Maybe without buffs or with magic haste onry, sure. The achilles' heel of pet jobs is and always will be their pet's inability to contribute meaningful damage in group situations (eg, ones with buffs)Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcon
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11-29-2011, 03:50 PMGreatguardian
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11-29-2011, 05:41 PMLeonlionheart
PUP is fun, but that's all it is. No reason to have it other than for the lulz.
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11-29-2011, 06:38 PMAlhanelemNo, that's not all it is. If any job has defects, those defects should be repaired. If you feel that something can only be done "for the lulz" then there are problems that need fixing. No job deserves to be completely unwanted, otherwise there's no reason for it to exist in the first place. If it can't be fixed to where osmeone would want it for something, then it should just be removed. the fun value of a job is diminished if it can't be put to good use for anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonlionheart
Would you still be saying that if they nerfed the crap out of war and there was no longer any reason to play it except "for the lulz"?
Every job deserves to have something in the game for which it is a strength or asset to have. If you can't think of anything, than either the job needs to be adjusted or content needs to be added or adjusted for it to shine in. But you disagree, because as long as you can kick ass on WAR/MNK/SAM and have a white mage curing you, you don't care about anything else. -
11-29-2011, 06:42 PMLeonlionheartNope! because that would be all it isQuote:
Originally Posted by Alhanelem
even if the puppet is fixed, unless it gets march/haste samba/cor buffs, PUP will fall by the wayside (unless it's all of a sudden able to spam Cure V) -
11-29-2011, 06:44 PMAlhanelemThe same can be said for ANY job. this is about the dumbest thing I've ever seen you say. Proper support should always be given if available.Quote:
even if the puppet is fixed, unless it gets march/haste samba/cor buffs
I can get march/haste samba/cor buffs anytime you can. Outside buffs are not part of a job and cannot be used to measure it.
It already does that. Cure VI, in fact (But with the update, it will not waste MP on cure VI when a lesser heal would be enough)Quote:
(unless it's all of a sudden able to spam Cure V)
Edit: If you're referring to the puppet getting those buffs, it absoltuely does not require those things in order for the player to be able to compete. It is a minor flaw, but the master is capable of putting out enough damage to where the automaton's output gives the performance needed to close the gap.
Go ahead and work some math out in your head. PUP wouldn't just compete, it would decimate the competition if both master and automaton had maximum possible haste. SE doesn't do this because they know it would be overpowered. -
11-29-2011, 07:52 PMLeonlionheart
POIDH (yes i did mean the puppet)
PUP is terribad. Face it. If the pet did get haste it would be slightly different, but still wouldn't be anything close to a competing DD.
I've parsed against great PUPs and am afraid to tell them the results because it's just onesided (DRG(contus/zelus/aresbody/dusk+1/4%bestia/aces) vs PUP(magianstr, 4/5 AF3+2, and Enkidu's feet) vs THF(pink) 54% vs 31% vs 9%) and that was on Chickcharney in Abyssea with full dominion buffs and everyone (other than lolthf) sporting RR/SS/Apoc. No marches or haste was given, other than Hasso on me, the DRG.
That was when my DRG was severely gimped too(only +1 legs out of all AF3)...
Don't tell me that Atmas push things in DRG's favor either, Stringing Pummel is affected heavily by RR and SS.
Edit: I included the pet damage into the totals -
11-30-2011, 02:22 AMGreatguardian
I know why puppets don't get Haste. Doesn't mean that the lack of Haste isn't absolutely crippling to the job in any serious group setting. An unhasted puppet will never "close the gap" between PUP melee and MNK melee in a group setting, ever.
Throwing fully buffed PUPs and fully buffed MNKs at Qilin on Kine's spreadsheet, the MNK is doing 387 damage/second with Vereth 90, and the PUP is doing 253 damage/second with Vereth 90 - without pet and not using maneuvers, since those subtract from master damage. If you want to add pet's damage into the mix, I'll input that the PUP will use one maneuver every 20 seconds (that's reasonable, eh?), that drops their DPS down to 230.
When your puppet is able to do 160 damage/second to Qilin, let me know. -
11-30-2011, 04:50 AMRukkirii
After sending off your feedback, the dev. team let me know that not all content going forward will have a weakness system, so don’t worry!
Keep up the good work with voicing your feedback. ^_^ -
11-30-2011, 04:54 AMKitkatQuote:
Originally Posted by Rukkirii
Thank god... -
11-30-2011, 04:54 AMElexia
Well that sucks, I liked the stagger systems (since it also influenced drop rates, you know, that thing people complained about in a lot of XI's events?)
Ah well.