Petition for new Forum Button: Dislike

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Unleashhell

no point of even having the Like button either tbh.

---

Pretty much! ^^b Like

It's funny to see people still using the same idea: Abuse. People already abuse the like feature! Look at the trend in this post! People are liking, the people who are against the original idea of having a dislike! The people who are for it are getting a like.

The point is, I highly doubt most MOD sit there and read through 10 pages of utter nonsense from the same 5 trolls who try to post and say that the idea of the OP is no good, for x invalid reason. There are some of those people in this thread already. They just enjoy watching their post count go up.

If you for some reason fear the ZAM and or other forums who rate down players or not, then fine so be it. The reality is: Even if you're disliked, if you have a valid opinion, a topic and a coherent thought people will like it. If you just sit there uttering non-sense the idea is that people will dislike you.

Abuse aside, please. Just drop it. What are your other thoughts on the issue?

There are hundreds of posts here a day, what if the majority of topics are simply skimmed by devs to find "Like" or not. Perfect example is the WS thread. How many posts are made, that have solid positive feed back and are left in the dust with not so much as a post from Camante saying: No, because of x and y.

People have been asking for polls for a while now, this would be an easy way to see it. No one is asking for them to set: Sub-Default for players who get rated down 1000 times. Simply a Side By Side view of Like and Dislike, logical posts still appeal and provide strong backing to subjects and posts. There's no reason why someone who wants something to happen to simply click "Like or Dislike" look at how that's going already, people still click like then post their opinion to support it.

So try to look at it that way, it's not so we can ruin people's forum reputation on here. It's so that individual threads made can be rated and viewed appropriately in the sense of: 34 likes vs 80 dislikes.

I have an account on ZAM, I'm rated Default. Do I cry or care about it? No. Does it stop me from posting when I have something to post? No. So unfortunately I can't say I care much about a rating system that's with you like a STD for life, but I am interested in being able to see how many people actually DISLIKED the WS Thread, how many people DISLIKED the choice of 99 vs 100, how many people actually like the idea of expanded and useable inventory space, how many people LIKE and DISLIKE the cheese sandwich idea. There's a hundred threads that could use this, and it might even make our ideas speak out louder than 500 posts and expecting a MOD to read them all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by scaevola

Rate-downs are still available on individual item entries, and they are quite useful for parsing information.

---

Like how people can rate down other people's screenshots and comments? Just like my profile page comments are all rated down, just because some people either don't like me, or don't like the person that's posted the comment. Not because the comments are bad/negative/rude/nasty/offensive in any way. I'm certain at least half of all rate downs on pics and comments across FFXIAH is based on the person posting. How is that useful in any way?

Adding a dislike would help, Only if it makes the dislike(er) Post a reason why. Could even make the like(er) post a reason why also.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Krashport

Adding a dislike would help, Only if it makes the dislike(er) Post a reason why. Could even make the like(er) post a reason why also.

---

Now that's constructive.

[QUOTE=Krashport;243467]To many would use and abuse it, Also that would be lazy. Just think we wouldn't be having this conversation now.

Actually reading 700 posts on why something is a bad idea is a waste of time. Noticing that it has 7,000 dislikes, and deciding to read the cliff notes instead is just common sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Krashport

Where is your proof?

---

Proof of "likely"?

well you see the average percentage of posts that a mod reads is adversely affected by the number of cheese sticks in a string cheese carton, and the gravitational pull of the coffee...

And that's about as much proof as you have that I'm wrong, so I guess its a wash.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Krashport

I would differ, You wouldn't be talking to me now if it didn't have an effect on you.

---

I never said that. I said: "Me knowing what you like or dislike has no effect on what gets added to the website and / or game.".

Meaning that seeing as I am not a Dev, or forum mod, Making me see your opinion has 0 relevance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tamoa

Like how people can rate down other people's screenshots and comments? Just like my profile page comments are all rated down, just because some people either don't like me, or don't like the person that's posted the comment. Not because the comments are bad/negative/rude/nasty/offensive in any way. I'm certain at least half of all rate downs on pics and comments across FFXIAH is based on the person posting. How is that useful in any way?

---

It's relevant in that people not liking you probably tells a lot about the value of your opinions. The devs don't need to take advice from people who piss everyone off. They do a great job of pissing everyone off on their own.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

It's relevant in that people not liking you probably tells a lot about the value of your opinions. The devs don't need to take advice from people who piss everyone off. They do a great job of pissing everyone off on their own.

---

I'm sorry, am I getting this right? - the fact that some people dislike me because I'm in a linkshell they don't like/friends with someone they don't like/they heard from a friend's friend that I'm a bad person/they're envious/they still hold grudges from the hnm days back at 75 cap, and rate down every damn comment on my profile page, has anything to do with the value of my opinions? Because believe me, there is a LOT of rating down on FFXIAH, on everything possible but especially on profile comments, that is 100% personal and nothing else. That's what happens to me and many other "high-profile" players (as in very often on the most viewed list).

I don't come here, or on any other FFXI forum, and spew a bunch of bs, calling people names and purposely insult them. I have always tried to be civil in forum posts (although I willingly admit I have nearly lost my temper a couple of times on this forum but I still do try to keep it as civil as possible). I hardly "piss everyone off", on any FFXI forum I regularly use.

A lack of likes can tell you just as much about a specific post on this forum, as a bunch of dislikes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tamoa

I'm sorry, am I getting this right? - the fact that some people dislike me because I'm in a linkshell they don't like/friends with someone they don't like/they heard from a friend's friend that I'm a bad person/they're envious/they still hold grudges from the hnm days back at 75 cap, and rate down every damn comment on my profile page, has anything to do with the value of my opinions? Because believe me, there is a LOT of rating down on FFXIAH, on everything possible but especially on profile comments, that is 100% personal and nothing else. That's what happens to me and many other "high-profile" players (as in very often on the most viewed list).

I don't come here, or on any other FFXI forum, and spew a bunch of bs, calling people names and purposely insult them. I have always tried to be civil in forum posts (although I willingly admit I have nearly lost my temper a couple of times on this forum but I still do try to keep it as civil as possible). I hardly "piss everyone off", on any FFXI forum I regularly use.

A lack of likes can tell you just as much about a specific post on this forum, as a bunch of dislikes.

---

Yes. I know there are cases of people who just plain don't like a person (the like button is just as susceptible to this), but for the most part posts are getting likes on here due to relevance and quality. If a post / thread doesn't have a large number of likes/dislikes, they are not likely going to judge it based on the like/dislike count. If it does have a large number of likes / dislikes, it is highly unlikely that that person just has a million haters. I mean how many people do you really think are following your every post? If you have pissed off that many people, what does that say about what you are posting? Probably that it is generally not what other people want / like, and thus shouldn't be taken into account.

Please don't take this as a personal attack on you. I'm simply trying to point out that while there are going to be people that press like on all their friends posts, and would "dislike" all the people with opposing views, the bulk will use it as intended. This isn't alla where you can just make 1,000 accounts and stalk your enemies.

I'm starting to think, Frank you have more then 1 Square Enix accounts and have ya LS buddies and their other Square Enix accounts liking your post. "Not saying that is a bad thing" I'm ok with the Like and dislike for only the main OP it might help the Dev's out a bit, But using the dislike, Said person should have to post a reason as to why cause anyone could just check a button it also might shed light onto a problem to said change to something. Also those with more then one Square Enix accounts do benefit more with the like/dislike buttons. Me personally I look at the read more then the Like button myself its just there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Krashport

I'm starting to think, Frank you have more then 1 Square Enix accounts and have ya LS buddies and their other Square Enix accounts liking your post. "Not saying that is a bad thing" I'm ok with the Like and dislike for only the main OP it might help the Dev's out a bit, But using the dislike, Said person should have to post a reason as to why cause anyone could just check a button it also might shed light onto a problem to said change to something. Also those with more then one Square Enix accounts do benefit more with the like/dislike buttons. Me personally I look at the read more then the Like button myself its just there.

---

I agree with making people post a reason. even if its just a short one. Keep in mind though, that the kind of people logging into multiple accounts and spamming dislike, are not going to be adding anything useful to the conversation anyways. They have no logical argument other than not liking the person, and being able to "dislike" something may save us all from a one line post written just to taunt the person or derail the thread.

That said, I don't think it should show how many people "dislike" something, so their efforts would never be recognized. Which I imagine would be the whole point of trolling someone.... to publicly ridicule them.

I do have multiple accounts BTW, but can't be bothered to log in and out of them. My web browser keeps me logged into this one. I would have to keep that stupid key fob with me every time I wanted to swap accounts.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amador

This forum is due for Dislike Button that rates a persons post down on a separate side that shows how many people DISLIKED, as well as how many people LIKED the post.

I feel that "Messengers"/Forum Admins simply skim over subjects.

If the idea and work ethic is to "Pick and Choose" a certain post, find a thought in it. Write it down, then eye ball a % saying, "30% of people seemed to have disliked that idea" If that is all that is submitted to the Dev Team.

Then perhaps a "Dislike" feature would better "ease" the job strain on forum admins. If they could just actually tally up the # of Dislikes vs Likes.

It's getting really sad when you log onto here, after you actually spend some time trying things and testing things on test sever only to find that your opinions, thoughts and concerns don't really go as far as to bend, touch, stress, or even concern the Dev Team.

This is not just a personal idea, this is a collective idea from multiple people. It's not just the NA side, the JP side has a long list of complaints regarding the lack of attention, and care that the forum admins, and devs give towards our Feed Back.

Like this Post if you agree that we should have a "Dislike" Button for clairty.

---

I suggested this along time ago and got no where. I'm all for this.

ive wanted a dislike button on here and facebook for like ever but i think people feel lt'd be too "Dramatic" lol. It is sad that people cant handle a little criticism.

Dislikes really aren't that important, unless you have no spine?

If someone posts something stupid, be a man and Call them out for being stupid, Don't hide behind a - Symbol. Works wonders, Say it to their face :D

Plus, Dislikes can and will be abused in every instance of their existence... Human nature to be petty, wanting to feel important, etc.

While all intents will surely be masked in some noble cause to "help new people distinguish good posts from bad", Its a load. FFXIAH-pre-removal and Alla as it exists now are both proof -/+ are nothing but popularity contests, and rarely judge a person based on the content of their post.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Dislikes really aren't that important, unless you have no spine?

If someone posts something stupid, be a man and Call them out for being stupid, Don't hide behind a - Symbol. Works wonders, Say it to their face :D

Plus, Dislikes can and will be abused in every instance of their existence... Human nature to be petty, wanting to feel important, etc.

While all intents will surely be masked in some noble cause to "help new people distinguish good posts from bad", Its a load. FFXIAH-pre-removal and Alla as it exists now are both proof -/+ are nothing but popularity contests, and rarely judge a person based on the content of their post.

---

Except sometimes being a man means arguing for pages with the jack ass posters like the one in my sig. Its sad that less knowledgeable players have to read an entire thread of nonsense to figure out that the guy doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. And the whole concept of being a man on an internet forum about video game wizards and crap is pretty far fetched. WHat happens on alla and FFXI-AH is irrelevant. This forum here is monitored by SE, with the intent of getting feed back from players, and like/dislike button is a lot easier to translate than 77 pages of arguing.

This game is like 10 years old, which means that everyone on this forum is old enough to move up from the T-Ball little leagues where both teams win every game. You can't "be a man" and also be all hyper sensitive about the number next to the thumb. The two things are mutually exclusive.

The problem with the whole like/dislike system is you have absolutely no way of knowing just what was liked/disliked---was it the poster, was it the idea, was it the presentation....people are free to click away with no responsibility for detailing what they like/dislike.

Because it allows an anonymous response that is devoid of any accountability, these systems typically fall short of their real intentions. It would probably have been better for SE to have never even added the like system....still haven't made up my mind whether I like it or not. Seemed like a good idea at first, but sometimes I wonder....

I vote for a dislike for the dev posts only.

Not for members tho

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rezeak

I vote for a dislike for the dev posts only.

Not for members tho

---

Now that I can aprove of.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RAIST

The problem with the whole like/dislike system is you have absolutely no way of knowing just what was liked/disliked---was it the poster, was it the idea, was it the presentation....people are free to click away with no responsibility for detailing what they like/dislike.

Because it allows an anonymous response that is devoid of any accountability, these systems typically fall short of their real intentions. It would probably have been better for SE to have never even added the like system....still haven't made up my mind whether I like it or not. Seemed like a good idea at first, but sometimes I wonder....

---

Even if you take away the like button, this would still happen. There is no way for a mod to know (without caring enough to follow up on a persons history) whether a person is arguing a point because it is a valid point, or because they just dislike the OP and / or one of the other posters.

It's quite obvious if you read these forums a lot, that many people don't just use them for game feedback, but instead use them as outlets for things like: creative writing, venting anger, increasing their post count, practicing their debate skills... the list goes on. The dislike button is simply an easy indicator for a team that most likely doesn't take any of what we say seriously, if they read it at all.

Dislike buttons promote unbridled negativity which is why facebook sensibly refuses to have one. if you want to vote on dev features, it would make more sense to request voting options or even the ability to 'have a say' on whether features get implemented. I doubt you'd get that either though as SE have mostly always marched to the beat of their own drum.

is it ironcal that i hit the "Like" button on this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Except sometimes being a man means arguing for pages with the jack ass posters like the one in my sig.

---

Adding a dislike button won't stop that.

It never will. Again, FFXIAH-Pre Removal, and Alla as it stands, Both solid proof of that.

Ratings will always remain a popularity contest, they serve no purpose... I was even against the "+" System.

No.

In this forum 7 - 10 people camp ALL NEW TOPICS

When a New player come here with a Idea even if is a Silly idea. If that idea Dont like the 10 campers, they will PERMA RATED DOWN every new Topic that player do.

Or when a new player come with a silly question, will be called troll and perma rated down, if a person do a mistake in analisis this guys will try Humillate and make feel bad that person in agresive way.

A system like that only will promote the Elitism and will give control to the "Forums Campers"

I fear more the "Agresive Elitist Posters" Than the silly trolls lol.

Even the troll more terrible cant compare an angry elitist poster.

The Elitist poster usually show you in a terrible, hostil and agresive way "You are a stupid" he dont stop until let you totally owned and humillated.

This forum in my opinion is a Light forum and is friendly to the FFXI comunity.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Adding a dislike button won't stop that.

It never will. Again, FFXIAH-Pre Removal, and Alla as it stands, Both solid proof of that.

Ratings will always remain a popularity contest, they serve no purpose... I was even against the "+" System.

---

Adding that button would immediately tell the devs that everyone disagreed with what that guy said, and save them from reading 30 pages of people explaining exactly why it was stupid.

Look at this thread. 1400 views. 64 posts. I would bet my favorite body part that a large number of those people have an opinion about this topic, but are not willing to get into a huge debate to express that opinion. Right now, the thread has 40ish likes, and ............0 dislikes.

Ratings are and should be a popularity contest on a feed back forum. The object is not to find the post that has the coolest wording, or the best lay out, or even the best idea. The object is to find out what your customers want.

Alla is a fan board. People do not log in using their registered account, and can spam, curse, troll, and rate down with impunity. This board is run by SE, and they are far stricter about that sort of behavior.

You could easily follow me around every thread, and follow my every post with one liners about how dumb my ideas are, or how weak my character is, or how crappy my ls is, or just how lame the color of the text I use is. You could derail my every thread, by using crap arguments that have been argued in any one of the other forums.

I really don't see how a little thumbs down arrow should worry me, or anyone else for that matter, and I definitely don't think that not having it is stopping people who want to be dicks from doing it.