Completely gut and rework WS accessibility

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Originally Posted by Razushu

Plus in the case of Sanguine blade it's highest level WS sword skill gets you. Seeing how RDM is a "part-time" melee it makes no sense that they should learn the strongest attacks with a weapon.

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I think the confusing part about RDM not getting Sanguine Blade is that their usual melee, exclusive, and iconic weapons are swords, while they get the high-end weaponskills (including Aeolian Edge, which is the skill equivalent of Sanguine Blade) of Dagger but not Sword.

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Originally Posted by Ironside

I think the confusing part about RDM not getting Sanguine Blade is that their usual melee, exclusive, and iconic weapons are swords, while they get the high-end weaponskills (including Aeolian Edge, which is the skill equivalent of Sanguine Blade) of Dagger but not Sword.

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That is a weird one. Maybe SE are playing the same game as with the subjob. High DPS or strong WS, not both. Good WS poor weapon selection vs. good weapon choice poorer WS.

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because they seem to be influenced by the D&D cleric class.

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I recall them using clubs much much much more than staffs. Staffs were more for tossing spells than hitting.

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

I recall them using clubs much much much more than staffs. Staffs were more for tossing spells than hitting.

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Yeah, which is how they tend to be played in ffxi when meleeing lol. They could use both and were locked off edged weapons. So they only had a choice of club or staff, which could argualy be the reason SE gave the best of both to WHM.

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Originally Posted by Razushu

Yeah, which is how they tend to be played in ffxi when meleeing lol. They could use both and were locked off edged weapons. So they only had a choice of club or staff, which could argualy be the reason SE gave the best of both to WHM.

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Honestly though, I don't get why WHM is locked out of bows. In the past bows were even more of their main attacks than clubs or staffs. I guess they felt like a healing RNG would remove the need for the job RNG. That or SE just wanted to avoid using old content for new FFXI mechanics.

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

Honestly though, I don't get why WHM is locked out of bows. In the past bows were even more of their main attacks than clubs or staffs. I guess they felt like a healing RNG would remove the need for the job RNG. That or SE just wanted to avoid using old content for new FFXI mechanics.

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I think it's the influence of "Cleric". Weapons designed to kill aren't allowed. Blunt weapons are defensive, so they're ok. It kind of makes sense when you think the job is dedicated to keeping others alive(I'm aware they still bludgeon things to death, hence the "kind of").

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

Honestly though, I don't get why WHM is locked out of bows. In the past bows were even more of their main attacks than clubs or staffs. I guess they felt like a healing RNG would remove the need for the job RNG. That or SE just wanted to avoid using old content for new FFXI mechanics.

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Minor nitpick: which games aside from FF4 let WHMs use bows? They've been using hammers and staves since FF1 otherwise, from what I can remember.

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Originally Posted by Razushu

On Red lotus blade I could agree with you. But Seraph /Sanguine blade are light/dark element which RDM doesn't really have access to. Plus in the case of Sanguine blade it's highest level WS sword skill gets you. Seeing how RDM is a "part-time" melee it makes no sense that they should learn the strongest attacks with a weapon.

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Highest level does not equal strongest attacks. Raging Rush out damages Fell Cleave against single mobs by a long shot. Vorpal Blade trounces Sanguine unless you're brewing. And by this logic, RDM shouldn't have Aoelian Edge, but they do.

My biggest gripe about weapon skills are that 90% of them are never used besides for staggering. Most weapon skills are very weak as they either are elemental weapon skills, enfeebling ones that really don't seem to help much on enfeebling the mob. Why would I use Full Break if I could just use Raging Rush and do 1-2k damage outside and 4k inside Abyssea for other reasons than stagger the mob?

Basically this thread demands that warriors should get every single red and blue proc, so you might as well skip the other jobs in this game.

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Originally Posted by Razushu

I think it's the influence of "Cleric". Weapons designed to kill aren't allowed. Blunt weapons are defensive, so they're ok.

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Except that blunt weapons are not defensive. They are in fact very effective melee weapons against armor. Put a steel helm on and then let someone hit you in the head with a warhammer or a morningstar and see how well it protects you (it doesn't).

Maces, morningstars, hammers, mauls, etc. were very brutal, nasty weapons. There was nothing "non killing" about them at all.