Why are bst pets getting shafted?

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Originally Posted by Louispv

You could solo the armored chariot in under 3 minutes at 99, you can do it with any pet at 117. Just don't watch the fight from afar. The real reason Ibuki's the best is you don't have to pour a stack of biscuits into her on the floor before that, because she can dodge shit that's not in front of her, unlike Kiyomaro's gaurd/counter.

Everyone forgets Zealous snort adds 25 MDB though. Anything that casts magic has real trouble with him. Was able to solo Easy Microcosmic orbs, while I left for the toilet. Could maybe do normal with a 119 pet.

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Nice^^ I never tried the microcosmic orb BCNMs with him, only mac. I also had no idea that zealous snort added MDB, but the 3 charges is what gets me. I could not get zealous snort off because he was getting pounded by the orcs before he could gain enough tp.

Ibuki is a solid DD; her moves are fairly cheap and powerful. The boar appears to be a decent dd. I was playing around with him in colonization revives; his moves where doing 1.3-1.4k to mobs and 500ish to the roots, however, Ibuki was doing 2.7-3k to mobs (Hit 2 mobs simultaneously for 3k, made me smile^^) and over 1k to the roots (1.5kish). Edit: Pentapeck is pretty cool too, highest I have seen from Ibuki was an 6k on the toads in besieged and 9.3k on the qutrub (Granted it is besieged, lol XD).

The boar was a pretty decent dd, not bad, I was somewhat surprised.

The main thing that bothers me with these pets is when they run off and fight other targets. I wish there was a command that keeps them on the intended target. For instance, I will engage a mob, then another monster will cast blind or something and he wanders off into the blue. Not a major issue, but annoying nonetheless, ruins my unleash fun XD.

Boar is more for 1 on 1 fights really. That's where it excels. Get out of that and you lose out on it's counter/gaurd and well it's dmg move isn't the greatest for dmg. Though the def down is really nice. Snort... yeah really should be 2 charges. But a bunch of haste and rediculous counter/gaurd rate with some mdb is still not bad.

As far as AI i think that was actually brought up a long time ago and SE rep basically said they are monsters they do what they want lol

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Originally Posted by dasva

Boar is more for 1 on 1 fights really. That's where it excels. Get out of that and you lose out on it's counter/gaurd and well it's dmg move isn't the greatest for dmg. Though the def down is really nice. Snort... yeah really should be 2 charges. But a bunch of haste and rediculous counter/gaurd rate with some mdb is still not bad.

As far as AI i think that was actually brought up a long time ago and SE rep basically said they are monsters they do what they want lol

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Ah, ok, thanks; it is what it is I guess pertaining to our monsters, oh well, lol.

So it turns out that the frog which even at 119 has pretty much every stat lower than 114 falcoor and the new meh mandy which has lower stats than a really old many from awhile ago are both 119+ for natural cap. But the good jugs boar and tulfaire are 116 and 109 respectively <.<

has anyone asked them to check to see if they accidentally messed up the stats on the Mandy? That happened before with DiscreetLouise - they had put the wrong stats on her

This is what someone in another forum noted:

Sharpwit hermes averages 50 damage a swing and crits for 80. I have no idea why, it doesn't seem like he's capped real low, or had his stats and flowerpot bill's switched like they did with the fungaurs, since he has level appropriate accuracy. No new Ws's either.

EDIT: Pulled out a Flowerpot Merle. She and HErmes have exactly the same stats and hit for exactly the same amount, except for Hermes's higher max hp.

ALSO: can the devs please stop capping new jugs well below current levels? It's really a crummy thing to do.

Well it's /checkparam stats aren't horrible about on par with the other jugs added this update not including the frog but I'm told an older mandy had a 20% att/def bonus which makes it even at a much lower level almost as strong. The thing is though mandys moves suck so it can't just have similar stats to something else it's level. I mean boar has 2 awesome abilities as well as nice counter/gaurd. Tulfaire has -50% to slashing which is most mobs as well as a couple of nice moves that do way more than mandies. I'm guessing somehow they set mandies base dmg really low too like definitely less than half the other mobs instead of just half to make up for the 2 hit thing

I'd like to point out that this is absurd:

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Hermes: 788 acc 750 att 706 eva 745 def
Merle : 718 acc 808 att 633 eva 797 def

So it looks like they stealth fixed him so he no longer hits for 45 damage. Now he hits for about 120, which is still terrible. And they "Fixed" him by making him almost always weaker than Merle. (Barring very evasive enemies, which you won't use BST on anyway since all the pets have crap acc.) Merle, who is a level 76 jug made with 32 woodworking from 300 gil worth of NPC bought ingredients, and is incredibly common in all treasure caskets, is stronger than a level 104 alchemy synth that uses philosopher's stones and a drop from level 119+ endgame activity. That makes sense.

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Time flies when you are getting shafted^^ I kid, but seriously, almost one year later and bst pets are still in the dumps.

Was just browsing through the bst forums and discovered that the same issues still persist today, almost a year and multiple updates later http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...t-Calculations

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...-Delve-HNM-%29

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...-BST-in-months.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post511200

The pet food buff was nice; my pet is indeed buffed (Hit rate wise) on lvl 119 content that is, however, pet's are still lacking in the dd department. My acc is fine on lvl119 battles; however, anything higher than that (Battle levels higher than my pet) causes the pet's efficacy to drop tremendously. Unlike pt members, pets do not have access to JAs nor songs/buffs. Having rolls specially for pets causes issues; pets are buffed at the expense of other dd which makes having a bst or pup less desirable. Is it possible to allow songs/buffs to hit pets? We do have a very nice JA buff, but it is on extremely long timer (Run Wild).

Something else stands out to me regarding bst; http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...shafted/page5; if I am reading this correctly; scissor leg Xerin was designed to be our attacker pet. I found this discouraging and disturbing; Xerin is far from an efficient striker pet..the best attacker atm is Dortwin, by default, due to his high lvl cap (Foot Kick and Whirl Claws spam are highly overrated, does not get the job done on content that matters. Foot kick usually does high 1k-3k on incredibly easy prey, can spike higher on dated stuff. Ibuki hovers around mid 2ks). Xerin's ready moves are extremely weak and his most beneficial moves are gone. The post goes on to imply that, the team would like to add more pets that are attack based; well, the next batch has been released and none of our current pets are particularly damaging because, almost a year later, the same jug issues persist. You guys did not release more attack oriented pets because most of our pets were just repeats of older monsters (Mandy, rabbit) and one of them is weaker than the previous capped jug of the same species http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post485869.

I am inclined to believe that not much thought goes into our jug selection. You cannot just throw us any monster, strip the monster of its' moves and pass the jug off as a striker pet. When I hear attacker pet, my initial thought was Scorpion, Opo-opo, Sheep, or another Hippogryph (With hoof volley). Not all monsters make great dd pets. The only way to give us attacker pets is to really give us damaging pets, with damaging moves. A chapuli is not a damaging monster in general; neither is the frog of tulfaire. This is why the team had to boost pet ready move dmg, but to no avail. You cannot transform a mandy's headbutt into a destructive force; why not just implement damaging monsters with strong moves? Scorpion? Hippo(Hoof volley)? Opo-opo? Gnat? Wivre? Crab(Mega-scissors)? If our jugs possessed moves native to their species, this would be a non-issue. The pet stat formula should have been boosted (Updated) as opposed to this. You cannot have damaging/attack oriented pets without damaging moves. For instance, a scorpion jug missing sharp strike, critical bite, and death scissors would be a sub-par dd pet. Yes, in theory a scorpion would be a great dd, but not without its' beneficial abilities. Kiyomaro for instance, has its' most damaging ability removed (Understandably so in this case; barreling smash is an hp based move), hence he is a extremely sub-par dd, even on weaker content. Honestly, the boar should have never been implemented imo, considering the fact that he had a potentially broken move that would have been removed. Opo-opo would have been a better choice for the beast family; Scorpion would have been a better choice as opposed to the chapuli, a snapweed would have been a better choice as opposed to another mandy. If the next batch does not contain a particularly damaging pet, I will be highly disappointed :(

There has to be some way you guys can give us beneficial/damaging abilities. Our pet's are basically stripped down entities trying to compete. I don't care if it is on a 4th ready charge, we cannot compete with stripped down pets. SMNs can do insane 5 digit damage on like a 35 second timer in delve, how will giving bst pets moves such as hoof volley or mega-scissors on a long ready charge break the balance? Doubt hoof volley or mega-scissors can do this, even in besieged http://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/39...our-stories/4/. Bst is a dd itself, however, we have no native offensive JAs, hence our pet selection/move slection is extremely vital to our success. It takes the master time to get 100% tp; it takes the pet longer to reach 3 charges; 2 minutes 30 seconds with merits. Smns are firing off powerful pacts every 35-ish seconds iirc. Even if a bst could reach 100% tp faster than the pacts (Which is likely); there are far more powerful than a bst ws.

Capped pugs is another issue. If the jug cap will not be lifted, bst needs every pet family represented with the introduction of new jugs.

Run wild: This is a terrific JA, but diminishes not only our pet, but the familiar effect as well. This can become a hassle. If run wild was on a shorter timer and the pet removal was removed, I truly believe that jugs could attain a decent hit-rate, even on difficult content.

Pet Food: The pet food was indeed a great start, however, food is not enough. Food and run wild allows me to maintain a pretty good hit-rate on difficult stuff; but that timer is extremely restricting to us beastmasters.

Also, is it possible that we can get some -PDT on some new axes? If the new WKR weapon augmentation included this, that would be awesome. -10%PDT on the axe would be pretty nice.

Imo, bst is a few fixes away from being a serviceable job. Run wild adjustment, better jug/move selection, and songs/buffs hitting pets. We can only do so much as a player; SE, can you meet us half way?

Another update and yet again, another missed opportunity to address our pet's damage dealing issues (Any plans to adjust run wild in one of the upcoming updates?)

One of the main gripes with our pets are the ready move damage. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...-a-tp-modifier. I must admit, our pets ws damage is pretty weak. A monster whom has weak special attacks or does not use special abilities at all is pretty harmless (Frogs). The easy mobs have less than stellar special abilities, or attacks that are no a threat to the party (We usually avoided damaging mobs at lower levels). Another example; you guys/gals may notice that not all player weapon skills are particularly damaging. To put it plainly, some ws are just better than others, and the same is true for monster special attacks. Even with the nice ready move boost, our jug pet damage is still lacking. The problem is the pets/ready moves SE chooses to give bst.

I play monstrosity on occasions and have noticed that some monsters are just plain better than others, in the dd department. Monstrosity monsters and jugs are really not comparable, however, I have noticed that the jugs bst currently have access to, are far from the best monster dds; the rabbit is somewhat decent. (of the same job; War vs War, etc). Personally, I believe that our jugs need need stronger native monster abilities. The HQ jugs was good idea, in theory, but those jugs are a hassle to hq and the are not much differnt than the NQ counterparts, you basically recycled the same pets, Once again :(

If you have no intentions of uncapping jugs and continue to constantly recycle old jugs with assorted looks, how about some recycled capped jugs with different looks/with more dd potential?

Don't mind the JAs and whatnot; strictly referring to job traits (Attack bonus, critical hit, double attack, triple attack, etc; traits that jugs are known to have) and special abilities; :)


http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Ga...etle_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Hippogryph_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Co...Lynx_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Karakul_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Sa...rido_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Fe...oise_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Ve...ptor_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Tarichuk_%28MON%29

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Arundimite_%28MON%29

Can you please consider releasing these guys in one of the future updates; bst was so much better with those guys. Imo, this guy put it best

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post469094

Edit: Well, sange is receiving an adjustment, hopefully other crazy long recast abilities will get some love as well.