1 should be Arch DL or PW. Those should stay as stage 2 only. Stage 1 in relics case should be DL. In Mythics case something aside from PW. Most people won't even be able to kill Arch DL 20 times per weapon/shield/horn. Changing it from items to kills still doesn't change the fact that most won't get this trial done if it is still Arch DL. So don't kid yourselves if you think 20 Arch DL kills is obtainable by most.

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It still would be a lot easier if it was kills. I already know a lot of people with relics that would want to do this. Some of them can dual box alts so they got the smns covered. I can shout for people to fill out the rest of the slots. So many people have relics that it would be fairly easy to fill out the rest of the slots in the alliance.

Doing this isn't even a option with it being drops, because nobody would want to join or even attempt to do it.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

It still would be a lot easier if it was kills. I already know a lot of people with relics that would want to do this. Some of them can dual box alts so they got the smns covered. I can shout for people to fill out the rest of the slots. So many people have relics that it would be fairly easy to fill out the rest of the slots in the alliance.

Doing this isn't even a option with it being drops, because nobody would want to join or even attempt to do it.

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That would work for the first 2-3 months maybe and then what? new relic upgraders that need those again can do what? Look at a wall and dance happily?

Lets be realistic even ADL or PW Kills is very far from the optimum...

normal Dynamis Lord kills would be far reasonable and more lowmanfriendly.

tera na release around may 1st ~~ couldnt of been much better timing with the way this has been heading in a while now....

ffxi loved ya for years but the times coming soon :(

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Originally Posted by ShadowHeart

tera na release around may 1st ~~ couldnt of been much better timing with the way this has been heading in a while now....

ffxi loved ya for years but the times coming soon :(

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Hope to not disappoint you, but NCSoft has asked for a permanent and temporary injunction on TERA. Since Bluehole the korean developers were found guilty to have stolen codes in Korea. Seems the people that made that game are ex-employees that were working on Lineage 3 and when NCSoft shelved the project they stole artwork, codes, hardware to make this game. Some of the devs in Korea received jail time.

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Originally Posted by Nordya

Hope to not disappoint you, but NCSoft has asked for a permanent and temporary injunction on TERA. Since Bluehole the korean developers were found guilty to have stolen codes in Korea. Seems the people that made that game are ex-employees that were working on Lineage 3 and when NCSoft shelved the project they stole artwork, codes, hardware to make this game. Some of the devs in Korea received jail time.

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Waiting for a game that never comes out would be more fun than trying to complete these trials.

Since I'm actually living in Korea right now, I have access to K-TERA ^^; My FFXI accounts are going to be deactivated any time now (whenever SE decides to try taking the non-existant Crysta out of my account), so I mught just pick up TERA again. I think my character was level 40 something in TERA, but I stopped playing it a while back when I was spending more time in FFXI.

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Hope to not disappoint you, but NCSoft has asked for a permanent and temporary injunction on TERA. Since Bluehole the korean developers were found guilty to have stolen codes in Korea. Seems the people that made that game are ex-employees that were working on Lineage 3 and when NCSoft shelved the project they stole artwork, codes, hardware to make this game. Some of the devs in Korea received jail time.

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Damn it, I was waiting for this game.

Seriously, does noone even THINK about WHY SE chose to do it like this?

Headcount system would require people to equip said relics, which means some jobs can upgrade MULTIPLE relics at the same time, while others cannot upgrade any at all because they are for jobs not desired at ADL kills. And once people finished their relics, those that haven't finished it are still square out of luck.

Item drop system allows people to come as any job needed to kill these NMS, and SE can simply tweak droprate by adding multiple drops into the mix by using procs, TH, etc.

So heavens forbid you have to spend 18 months on a final relic weapon.

If you are worried about people no longer coming to kill ADL, stage 2 should be changed to 1000 kills. That would give relic 99_1 people incentive to help others get 99_1 while they get to work on 99_2, without them leeching items off the 99_1 trial people.

Shout in Jeuno right now: " <Riftdross>800k<Riftcinder>1m<Sell?><Port Jeuno>gs"

Awesome, just awesome.


As for this:

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Originally Posted by Kristal

So heavens forbid you have to spend 18 months on a final relic weapon.

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Are you really ok with that? I mean, really? Do you really think that is reasonable for FFXI in 2012? Do you really think that is reasonable for one trial stage?

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Originally Posted by Tamoa

Shout in Jeuno right now: " <Riftdross>800k<Riftcinder>1m<Sell?><Port Jeuno>gs"

Awesome, just awesome.


As for this:



Are you really ok with that? I mean, really? Do you really think that is reasonable for FFXI in 2012? Do you really think that is reasonable for one trial stage?

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People are running around like headless chickens without looking at the possibilities.
I'm ok with it, because it's still 1 relic a month if you pool the drops. But that probably isn't even gonna be needed.

Call me an optimist, but if each ADL drops 1 Umbral Marrow, that could means a minimum of 2 marrows each fight. The more he splits, the more marrows drop. Splitting wouldn't be the problem.. it would be the solution! Granted, you might lose out on a chance for a Sagasinger if you time out, but you still end up with several UMs.

It would also explain how SE expects even a single stage 2 weapon to be completed, as an entire server working together cannot complete that trial in any reasonable timeframe unless there's a way to increase drops to much more then 1 a fight.

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Originally Posted by Kristal

Call me an optimist, but if each ADL drops 1 Umbral Marrow, that could means a minimum of 2 marrows each fight. The more he splits, the more marrows drop. Splitting wouldn't be the problem.. it would be the solution! Granted, you might lose out on a chance for a Sagasinger if you time out, but you still end up with several UMs.

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The clones dont drop items...killing clones prolong the fight, a fight that realistically can only be won while your melee are under the effect of Perfect Defense, so you've only got 90 seconds.

Would you skip your dynamis farming time to instead go farm and pop ADL every single day?

We have 11 relics in my ls (I think, unless I forgot somebody). The idea of killing 220 Arch Dynamis Lords makes me want to slam my head against the nearest brick wall. I love my ls, but no, just no. No way.

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Originally Posted by Nynja

Would you skip your dynamis farming time to instead go farm and pop ADL every single day?

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I'm sure she is planning something fair. like paying each person 2 mil a run for their time and effort.

The dumbest idea that is coming out of the "it's not that bad camp" is that people not working on a relic would be willing to do ADL every day for a month. Let alone a year.

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Originally Posted by Insaniac

The dumbest idea that is coming out of the "it's not that bad camp" is that people not working on a relic would be willing to do ADL every day for a month. Let alone a year.

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There is a word for thows:

Hypocrites

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Originally Posted by Kristal

Seriously, does noone even THINK about WHY SE chose to do it like this?

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I have a theory why they did this, They are pushing the game back into a competitive state where players take advantage of other players, or constantly complete for pops and drops, building anger between them. As long as players hate each other the people at SE probebly think they will fall off the player radar. Notice they didn't seem nearly as publicly hated back when 75 was big, players then start working together for a common goal 76+ they start turning on SE. Pro tip: Funding an MMOs development via the revenue of its subscriptions is a good idea, pushing it elsewhere is not. (Though that decision may have come from above the FFXI team.)

The other theory which I once thought was a joke, (may be more serious then I thought) is they make FFXI fail until XIV looks more appealing.

Every time I say "There's no way SE is stupid enough to..." the following phrase is something they inevitably turn out to be stupid enough to do. I have said "There is no way SE is stupid enough to try and get people to play one of their MMOs by making them hate their other MMO." quite a few times. So, it's probably true.

The simpler explanation would just be gross incompetence, but I suppose SE is the exception rather than the rule.

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Originally Posted by Nynja

The clones dont drop items...killing clones prolong the fight, a fight that realistically can only be won while your melee are under the effect of Perfect Defense, so you've only got 90 seconds.

Would you skip your dynamis farming time to instead go farm and pop ADL every single day?

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Keep in mind there are several changes in stores, some of which should make the fight less of a zerg. Reduction of aoe damage to untargetted players and pets, for instance. If the fight can be done without relying on 1 specific 2-hour ability, and there's a system in place to increase UM drops, then there's no reason to change the planned trial requirement.

As for farming and popping ADL each day.. yes, I would. Even if it takes months and I'd have to solo or PUG every last pop item so my ADL pops can be zerged once or twice a week. Those moogles can stick stage 2 where the sun doesn't shine, though. Not gonna fork over 2~20 bilion gil, even if I had it...

The changes to aoe dmg are vw only afaik.

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Originally Posted by Nynja

The changes to aoe dmg are vw only afaik.

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Yeah, Since they posted a specific list of mobs in VW and not even all VW mobs just the top tier NMs in each path I would imagine it's only the specifically listed mobs

And youre going to essentially stop farming dynamis, stop upgrading any AF2+2 u want to upgrade, stop farming easy currency...to spend the next year pushing everyones relics to 99 for no benefit to yourself?

Bull...

blah... I don't know when you fell off the reason tree Kristal, but as of late no matter the thread i can't help but think you should apply your signature to yourself.

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Originally Posted by Nordya

Hope to not disappoint you, but NCSoft has asked for a permanent and temporary injunction on TERA. Since Bluehole the korean developers were found guilty to have stolen codes in Korea. Seems the people that made that game are ex-employees that were working on Lineage 3 and when NCSoft shelved the project they stole artwork, codes, hardware to make this game. Some of the devs in Korea received jail time.

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Umm no one over here in SK has received jail time, maybe if they were in the USA. At the worst it'll be a few million won (1 USD = 1100 KRW) fine and a suspended jail sentence.

IP aren't particularly well respected in the corner of the planet.