Pld Emnity/hate distribution chages?

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Originally Posted by Leviticus

Easy fix.
Level 50 PLD Job Trait: Enmity Boost
Boost Enmity generated from any action.

Level 50 PLD Job Ability: Sanctuary
Boost party's defense slightly and redirects half enmity generated by any party member to caster.

Level 90 PLD Spell (66MP): Divine Wrath
Attacks, blocks, and parries deal light damage. This damage generates extremely high enmity. 7 charges

The reason for level 50 is so the abilities are not gained by from subjob. All or a few of those would be great. Or the easiest fix: give pld provoke at level 50.

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This isn't a fix at all. You just plain don't understand.


Again.

Why even have a pld in the pt when a DD can tank and deal damage at the same time. Enmity isn't the issue. They can have all the hate they want in the world, but if the job can be done w/o a pld in the pt, there is no reason to have a pld.

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Originally Posted by Orson

Pld is one of the hardest jobs to fix at the moment. There's really no need for a tank. Even prior to Abyssea having a Pld was more or less a safety net against bad stuff from happening. I'm not hating on the job either. I love it have it leveled but tanks are just next to impossible to make useful unless you either nerf melee damage enmity and/or make melee take way more damage. That would make a lot of angry people I would think.

The other option is to buff Pld but how? Make it do more damage or heal more? Then it outclasses other jobs that sole function is to damage or heal. It's very hard to do with keeping balance.

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While I do see where you're coming from, the problem is that currently any DD job doesn't stay within it's designated role of "just DD". Every DD (especially Empy wielding ones) is expected to tank to a degree. Whether it's a NIN sub with capped haste gear (which is now easier than ever to obtain) and/or PDT/MDT sets... just about any DD can step outside it's original intent and tank.

Where does this leave PLD? At a disadvantage, seeing as how we have 0 offensive traits/abilities. Almace definately narrows the gap, but a little boost elsewhere wouldn't be unwelcome. Like I mentioned in the other threads, a trait of some variety that lowers weapon delay on par with NIN's dual wield or MNK's martial arts would go a long way to putting PLD where it belongs, without forcing the user to get an Almace.

Edit: lol didn't realize this thread was 13 pages long... I'm a tad late to the party. But nonetheless, the changes mentioned is an answer Cream_Soda's question. Make PLD a competant DD as well as tank, and from that point on player skill/gear will be the only factor to consider when choosing what job to play.

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Originally Posted by Cream_Soda

This isn't a fix at all. You just plain don't understand.


Again.

Why even have a pld in the pt when a DD can tank and deal damage at the same time. Enmity isn't the issue. They can have all the hate they want in the world, but if the job can be done w/o a pld in the pt, there is no reason to have a pld.

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I agree. Further to that, a PLD can't truly DD and 'tank' at the same time. A PLD tanks by getting smacked in the face. A properly geared PLD can tremendously reduce damage bloodtanking anything now. Unfortunately... to do this you have to give up every bit of your DD gear that even with an Almace puts you behind an equally geared DD.

And this is about damage taken. Now a days lots of the harder mobs have en-effects that are nasty as hell, and the trick to winning is not getting hit.

The fix to pld, w/e it is, goes beyond just a simple damage increase, or defense increase, or enmity tools increase. It'll likely need to see some sort of element that the game hasn't seen yet.

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Originally Posted by Naix

I agree. Further to that, a PLD can't truly DD and 'tank' at the same time. A PLD tanks by getting smacked in the face. A properly geared PLD can tremendously reduce damage bloodtanking anything now. Unfortunately... to do this you have to give up every bit of your DD gear that even with an Almace puts you behind an equally geared DD.

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A PLD tanks by avoiding hits with /NIN, like most other DD tanks. And abilities like Reprisal, Shield Bash, and Sentinal/phalanx only make that easier. It's entirely unnecessary to stay in turtle gear while Utsusemi is up.

Only time I'd go /WAR is if the mobs are easy, or if you got Ochain. At which point, you can't die even if you try.

enmity/defensive and atk increases are out of the question.
PLD can already mitigate more than 50% of both magic and physical dmg without a relic and empyrean.
PLD can already generate a lot of enmity. Its just useless when you have melee also capping enmity chart and slapping the mob around.
Sure, increase PLD's attack ability to that of WAR and MNK and NIN. That way instead of having 1 useless job that never sees any action, we will have every melee sitting on the bench.

like Soda said, you need to make having a pld in party/alliance B E N E F I C I A L.
You can gimp every other job to achieve this.
or you can pump some steroids into PLD and as a consequence make every other melee job obsolete.
Or you can think outside the box and start giving PLD abilities/spells/job traits that do not rely on current game mechanics.
Or just put the job out of its misery and delete it.
This isnt hard. Give PLD an Aura effect... different stances with different aura effects?
How about an ability that is the inverse of charm. Instead of getting the mob's loyalty, you get its focused attention for a period of time.
how about giving PLD the ability to stagger mobs without procing !!'s? even outside abyssea?
SE demonstrated they could be creative with jobs when they introduced DNC.
I have a lil faith, and am pretty sure all this PLD waa waa waa will force 'em to do something.
I am just worried they will end up screwing everyone else over by trying to fix pld.

Cursed, even back when Atonement spam was king and PLD's contributed significant dmg over the course of an HNM fight (like Cerberus for example), when was the last time you saw a PLD burn? Nothing but support and an alliance of PLD's spamming Atonement on any given NM and shelfing every other DD in the game?

I'm willing to bet that's never happened.

A damage output buff would go a long way towards allowing non-Almace PLD's to be competant in doing what we were designed to do in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Aeonk

Cursed, even back when Atonement spam was king and PLD's contributed significant dmg over the course of an HNM fight (like Cerberus for example), when was the last time you saw a PLD burn? Nothing but support and an alliance of PLD's spamming Atonement on any given NM and shelfing every other DD in the game?

I'm willing to bet that's never happened.




A damage output buff would go a long way towards allowing non-Almace PLD's to be competant in doing what we were designed to do in the first place.

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Every cerberus/fafnir/nidhogg/tiamat/khimaira only ever needed 1-2 plds, 1xbrd, 1xrdm, 1x TH and a BLM if you wanted to speed things up or had to stun fulm/goh.
You didn't need any melee jobs at all, and those of us that were smart didn't recruit anymore members than we absolutely needed. we never had a bunch of melee spamming ws's and raping shit. towards the end of the HNM scene we didn't even have plds spamming atonement anymore. Why would you when 2-3 Ammano's spamming Kaiten lowered the duration of the fight by 2/3rds.
Looking back, the lack of need for all the melee and indeed many other jobs is why they implemented the stagger !! system in abyssea. They couldn't balance the game so they just made content a lot more specific.

If you give PLD the ability to do dmg on par with war/mnk/nin you are just returning the game to the way it was pre-abyssea. Other than procs, you won't need any other job, ever.
what would an ochain/almace PLD even need with an LS? could just solo everything with a whm mule being dual boxed.

First, I want to say I'm not sure how all the endgame stuff works because I was level 68 PLD when Abyssea came out. So if this idea is just ridiculous, my mistake =] but, after reading some of the suggestions, and the posts right after burning them down, I thought of one, maybe? Not sure if anyone else has already thought of it, but what if PLD got a spell or JA that would essentially "lock" the monster on to you regardless of enmity? I heard that if someone uses provoke in ballista, the other player is automatically "locked" on you, like along those lines is what I mean.

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Originally Posted by Elonial

First, I want to say I'm not sure how all the endgame stuff works because I was level 68 PLD when Abyssea came out. So if this idea is just ridiculous, my mistake =] but, after reading some of the suggestions, and the posts right after burning them down, I thought of one, maybe? Not sure if anyone else has already thought of it, but what if PLD got a spell or JA that would essentially "lock" the monster on to you regardless of enmity? I heard that if someone uses provoke in ballista, the other player is automatically "locked" on you, like along those lines is what I mean.

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I actually like this idea. PLD has always needed a native kind of provoke, this would be even more efficient. Although I don't know if it could be called cheating, it does sound a bit overpowered. Maybe with longer recast, 10s duration, 2min recast or something, for emergencies.

Thanks Arcon ^^ I didn't think about how it could be considered overpowered, I see that now though. I only thought about when we were inside Abyssea with all of the super powered DD's. Trying to hold anything while they're going at it seems like a feat in itself haha.