Tell me the better expression

[Sakura317]

I'm Japanese, and have relativery better English speaking ability than average Japanese...

I can comunicate English speaking players, but always I'm not sure my expression is right.

For example, when I went out Wajaom to kill Colibri for my Magian Katana, a BST player joined with us. Off course he needed to let his Nazuna kill Colis. At that time all party member is Japanese, so Nin and Thf tried not to kill enemies, just remained a little HP and let his Nazuna kill them.
After a while, an English speaking Nin joined with us, and he didn't realize about this, killed Colis himself.
So I talk him "Please let Nazuna kill Colis", and he understood, he also remained a little HP for Nazuna.:)
Yes, he can understand my English, but I'm anxious that it sounded rude, or there might be more suitable expression...
(Auto-translation is usuless for these cases.)
In Japanese, in this case it is expressed like "Pet(Nazuna) sime onegaisimasu".

Could you tell me the better expression about this case?

...

Other case, it happens many times, two or more party copete against ??? in Abysea.
And when one party consists of Japanese, and other party consists of English speaking peoplle, it tends to become "Firs trade pop item, First served", unless English speaking Japanese exists in Japaese party.
(And Japanese people complain "Gaijin is selfish!", and Engish people complain "Japanese is selfish!".)

When I meet this case, I say "Take turn, please?" and it is understood.
We can pop NM in turn in a peaceful manner.

Is it a good expresson? Is it sound rude? Or is there better one? if so, could you tell me.
In Japanese, this case may express "Kougo ni onegaisimasu."

...

And if you have some expression that there is not in auto-translation and you think let Japanese know, also tell me with situation.

I think misunderstanding between Japanese and non-Japanese people comes from these kinds of littile conflict, so to resolve it, I wait your thinking and feeling.:o

[Greatguardian]

どうもありがとう, Sakura-san. It is always very good to read posts like these from our Japanese fellows.

In the first case, "Please let Nazuna kill Colibris" is a perfectly clear phrase in English. It is polite, and clear. If you wish to give more detail, "Please let Nazuna get killshot for Magian Trial" is also an acceptable phrase.

In the second case, "Take turn, please?" is easily understandable and polite. If you wish for an ideal phrase, "May we take turns?" also works well.

Your English is very good, and very polite. You do not have to worry about being rude :). がんばってください!

[Alhanelem]

So I talk him "Please let Nazuna kill Colis", and he understood, he also remained a little HP for Nazuna.:)That sounds just fine to me. I wouldn't see any rudeness in what you said. :)


When I meet this case, I say "Take turn, please?" and it is understood.
We can pop NM in turn in a peaceful manner.Again, this sounds fine to me. Sometimes, saying things in a simple way is the best.

I personally try to work something out with other groups that are interested in the same ???. Sometimes it's difficult because the auto-translate doesn't have many good terms for this kind of problem. But I would do my best to come up with an idea that works for everyone involved.

I'm happy that you came over here to talk to us. It goes a long way to us understanding each other better. :)

[Korpg]

They are both excellent phrases to use in English.

Also, your English is very good compared to other people in Japan.

[Fretion]

I would have found both phrasings very polite, and your English is a LOT better than my Japanese. I can only speak a very few words, and can't spell them at all.

[Raksha]

Yes, he can understand my English, but I'm anxious that it sounded rude, or there might be more suitable expression...
(Auto-translation is usuless for these cases.)




Is it a good expresson? Is it sound rude? Or is there better one? if so, could you tell me.


Your english phrases were perfect, but you are too preoccupied with not being rude. From what I understand this is common among Japanese culture but, in America at least, it is pretty difficult to offend people.

[Glamdring]

Sakura, the phrasing isn't the issue, it's the "please". once you have that down-and you do-it is no longer a matter of phrasing, it is a matter of courtesy on the part of those you are addressing. In your examples you are 100% handling things correctly. Unfortunately, there are a large number of players lacking in courtesy, and many of them use the supposed language barrier to hide their rudeness behind. Keep conducting yourself exactly as you have, but once you are answered with discourtesy you are under no constraint to continue being courteous.

Edit: and I wish I had the facility with Japanese that you have with English.

[Insaniac]

I have studied a little Japanese and I understand where your concern comes from. Japanese has many ways of saying things. Some formal and informal with varying degrees of politeness. When speaking to a stranger you use the most polite form possible. Luckily in english all you need to say to be polite in almost any situation is "Please" and "Thank you".

Also we love when you make funny faces. ☆ﾐ(o*･ω･)ﾉｲｯﾃｷﾏ-ｽ!!

[DrStrangelove]

Your english phrases were perfect, but you are too preoccupied with not being rude. From what I understand this is common among Japanese culture but, in America at least, it is pretty difficult to offend people.

Agree completely! For better or worse, Americans do not regard being given 'instructions' or 'requests' as being impolite. This is just our culture. More so, people from the eastern part of the country or who are younger take even less offense if any at all.

Even with the most sensitive of us, if you use 'please' you almost certainly will never offend an american.

[Raksha]

Also we love when you make funny faces. ☆ﾐ(o*･ω･)ﾉｲｯﾃｷﾏ-ｽ!!

OMG yes lol!

[Alaik]

The only improvement I could have seen is forming the request as a question. "Would you please let Nazuna kill Colibris?"

Americans (At least in smaller communities in the northwest and south, can't say for areas I have not lived in) typically ask you to do something, then depending, act upon it.

For example; A good boss might remind someone about incorrectly filing their paperwork by saying, "Hey, would you mind making sure you put X file in Y place? Thanks!"

Whereas if the same boss said, "Put X file in Y place." it can come off as rude.

Please, thank you, not being demanding and acknowledging people are world wide I think.

Your English is very good OP, also, I'll try my hand at JP and say.

ありがとうございます。

Politeness is always appreciated. :D

[Sakura317]

The reason that I asked these questions is telling my Japanese friends how to ask to English people in those situations. (Especially around ??? in Abysea!).

I've heard complain many times like "Selfish Gaijin occupied ??? and we couldn't fight to NM" or someting.
(And I think English people feel Japanese party as rude, tring to cut in without asking anything.)

But, in my experience, just "take turn please?", always works.
English speaking people always willingly comply with my wish, and we play peacefully around ??? in turn.

Yes, I know my English is understandable.
But I didn't feel sure, that my expression is not just "understandable" but it is suitable and enough polite.

Now I understand my phrases are OK, so I'll tell my Japanese friends how to say these situations. :D

I think most Japanese can use "Take turn please".
(You know Japanese learn English from Junior High school...but somehow most Japanese little understand Engish, only understand some easy English words. But this phrase consists of these easy words that Japanese understand.)

I think "Please let (my pet name) kill (monster name)", is rather difficult than "Take turn please" but some Japanese can use this phrase. It becomes a good top for pet jobs like BST.

These phrased will redue needless friction and tension!

Thank you again for reply.:o
I'll ask somethig again when I find other "comunication trouble" between Japanese people and English speaking people.

[Alhanelem]

(You know Japanese learn English from Junior High school...but somehow most Japanese little understand Engish, only understand some easy English words. But this phrase consists of these easy words that Japanese understand.)It's true, many people think you all become fluent in the language or something in grade school. But the truth is it's not much different from us. Many of our schools require us to go to class for a different language (Usually, French, German, or Spanish). But very few of us really learn those languages to an expert level.

[Raksha]

(You know Japanese learn English from Junior High school...but somehow most Japanese little understand Engish, only understand some easy English words. But this phrase consists of these easy words that Japanese understand.)


I took 4 years of spanish in high school and I still can't speak spanish worth a flip, so that's a fairly universal occurrence.

[Korpg]

It's true, many people think you all become fluent in the language or something in grade school. But the truth is it's not much different from us. Many of our schools require us to go to class for a different language (Usually, French, German, or Spanish). But very few of us really learn those languages to an expert level.

Actually, I don't think any American actually learns a foreign language in a beginner's level. Usually Language classes (at least in the state of Texas) are "blowoff" classes. Even in college, I don't think anyone really can remember their language class enough to be understandable in the native setting.

I think that the OP has a better understanding of English than most people in the world has of foreign languages.

[Alhanelem]

It depends on how much attention you paid. Many schools have started offering foreign languages earlier and earlier. If someone wants to be, they can become at least moderately capable by the time they get out of high school- at least able to understand others if not able to command it oneself.

But since it's usually not mandated, few people do.

[Korpg]

They should mandate it as early as 1st grade if they really want people to learn a different language.

[Didgist]

I just had to teach a japanese friend how to say "My pet needs to get the last hit for trial credit, please." today.

English people,"tugi ikimasu(次tugiいきますikimasu）" means something like next please, but get ready to be ignored until they give us access to ATOK or IME or something.

Net games are supposed to be chaotic, look at Lineage where you just PK people you don't agree with lol. Personally, i'm a nice player but I don't mind competition or people wanting to pop ??? multiple times. I usually ask, and if no response I go battle for the ???. Some people just refuse to be fair. 困難は徳の基, yeah?

[Mirage]

Actually, I don't think any American actually learns a foreign language in a beginner's level. Usually Language classes (at least in the state of Texas) are "blowoff" classes. Even in college, I don't think anyone really can remember their language class enough to be understandable in the native setting.

I think that the OP has a better understanding of English than most people in the world has of foreign languages.

Many people in europe are fairly good at English, especially those from medium sized countries. At least in the scandinavian countries, we start learning English at around the age of 9. I guess being constantly bombarded with english-speaking television and movies also helps. Dubbing isn't common outside of france, germany, and italy.

Of course, you are probably still correct in the "most people in the world" statement, considering how many illiterates you'll find in developing countries :p

[Trumpy]

i have never had a problem understanding a japanese player speakin in limited english somehow. What i usually have had issues with is the trying to communicate to the japanese thing. Usually when trying to speak to them I get no reply whatsoever. Id appreciate anything even if they say soemthing in japanese and its all jibberish to me over being completely ignored lol.

yesterday tho ran into this same situation where we were trying to pop a ??? nm and the other group was japanese. they wouldnt reply to us at all and kept poppin the nm ASAP. We asked to take turns and they ignored us still. So naturally we start competing for the ??? if that is how they are goin to be. we managed to get the next two nms and our mages started to die. the mages claimed the japanese group brought the regular mobs over to MPK them, but as i couldnt see that while focusing on fighting the nm and they were magic agroing mobs I cannot guarantee that was what happened. After a couple more nms the group finally replied to our take turns request with "(Do you speak japanese?)." Well no we don't but we tried various ways of using autotranslate and jsut plain english to communicate but nothing seemed to work. The japanese group got the three next nms and left.

So my question is what is the best way for english speakers to ask japanese for turns? We didnt use the phrase "take turn please?" but used a few very close to that. Like i said ive rarely had a problem understanding the japanese using limited english to communicate, its always been the other way around for me.

Its like how when you need someone to pull mobs for experience group and "Fisherman" works for most japanese but not all of them get that.

[Glamdring]

problem with learning most languages is the opportunity for conversational practice. "Use it or lose it" is a very real issue with languages. For americans, we don't get the opportunity to use languages we do study to obtain fluency in most cases. But English is thought by many to be the international language of commerce, meaning it is used in many places around the world. That and the British empire made it very widespread. There may be an arrogance factor involved, too; many americans seem to feel they are too important to learn a language (for the redneck/rascist types that generally includes their own native tongue) and expect that others will "learn English if they want our money". Sad...

[Miera]

They are both excellent phrases to use in English.

Also, your English is very good compared to other people in Japan.
Even better than most English Speaking folks. <__<

[Zaknafein]

Even better than most English Speaking folks. <__<
So true! lol

[Sakura317]

yesterday tho ran into this same situation where we were trying to pop a ??? nm and the other group was japanese. they wouldnt reply to us at all and kept poppin the nm ASAP. We asked to take turns and they ignored us still. So naturally we start competing for the ??? if that is how they are goin to be. we managed to get the next two nms and our mages started to die. the mages claimed the japanese group brought the regular mobs over to MPK them, but as i couldnt see that while focusing on fighting the nm and they were magic agroing mobs I cannot guarantee that was what happened. After a couple more nms the group finally replied to our take turns request with "(Do you speak japanese?)." Well no we don't but we tried various ways of using autotranslate and jsut plain english to communicate but nothing seemed to work. The japanese group got the three next nms and left.

I applozige you instead of them.
Don't dislike Japanese, please.

I don't think "Take turn, please" or related phrase can be understand to usual Japanese people.
I also didn't know how to express it for a long time, though I translate complicated IT documents from Japanese to English and from English to Japanese in my work.
(Most Japanese can understand the word "take", "turn" and "please", but we know the word "turn" as "change in direction, not as "rotation of order".)

And in your situation, I think the Jaanese party understood that your party also wanted to pop NM.

But they couldn't understand you want to fight for NM by turns, so they are afraid that once they gave over ??? to "Gaijin" party, the selfsh Gaijin occupied ??? all the time.

And I think they didn't know how to express their thinking, not only "take turn, please", but also "how many times are you planning to fight?" or "we only remain 3 fights, so could you wait for your finish?".

So they pretend that they can not understand English at all, and finished them first.

Or just simply, they didn't want to take by turn, they wanted to finish themselves at first. (These kind of people exist not only in Japan, but in all over world.)



So my question is what is the best way for english speakers to ask japanese for turns? We didnt use the phrase "take turn please?" but used a few very close to that. Like i said ive rarely had a problem understanding the japanese using limited english to communicate, its always been the other way around for me.

"Kougo ni yarimasenka?" is one answer.
or "Kougo onegaishimasu"
Kougo means "by turn"
yarimasenka means question of "take".
or "onegaishimasu" means "please".