Is anyone particularly happy with the new gear from New Salvage?

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Originally Posted by Byrth

1) It's too easy.
Original Salvage was something that you and your 5 most skilled friends went and did 5 nights a week for a year. New Salvage is a disappointment on that front, with most zones being multi-box-able.

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I'd say the difficulty of new salvage is just right. In fact it's probably most "balanced" event SE made in past 3 years. Only bad part about it is NQ salvage gear, which is required to upgrade +1, is still a pain to get due to shit drop rate and shit pop rate in BR rampart.

Salvage2 is incredibly accessable and clearable on most jobs(certain boss would be easier with certain DD though, such as twilight scythe DRK), but not to a point that you can just go in without organization and still do full clear. It's also way easier to get enough ppl to enter if there are lower skill requirement for anyone doesn't own multiple characters. Personally I think a content is most enjoyable if I can get ppl to do it easily whenver I log on, instead of having to sacrifice rl schedule to gather ppl in different timezone/play time just because I need "5 most skilled friends" to do it. If I can just log on, drag anyone that's PUP main, or DNC main, instead of rag DRK WAR only to do the content, and fill up the spot with /shout, then it's certainly more enjoyable than finding 5 "most skilled friends" with specific job/gear/skill lv, and if 1 person don't pop we can't go, nor rep that player by /shout or ask in social LS.

I don't mind an event being harder, but I think event shouldn't be hard because everyone have different schedule and live in different timezone. A balanced difficulty doens't have to hand out gears in days, but it should be accessable to most of the players.

For those looking for a challenge, challenge is there if you try to look for it. I often do something like 1hr AR2 full clear challenge with my pt, killing all NM plus double boss in 1hr does require pt member knowing what to do and above avg DD gears. That's why I think the difficulty is just right, if I can't get most skilled friends, I can still go in with less skilled friends and get shit done. If I can get most skilled friends, I can try to do faster and more efficient runs and get more shit done in less time. Either way it's better than log on, sit in Jeuno and do nothing because all my most skilled friends are sleeping/working and I can't clear with my less skilled friends.

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Originally Posted by Yenecol

You don't know me and you are clueless. I do salvage every day because I love it and I keep trying to figure out where I can best use salvage gear. Do not pretend to understand me because you do NOT. I want gear to be better so it is easier to find people to do this with me.

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It's harder to find 2 sch with capped enh magic for NNI than it is to find 3 random people for salvage.

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Originally Posted by Camiie

It makes me wonder... Did they design this event with cheaters in mind or did the devs not learn anything from the past 10 years? If they make events built on highly limiting systems, players will cheat to win. They will bot timed spawns, buy gil for rare/expensive items, walk through walls, flee hack, bot fishing, etc. Doesn't that sort of negate keeping gear rare and available for only the best players, or is player skill measured solely by how much one is willing to cheat to get results?

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They originally designed the event simply to not be winnable. The gear was made so good to act as a carrot. Think the original AV and PW fights. PW was unkillable and had infinite forms (effectively infinite HP) and AV was so bat sh!t crazy that it could CS meteor your entire alliance and then Benediction himself to full HP. Except in this case if you rolled the dice and got lucky on the result, you got the reward. It would be like poping (original) AV / PW and immediately doing a /random, if you got 999 they would fall over dead after 5m, otherwise they would do 9,999 damage to everyone.

NNI ~now~ is very winnable, floor 100 still requires a strict strategy and judicial use of secret ninja techniques, but as there are now slightly less random things being thrown at you, you have a higher win rate. The real victory is that floor 80 is *much* easier to farm without any secret ninja techniques. A group of skilled players can hit floor 80 4~5 times per weekend and thus walk away with one floor 100 piece of their choice. A group of skilled players who are willing to bend the rules a little can hit floor 100 most of the time and walk away with tons of gear. A group of skilled players who are willing to straight up break the rules can hit floor 100 every time and finish their sets super fast. Those groups are even mercing themselves out, for 10~15m per win.

Just the other day I got invited to a group by a friend and we managed to get 2 80 wins out of 3 runs. On the one we didn't we timed out on 99 and were ported past 80 anyway. So yeah I see the big difference now with NNI. I'm glad to see it.

Considering the hardcore folks (by hook or by crook) have already had their run of the event, I don't see a problem letting the rest of us have some fun now. Isn't that SE's stated new strategy anyway? Make events hard at first and then ease up on them after the uber leet people get their "First Kids on the Block to Have this Stuff" status?

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Originally Posted by Byrth

Wasn't the answer to the OP question "yes?" I'm particularly happy with the rewards.


If I was going to complain about new Salvage, my complaints would be:

1) It's too easy.
Original Salvage was something that you and your 5 most skilled friends went and did 5 nights a week for a year. New Salvage is a disappointment on that front, with most zones being multi-box-able.

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Considering the hell I had to go through to get my 75 pieces in the first place, I don't think I should have to go through the same sort of hell a second time for an upgrade. 99 salvage is simply an add-on to the original. I think people who are judging it as a new event aren't looking at it properly.

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Originally Posted by Jaall

It's harder to find 2 sch with capped enh magic for NNI than it is to find 3 random people for salvage.

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You don't need capped enhancing magic on SCH... Heck you don't even need Embrava the whole run, I actually did a run with a SCH who didn't know he didn't have the spell and we still managed clear 60 and 80 bosses before timing out on 98, though I'd blame the 3x lamp order and 2x code lamps we got that run more so than only 1 Embrava.

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Originally Posted by Camiie

Considering the hell I had to go through to get my 75 pieces in the first place, I don't think I should have to go through the same sort of hell a second time for an upgrade. 99 salvage is simply an add-on to the original. I think people who are judging it as a new event aren't looking at it properly.

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I look at it 2 ways:
1) As an event for people who were nearly done with 75 events thus having most of Salvage 1 gear (if not all) to prevent from having to do 1 before 2 today.
2) Also for newer or returning players who hadn't conquered Salvage 1 now have to complete Salvage 1 before Salvage 2 because the +1s are the only gear worth making in most cases.

How else should I look at it?

The difference between capped Embrava and zero skill Embrava is 6.5% Haste, 1 TP/tick Regain and 14 HP/tick Regen. The Haste difference gets reduced to 2% if people are hasted on top of Embrava. While it's nice, it's very far from vital, given how much fighting time there is compared to running around, clicking lamps, warping up and picking your nose time.

I wish they had made old Salvage upgrade the easy-grind-for-gear instead of putting them in new Salvage. Magian trial it and put something like "Kill 15 bosses" on each armor piece and call it a day. Then people can get their "I can do this with my friends 3-man whenever I want!" fix.

Then they could put new Salvage gear in new Salvage and make it better / a more difficult event that I actually need 6 real players to do. They don't have to Legion-out on the difficulty, but it would have been nice to see an event that I can't essentially do solo. I had two friends deactivate because they saw new Salvage as yet another easy grind fest instead of the 6-man, difficult event that we hoped for.

So far in this thread there have been a few people asking for better rewards (which is unnecessary in my opinion, considering how good the upgraded pieces are) and a few people comparing these items to Neo-Nyzul (which is still a more difficult, 6-man event that actually requires party coordination instead of just time) Floor 100 rewards. You can't really have it both ways. The event should either be easy with minor-upgrade rewards (as it is) or difficult with large-upgrade rewards (like old Salvage / Neo-NI). If they had made this a harder event with impressive rewards, I'd be much more excited about it.

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Originally Posted by Zagen

I look at it 2 ways:
1) As an event for people who were nearly done with 75 events thus having most of Salvage 1 gear (if not all) to prevent from having to do 1 before 2 today.
2) Also for newer or returning players who hadn't conquered Salvage 1 now have to complete Salvage 1 before Salvage 2 because the +1s are the only gear worth making in most cases.

How else should I look at it?

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Not as a sequel event, but as something tacked on to the original. Look at all of Salvage as a single event and then pass judgement on it.

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Originally Posted by Camiie

Not as a sequel event, but as something tacked on to the original. Look at all of Salvage as a single event and then pass judgement on it.

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It isn't a single event because if you don't have the gear from 1 you must do it before being able to complete your +1 armor. If you could get Salvage 1 gear in 2 then I'd agree it works as a single event. While you might (I haven't tried to do both on the same day) be able to do them in a 200 minute span in the same day if you have enough points you're still doing 2 events not 1 as given drops are exclusive to each event.