I agree with the reward/effort ratio. Getting job points is about as hard as getting merit points were when they first came out. People need to just stop the abyssea merit farming, and fight content that is relevant for their level. I already have 6/10 in sneak attack, 5/10 in trick attack, 4/10 in larceny, and 1/10 in mug. What were people expecting to cap out job abilities the month is came out?Quote:
Originally Posted by Afania
What I disagree with is that blu does not have great job point categories. The best one of course is the increase in spell points. The cap was 60, but it will be 90 when the cap on job points increases. That is godly, a 50% increase. Increases in base damage of spells, percentage increases in skillchain damage, conserve MP when chain casting the most powerful blu spells, how are any of these not great? The only bad one was learning chance, but that is being replaced with a passive accuracy bonus, and accuracy is very important in end game.
I guess I can live with steal not having much of a cool down reduction. Most of what I saw in the job points for thf was an attempt to make its job abilities useful for fights.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grekumah
If you bothered to merit out aura steal, it gave you a dispel on a 5 minute timer, which was not very useful, even with the double dispel from the bonnet. Lowering it to 4 minutes seemed like a step in the right direction but a 3 minute timer seemed to be the magic number that would make it useful.
Heck a lot of timers seem too slow now with how fast paced most fights are. Another thing I think about while in a fight is if an ability is worth the lull in my attacks for the time it takes to use it.
I do have a suggestion for despoil too if you want to pass it along. Since it also has no use it should drain tp with putting job points in it.
Effort to reward ratio for job point categories
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08-28-2014, 05:54 AMUlth
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08-28-2014, 06:14 AMZarcheryNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *sob*Quote:
Originally Posted by Grekumah
I say this because I have been grinding like nuts to hit 10/10 on Chakra. I can't fathom how long it would take to get all the way to 30. -
08-28-2014, 10:13 AMXsilver
Some jobs get better Job Point categories than others. Samurai will be getting STR+30 from Hasso(in addition to Hasso's base +STR) when fully upgraded. +Attack on Jumps for DRG, when calculated and Math'd out comes out to like less than 0.5 DPS or less since Jumps already get a large attack bonus (and its only once per every min or so, compared to +Att on a stance JA like berserk which is active for several minutes)
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08-28-2014, 10:43 AMMetaking
@ ulth its an increase to physical spells additional effects macc, aka stun on sudden lunge or plague on delta strike kinda thing, which is still really nice, not a bonus to the spell base physical acc
@Grekumah so when are we going to get some details on this new event btw.
and yea 30 on some castigators seems op(sam haso), and 30 in others necessary for them to be great(sch regen bonus,which this one will be so hot at 30/30 >.>). -
08-28-2014, 10:44 AMZarcheryActually, I can fathom it and ran the calculations. I estimate about 615 hours if the pattern of each upgrade costing 1 more point than the last continues. It'd be 410 more job points and I can pull in about 18,000 capacity points per hour.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarchery
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08-28-2014, 10:48 AMRaydeusThen again you are not supposed to be grinding Job points, but to acquire them as you play the game as a long term goal...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarchery
...which makes the fact that you are only able to obtain CP from selected mobs/content seem like something went very wrong somewhere in development of this feature.
Like I've said before, anything that gives XP should give you CP. Even if you start by only getting 1 CP from killing an Incredibly Weak mob points will still add up as you play the game. But if you are restricted to only obtaining them from certain content you will be forced to grind them instead. Which makes the original intent look like a pile of stinky bullshit. -
08-28-2014, 11:09 AMdragmagi
CP really should go like merits did once xp- merits cap off exess should goto CP. That will make grind less painful
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08-28-2014, 01:00 PMMitruyaJPs can't be shared across jobs. So if our favorite job choices are unwanted for events, we can't take advantage of events to boost the gain. As mentioned in another thread, JPs shouldn't be used to fix unpopular jobs so that they will be wanted. It creates the same damn circular problem like needing to already have the drops that you're trying to get in the first place ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Grekumah
And no one parties for this stuff on my server that I'm aware of. -
08-28-2014, 04:00 PMAkivatooPUP detected !Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitruya
BTW job point took longtime to get but i still think megaboss need to give more job point (10K capacity point or more for each for each kill) can be a good way to give job point for no DD job (DD job exclude BLU PUP RUN DNC DRG BST).
tht can be an alternative way of low level monster grind. -
08-28-2014, 04:27 PMZhronneYes and no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulth
The CP/hr is actually better than the LP/hr we used to have at level 75, if you get a good party of course, if you solo it's about the same.
But you can't stop here, there are other factors to include which are very relevant.
- Job Points are much more expensive than Merit points and are going to be even more expensive once they uncap beyond 10. Furthermore, do not forget that while the CP/hr and LP/hr rates are similar, you need 30k CP for a JP whereas you need 10k LP for a MP.
- Merits offered bigger increases/changes in your job than JP do (aside from a couple of exceptions), hence making the Effort/Reward and the Gratification much less frustrating
- You could get Merits on different jobs, making it easy to farm them for undesired jobs (I love the fact that you need to get JPs on that specific job, but we all have to admit that the MP system was more practical, in this sense)
- Times have changed, we're in 2014
Once you consider the CP/hr in light of point 1), you're going to see how JPs are actually slower than MPs were.
What is particularly relevant and cannot be ignored, from my point of view, is point 4).
We cannot judge things with the eyes of 2006 players.
Times have changed, the game has changed, players have changed. What was a completely acceptable standard in 2006 probably is not in 2014.
I would have loved for them to bring back old style merit PTs, but their attempt isn't working so far.
All is promoting atm is leeching and botting.
JPs system in 2014 FFXI feels completely out of place, a remnant of the past despite being a new feature, a fish out of water in a game such as what FFXI has become.
They really need to find a better compromise, and the idea of having to spend 11>12>13>14>...>30 JPs for a single minimal upgrade is really... intense.
With the current solo rate of 20k CP/hr it would take ~45 hours just for the last upgrade.
652 hours to go 1>30 in a single category.
That's like 27 days of UNINTERRUPTED exping (which is unrealistical unless you're botting).
More realistically, 2hours a day of Exping (average: since there are days you won't exp because no login or doing other activities) would take ~163 days of exping.
That's for a SINGLE category.
In a SINGLE job.
Even if they were to double the amount of CP/kill you get, which would be an insane bonus and I doubt they're gonna do it since all they're talking of is "Incursion" giving CP, it would still be 81 days of 2hrs/day exp
If you think rates are fine and there's nothing wrong with the effort/reward ratio of the current system in 2014 FFXI then I don't know what else to tell you.