Treasure Hunter Testing

Did they change that you can get rare drops if everyone in your party already had them?

No, He'll skew the results unless he drops one.

Or he only plans to test Raxa? or pop Ulli

I don't really remember raxa being that rare. It's been at least 2 years since I've farmed a diorite though so idk.

yeah I remembered the whole ra thing before I continued. I did stop to kill Ulli but I also left for the day because weekends are best for bazaar sales :x I'll start my trials again tomorrow.

I never saw a single raxa back at 75, granted I didn't see a billion hours doing end game up there. Still, raxa has been documented as much as diorite to be around the same drop rate of 1-2%ish. Of course as we all know a wiki is just a wiki so best case let's just say the truth is about 10%. So far I'm seeing about a 10% drop rate increase on them both with TH3+. That's from my personal memory, hence why I'm bothering with /thf farming. These things are dropping left and right for me so it's time to see what TH2 can do. Eventually I'll get several hundred kills and see how it pans out over time but I suspect I'm going to end up seeing TH3 giving a considerable boost to raxa drops, and diorites themselves having received a boost in drop rate for the new Sky era.

I have very good reasons to hang around in sky to make money so I really should end up with thousands of kills to see one way or another just what the deal is. I'll *try* to make the farming even between THF and /thf but I stress it's hard to not farm on THF so THF will probably end up having more data than /thf. If nothing else my current plans are to at least get 1k kills on war/thf to document. Yeah... very good reasons to live in Sky these days.

That's great man =) Post your infos here and I will add it to the OP.

Here's some LOL numbers to celebrate the start of my grand journey up in Sky:

WAR/THF - total goal today - 100 Aura statue kills, even if it means dropping diorites.

100 Aura Statue kills, goal complete.

Drops overall - 6 crests, 3 high crest, 9 golem shards, 4 geodes, 47 mythril ores, 0 raxa, 11 diorite.

11 for 100 on diorite. 0 raxa.


Now I'm going to get on THF and do the same exact thing just to see how things are comparing to each other after a mere 100 kills.

Round 2 - same test but as THF/NIN +3 in TH gear

100 Aura Statue kills, speed killing with few TH procs, about half of the kills had TH7 on, with 8 being very rare before statues ran out of HP.

9 crests, 6 high crests, 5 geode, 7 golem shard, 53 mythril ore, 0 raxa, 7 diorite


Results, though small, are interesting to say the least.

Final Round 3 tomorrow - same test as THF/NIN but slow killing for TH procs, no weapon skills, pure melee, SATA as much as possible. Generally my best results with TH7+ on nearly every single mob, TH8 will probably end up on half of the kills or more, and very rarely 9. After wards I go silent for a few weeks but I suspect when I return to this thread I'll have a far higher kill count. All depends on my will to mass kill Byakko. I won't be throwing away diorites anymore after tomorrow's test.

I thought TH could only increase item drops to 50% drop rate?

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

I thought TH could only increase item drops to 50% drop rate?

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Why would you think that?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

I thought TH could only increase item drops to 50% drop rate?

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It probably is only 50%. A larger sample size would likely show the average dropping slightly.

Despite it only being 100 sample, it's quite clear that TH 3-8 isn't making anything like a substantial difference.

If anything it makes me think back to the old 'moon phase' urban legend. Or perhaps just what the mob had for breakfast that morning?

Going to post my Carabosse data. So far all but 1 have been done with no yellow, and that single one yellow was spammed (it was dispel -.-) so effectively none had yellow:

11 Carabosse
1st Gem (100%): 19/19
2nd Gem: 16/19
Card of Voyage: 16/19
Coin of Voyage: 0/19
All had TH between 7 and 9 inclusive.
No data for Afflictors/Hachimaki as I couln't be bothered having them fill up the treasure pool and having to toss them each time so have one of each on both characters (r/e).
I'm upset that TH seems to be having no affect at all on the coin of voyage drops. Are they only able to drop with a yellow proc?

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Originally Posted by noodles355

I'm upset that TH seems to be having no affect at all on the coin of voyage drops. Are they only able to drop with a yellow proc?

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I've only ever seen them drop with yellow so I believe that is the case.

Yeah, they're grellow only. All the drops they added in that patch to Scars and Visions are like that, with one grellow and one base drop.

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Originally Posted by Shiyo

I thought TH could only increase item drops to 50% drop rate?

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Nah the feather data we have shows that TH2/3 bumps them up to about 60%. Their base being about 25%. This lines up with the 2 reroll theory for TH1/2 and shows that TH3 either does almost nothing or does something we don't understand yet.

Added Volds numbers to the running totals. Left out the seals and geodes due to the drop rates being skewed by 5minute timers and weather/day. Still looking pretty grim for TH3+.

171 kills with TH0 net me:

2 Diorites
1 Raxa
17 Mythril Ore
10 Golem shards
47 Light Crystals

About to start round 3. Additional goal today and from here on out: make note of TH level per diorite and raxa drop when on THF main. Expectations: 15 diorite, at least some raxa when TH8 or higher is in effect. Let's see how it pans out... edit with results coming in a couple hours.

Just broad observations so far, pooling between TH2 and TH6 and comparing to TH0:
* Raxa Drop rate is approximately the same in all cases
* Golem Shard drop rate is approximately the same in all cases
* Diorite Drop rate is dramatically higher for TH2/6
* Mythril Ore drop rate is dramatically higher for TH2/6 (~10% -> ~50%)

It makes me wonder if only specific slots (for instance, the first two) are enhanced by Treasure Hunter. Once again, we fall into the Treasure Hunter testing trap of not knowing the item groupings for this monster. Vold, if possible could you check what the item groupings are? Like, "Can I get a Mythril Ore, Golem Shard, and Diorite off the same kill?"

I have a 249 kills here. It's an oldie, so probably not that useful considering the possible drop rate changes.

Drop rates:

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Aura Statue (Killed 249 times with TH ??)
      23 beastmen's seal              [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,092]  [Drop Rate:    9,24%]  [% of Drops:    4,69%]
        1 chunk of diorite            [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,004]  [Drop Rate:    0,40%]  [% of Drops:    0,20%]
      57 chunk of mythril ore        [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,229]  [Drop Rate:  22,89%]  [% of Drops:  11,63%]
      25 golem shard                  [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,100]  [Drop Rate:  10,04%]  [% of Drops:    5,10%]
      17 Kindred's seal              [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,068]  [Drop Rate:    6,83%]  [% of Drops:    3,47%]
      362 light crystal                [Max #: 3]  [Items/Kill:  1,454]  [Drop Rate:  84,74%]  [% of Drops:  73,88%]
        5 square of raxa              [Max #: 1]  [Items/Kill:  0,020]  [Drop Rate:    2,01%]  [% of Drops:    1,02%]

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Groupings:

Code:

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      Dropped  0 items    23 times (  9,24%)
      Dropped  1 items    66 times (  26,51%)
      Dropped  2 items    85 times (  34,14%)
      Dropped  3 items    50 times (  20,08%)
      Dropped  4 items    22 times (  8,84%)
      Dropped  5 items    2 times (  0,80%)
      Dropped  6 items    1 times (  0,40%)

    Number of times each group of items dropped.

      53 [  21,29%] -- light crystal
      52 [  20,88%] -- light crystal, light crystal
      23 [  9,24%] -- Nothing
      16 [  6,43%] -- chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, light crystal
      15 [  6,02%] -- light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        9 [  3,61%] -- golem shard, light crystal
        9 [  3,61%] -- chunk of mythril ore, light crystal
        8 [  3,21%] -- chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        6 [  2,41%] -- chunk of mythril ore
        6 [  2,41%] -- Kindred's seal, light crystal
        6 [  2,41%] -- beastmen's seal, light crystal, light crystal
        5 [  2,01%] -- beastmen's seal
        4 [  1,61%] -- beastmen's seal, chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, light crystal
        4 [  1,61%] -- beastmen's seal, light crystal
        4 [  1,61%] -- golem shard, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        3 [  1,20%] -- chunk of mythril ore, golem shard, light crystal
        3 [  1,20%] -- light crystal, square of raxa
        3 [  1,20%] -- Kindred's seal, light crystal, light crystal
        2 [  0,80%] -- golem shard, Kindred's seal, light crystal
        2 [  0,80%] -- beastmen's seal, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        2 [  0,80%] -- golem shard, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, square of raxa
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, golem shard
        1 [  0,40%] -- beastmen's seal, chunk of mythril ore, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, golem shard, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of diorite, chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- Kindred's seal, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, Kindred's seal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- beastmen's seal, chunk of mythril ore, light crystal, light crystal, square of raxa
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, Kindred's seal
        1 [  0,40%] -- Kindred's seal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, golem shard, Kindred's seal, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- golem shard
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, golem shard, light crystal, light crystal, light crystal
        1 [  0,40%] -- chunk of mythril ore, Kindred's seal, light crystal, light crystal

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Does your grouping thing maintain the exact order things dropped in? I've noticed that things always drop their items in the same order (if the slot fills). If that's the case, then you can limit it down to:
Slot 1: Diorite
Slot 2: Mythril Ore
Slot 3: Golem shard
Slot 4: Beastman/Kindred Seal
Slot 5: Party 1 Light Crystal
Slot 6: Party 2 Light Crystal
Slot 7: Party 3 Light Crystal
Slot 8: Raxa (could also reversed with slot 7)

For reference, and a reason why I think "first two slots" may not be correct, Jailers have:
Slot 1: Virtue
Slot 2: OAT weapon
Slot 3: Torque

So if it was just "First two" it wouldn't affect the torques. Admittedly, I don't have any kind of a parse proving that TH affects torques, but it just seems unlikely that it doesn't.

Did you that possible grouping out of my post? Idk if the drop order was preserved. Could have changed if the chat bugged i guess, so i'm not sure.

One curiosity: although i didn't get both beast and kindred dropping, seems like they are reserved in different slots. Beastmen being before mythril ore and kindred before the light crystals.

That's true. I'd always assumed they were in the same slot, but I guess there's no reason to assume that really. Also, if you were killing multiple Aura Statues with multiple parties (potentially up to 3?) the order could be a little messed up if you killed two at the same time.

Half way done. Current numbers @50 kills:

9 diorite, 28 mythril ore, surprisingly I'm still sitting on 0 raxa.. , 7 golem shards

Diorites

TH6 0
TH7 6
TH8 1
TH9 2
TH10 0

Started to keep count of procs alittle late, may kill extras to reach 100 for comparison.. undecided, but would need 20 extra kills:

Kill count
TH6 4
TH7 15
TH8 8
TH9 2
Th10 1

What I would like to do is get a 100 count for each TH effect, just to see the numbers. That's gonna take a few days though...

KParser doesn't retain the order that items drop. Items are stored in the database in the order they're encountered and not revised beyond that. So even if it dropped in your theoretical order, Byrth, if you got a mythril ore the first kill, then a diorite and mythril ore the second kill, the order in the database would be 1. mythril ore, 2. diorite.

As for the groupings, those are only sorted by number of drops, and then I think the items list is alphabetized.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laphine

I have a 249 kill TH2+2 parse here. It's an oldie, so probably not that useful considering the possible drop rate changes.

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What TH was on? And did you toss/use Diorites?

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Originally Posted by Laphine

Did you that possible grouping out of my post? Idk if the drop order was preserved. Could have changed if the chat bugged i guess, so i'm not sure.

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From what I can tell, chatlog maintains drop order even among extreme lag. Some things seem to be chronologically inseperable, others not. AoE damage, for one, is not, neither are additional effects. Critical hit notices and their corresponding damage message, as well as used abilities are, as far as I can tell. I'll need to add that to my parser as well, could determine possible groupings algorithmically.

How sure are we with the whole 1 crest every 5 min deal? Is that limited to everyone in PT or just per person? because I'm seeing 2 kindred's crest in my pool right now.

You can get one seal/crest every 5 minutes per party in your alliance. You can get one crystal every kill per party member with Signet.

that was an old parse as i said (back from jan 2010). Was implying that there was no new level cap. And diorite seemed to be much rarer as well. Anyway, it was only one party with 3 ppl with a very bad luck too lol.

damn internet...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vold

How sure are we with the whole 1 crest every 5 min deal? Is that limited to everyone in PT or just per person? because I'm seeing 2 kindred's crest in my pool right now.

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It's more less 5min. If you pay attention, you'll see that the old seal will drop to someone's inventory within like 30s of the new seal showing up. Happens a lot when I duo etc. Seals drop almost precisely every 5min if you've got good killspeed.

Final results - THF/NIN slow kills, no WSs, solo THF DPS, sleeps for SA, TAs on RDM - deducted first 20 kills for extra 20 kills:

Aura Statue X100
Procs on statue when it died:
TH6 - 12
TH7 - 48
TH8 - 32
TH9 - 6
TH10 - 2

Bottom line - TH7 or better on 88 kills.

Drops

Mythril Ore - 66
Diorite - 18
Raxa - 0
Golem Shards - 15

Diorites

TH6 - 1(1/12)
TH7 - 8(8/48)
TH8 - 6(6/32)
TH9 - 2(2/6)
TH10 - 1(1/2)

Little bit surprised I didn't see a single raxa. Ah well.

Tidbits of interest, groupings:

1)Ore, shard, crest, geode
2)ore, geode
3)ore, shard, crest
4)shard, crest
5)ore, crest, geode
6)ore, diorite, crest
7)ore, high crest
8)ore, crest
9)diorite, geode
10)ore,shard,crest
11)ore, shard,geode
12)crest,geode
13)ore, shard
14)ore, diorite

This is all the different groupings of 2+ drops that I got when I started keeping track on the second half of testing, in order. Someone else can discern what is what in it. My brain hurts after doing this test all day.. I am pretty certain though that ore is first and diorite is second at the very least. Diorite always followed Mythril ore unless no ore dropped, then diorite was first. I have signet but beastmen control sky atm so no crystals or seals. My quick guess - ore, dio, shard, crest, geode, raxa(raxa is always last in my experience.... I think.)

I also kept up with Mythril ore to an extent.. TH8 might be off by 1 or 3 ores that 7 got instead. I think I was spacing out near the end there but for the sake of things I'll just assume the below:

TH6 - 5(5/12))
TH7 - 38(38/48)
TH8 - 18(18/32)
TH9 - 3(3/6)
TH10 - 2(2/2)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Byrth

You can get one seal/crest every 5 minutes per party in your alliance.

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This is not true. Farming carabosse duo whm+thf, 1 party, no alliance, I often had 2 crests/high crests in the pool at the same time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by noodles355

This is not true. Farming carabosse duo whm+thf, 1 party, no alliance, I often had 2 crests/high crests in the pool at the same time.

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I remember the same thing, happened right after I defended this assumption too. Since I've never seen it happen with Seals, I'm guessing it's Crest-exclusive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Arcon

I remember the same thing, happened right after I defended this assumption too. Since I've never seen it happen with Seals, I'm guessing it's Crest-exclusive.

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I've seen it happen with seals, when we were farming for the Key Item before entering the Cuchu mantle BC. We took it to be sort of an inverse-salvage glitch, where the game thinks we're two parties but we're actually one.

Regardless, I did a shitton of fast merit parties without seeing two seals in the pool at the same time. Some friends used to cast lots on seals in their merit parties to try and get them to drop faster, and it didn't work. If that rule is wrong, it's not far wrong.

I'm thinking it might have gotten ninja-changed recently, because the first time i noticed it I was like "wut?" but then it happened a heap more times.

Well.. the samples are too small to say definitively but if the rates hold up when the samples are bigger the only thing I could think of is that TH works in tiers... And the tiers would be your 3rd or 4th reroll. I guess that would kinda make sense for SE. We would see no increased drop rate on standard trash mobs because they would die before TH procs, but anything that took a little while to kill would see the benefits. From your numbers I would say 1 tier would be at TH7 but it's extremely early in the sample to make that kind of assumption. I'm actually excited to see more numbers now.

I'll update WAR and THF kill count every 200 kills. Slow killing is kind of murder on the attention span so I might stop at 500 for that. It's not going to be 1,000 or 10,000 but 500 kills is still a moderate kill count to get a idea of probable drop rates with procs in effect on a grand scale. Also, every time I farm I plan to at least leave with 1 diorite for Ulli kill, and the target kill count will be 50 per trip. So I will still be dropping diorites. They seem plentiful enough anyway.

I'm not a fan of wiki numbers. Sometimes what I see on there and what I see in game are far different. I prefer to test for as long as possible to cut down on those skewed numbers. Like for example I'm 1/1 for tav bell on my last four trips to farm it for people. Now it might be possible that I could go down there and go 4/4 in a row but really, that's going to be damn improbable. I want to avoid the "luck" factor with this testing as much as possible.

I still expect to see raxa drop rate rise at least some but it's probably going to be far less than my presumption of 10%. Maybe it's still early but after 320 total kills and 0 raxa with TH2-10, I'm pretty damn sure that 10% guess is way off and I was catching some luck before on multiple trips.

my 2010 kills showed 2% drop rate for raxa lol.

Found myself murdering some more birds for science this morning:

THX (assumed TH3)
Lesser Colibri
Name Drop rate Drop rate (%)
Colibri Feather 122/207 58.9%
Colibri Beak 96/207 46.4%

TH4
Lesser Colibri
Name Drop rate Drop rate (%)
Colibri Feather 16/24 66.7%
Colibri Beak 15/24 62.5%

Combined with my previous data, that brings the totals to:
THX (assumed TH3)
Lesser Colibri
Name Drop rate Drop rate (%)
Colibri Feather 231/389 59.4%
Colibri Beak 193/389 49.6%

TH4
Lesser Colibri
Name Drop rate Drop rate (%)
Colibri Feather 47/70 67.1%
Colibri Beak 38/70 54.3%

Think that's big enough for TH3 sample, gonna move on to TH4 and TH5 next. I wanna keep upgraded TH4/5 procs seperate, in case upgraded TH behaves differently from gear TH (I suspect not).

Also, funny thing... was in an alliance of 3 parties (1/1/2 people for most of it), and I never had more than one Seal in the treasure pool, and we got seals regularly (average time between seals < 6min, but bever < 5min).