Grounds of Valor / Brown Casket Feedback

[Francisco]

Overall - I like the system of gaining prowess, and the gradual increase in experience points and tabs from completing regimes.

However, after spending entirely too much time inside of Zeruhn and seeing a friend spend entirely too much time inside Fei'Yin, I have the following feedback on the system:

Prowess

- The buffs are pretty nice - and I'm sure the increased casket yield is the most desirable. If I had my druthers, it would not be possible for me to reach level 6 Magic Acc/Atk Bonus, while sitting at level 1 Treasure Casket Yield... on MNK/WAR. I'll chalk that one up to horrible luck, and ask this instead. Remove the "increased crystal yield" prowess. I don't think anyone is doing Grounds of Valor for crystals, and all it achieves is making it so I need to dump items out of my inventory more often to prevent a Kindred's Crest from falling to the floor.

Treasure Caskets

- I've found the appearance rate of caskets to be generous enough in Zeruhn... IF the zone is not overpopulated, but I've heard horror stories out of Fei'Yin, Garlaige and Ranperre's Tomb. I was alone in Bostanueax for about 100 kills, and did not see a single brown casket appear. Maybe the appearance rate needs to be looked at in some areas.

- I would also like the hints provided by caskets to be adjusted somehow - without making it "too easy". It's pretty wretched when the hints start as follows: "Second Digit is 2, 3 or 4", "Second digit is odd", "one of the digits is 3" ... giving us a pretty low chance of guessing correctly. Maybe allow us to select the type of hint we get once per box?

- This is my biggest issue with Treasure Caskets. Non-rewards diluting the loot pool... Off the top of my head, I have obtained the following items from treasure caskets... pretty sure all in Zeruhn... Black Pepper, Aluminum Ingot, Bomb Arm, Zinc Ore, Holly Lumber, Galvanizer, Red Moko Grass, Skull Locust, War Beret, Gold Nugget, Elixir, various qualities of Potion, Ether, Hi-Potion, Pro-Ether and X-Potion... Most of these items are non-rewards, and are actually detrimental because they lower the chances of obtaining the "good" item from the box. I guess the Elixirs and War Berets are nice (NPC for over 7000 gil), but really, at least remove the "one of a stack" items that NPC for like 12 gil, and all the inventory slot wasting meds like Potions and Ethers. We get enough of these from blue caskets. I think 5-6 possible items per casket would be ideal, not 20-30...

Thank you!

[Byrth]

My largest issue with Caskets at the moment, are that the Rare item is far too rare. I have been in Crawler's Nest for the last 6 nights and still don't even know what it is.

My second issue would be that we still can't spend merit points in the field. I've had 20.999 merits and capped buffer for the last three days.

[Francisco]

What makes it so much worse is, the item might not be any rarer than the others, but the loot pool is just so diluted, you really don't have much of a chance of getting it anyway. If caskets are a 5% spawn rate from monsters, and there are 20 unique items in caskets, all with the same appearance rate, you're looking at a 0.25% chance of the item from any given mob. I'm no math whiz, but that's hundreds of mobs you can expect to be killing for one of these items. 1000+ is probably still in the range of reasonable expectation for this scenario.

[Byrth]

I have no way to predict what the brown casket item frequency is, as I've only seen one so far (Grapevine cape).

I'd bet that the CN Treasure chest item is Cocoon Band, which makes it all the worse. I'm not leaving until I get one, though! Even though I've gotten over 30 (non-temp) medicines now.

[AyinDygra]

The prowess and casket system looked great at first glance. Then I experienced it...
My only goal when I entered Zeruhn Mines was to get the Prouesse Ring. I only got the Grounds Tome version of "Treasure Casket Finding" buff from levels 2 to 5 on my last day, having achieved level 11 attack/r.attack, 11 acc/r.acc, several 8's, a couple 5's, 3 attack speed and level 2 "killer effect "on the previous two days. Finally, on the 3rd day, I found the ring and never want to see another Colliery Bat in my lifetime.

There are a few issues I see, mostly stemming from the "random" nature of Prowess Buffs, with a side issue of page goals not being in line with monster distribution. All of this is exasperated by the current popularity of the items in the chests.


First, it wouldn't hurt things to let people choose their bonus. Notice that it will take at minimum 11 page completions to max out any one category (11 is the highest level I got any one category, I assume this is the cap)... and sometimes completion of a page will not increase any category at all. In Zeruhn Mines, that's 77 monsters. (other areas have from 6-10 monsters per page, making that 66-110 monsters)

It takes at least 5 minutes (that's very low in some cases) to kill the monsters plus running back and forth to the Grounds Tome. (55min is the minimum time for each buff you want maxed without competition for the target monsters) And that's if you only get the bonus you want (not happening).

Monster distribution wasn't really accounted for in Tome Page Targets, was it? What I mean by this, is the ratio of monsters required for each page in relation to the population in the zone. When a person is alone in a zone, or in a single party, this isn't a big concern (you only need enough of each monster to fill the quota for a page) ... it's when the event is popular (like Zeruhn for the skillup ring) that you have to consider the multiplication of require monsters in the proper ratio.


For the example of Zeruhn Mines, you require 5 bats and 2 worms/crabs/leeches. The zone has about 25 bats and 20worms, about 5 crabs, and 5 leeches (guess-estimate.) In my experience there have been upwards of 15 parties, either soloists or groups of 2or3 in the zone at any time. Clearly, if more people teamed up, that could be reduced and everyone could complete pages faster and increase their prowess bonuses faster, and find chests faster... but people are greedy, selfish and not trusting. They don't want to risk losing a single brown chest that might possibly have the ring in it. (also, many people don't open their blue chests, potentially skewing the drop rate of chests, if there is indeed a limit on the number of simultaneously existing chests in a zone)

This means they are searching for about 75 bats and 30 worms every 5min. To complete a page at that rate, it will take about 15 minutes for everyone, tripling the time needed to gain prowesses. This leads people to claiming bats and worms like notorious monsters and everyone ends up frustrated.

Now, you look at the potential benefits gained by the buffs and some buffs are the REASON people are doing Grounds Tomes at all, instead of going some place else:


If they go into a Grounds Tome area as a Warrior to get higher skillup rates and all they get are Cure Potency, Magic Attack/Accuracy, Crystal Drop Rate, Treasure Hunter, and Killer Effects bonus... and any of those double up, that's at least 25min wasted plus double ups wasting 5min at a time. That can add up to hours wasted on unwanted buffs that do nothing toward the goal the person is aiming for.

Concept point: "Extended training increases rewards" ... How does gaining Magic Attack make sense at all for a WAR/DNC training for hours trying to get a wide variety of weapons skills capped? They can only really BEGIN to do what they went there for AFTER they have gained several bonuses in that category. Otherwise, they could have gone anywhere else for practically the same results.

Are the Prowess buffs potent enough to make up for all the time spent without them active? If it takes 3 hours to get "Combat and Magic Skillup Rate" to level 5... how long will a person have to stay in that zone after they get the buff, to benefit more from being there than from going anywhere else? (where competition for monsters is less, or there are better monsters to target to accomplish the goal.)

Grounds Tomes have another horrible downside... if you leave... you lose all the progress you've made. I'd be OK with the random bonuses if I knew I could leave and come back later to try to keep improving what I want. Sure it might take a few extra hours, but then I'd have an area to go to whenever I want to benefit from that bonus. People have other activities they want to enjoy in this game. (like participating in all those events that take planning and organization of groups) People cannot realistically stay in one zone for a week, to make full use of the buffs they obtain during the downtime between scheduled group events.

In conclusion:
Assuming prowesses will always be lost when leaving a zone, selectable prowess bonuses would let people target a goal while they are in a zone. If we can leave and keep bonuses, random prowesses are fine.

Adjusting the number of each monster target in Grounds Tome Pages to match zone monster population ratios would help ease frustration in hunting to meet those goals in popular zones.

I think these solutions would ease the issues most people are experiencing.

[Byrth]

I also think selectable prowesses would fix a lot of the problems people experience.

The buffs obtained from Prowesses are nothing compared to Abyssea buffs (Level 11 Attack is Attack+35, Level 11 WS damage is probably WS damage+22%)

[Francisco]

Good point about losing prowess upon zoning. I got up to Lv. 4 Casket finder once, only to get called out to Abyssea immediately after. It's a bit disappointing that progress is completely lost. I'm not saying the prowess should be permanent for any given zone - but some middle ground should exist so we can leave for a short duration - even if it's just to reapply signet or visit the auction house or mog house.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

What's this I hear about an XP ring?

[Mordanthos]

I was in Fei Yin for about 6 hours upping the casket discovery. I finally got it to lvl 3, so then i logged out to continue upping hte casket discovery to lvl 5, in which at that point i was going to "then" start farming for the Dagda's Shield. Fortunately for me, my farming was cut short, in fact, i had received 2 Dagda's Shield back to back, so i kept 1 for my Paladin, and the other one i sold for 2 mil.

Are the rare loots really that rare? I can't say at this point, seeing i got 2 of them back to back 1 chest after another, in a time gap of about 2.5 minutes. If i were you, i wouldnt even waste your time unless you get to lvl 3, and while continuing to book page up to lvl 5 you will most likely run into the items you are looking for.

Also dont forget, if you log out in these areas your prowess stays, so dont feel like you have to destroy your computer just to be able to get what you want. Just keep at it and eventually you will have your casket discovery high enough, and you will see what you came for.

[Coldbrand]

In before someone comes in to blab about how if you don't want to masochistically grind away entire real life days of your life for a single item that you get for repeating the same action over and over endlessly with no real difficulty then you're what's wrong with the game and expect everything to be handed to you.

Not to mention how they got the item on their second try and Abyssea wants to kill your grandparents and Salvage Bans were an inside job.

[Byrth]

Well, first off I'd say that you were lucky to get level 5 Casket detection. I spent about a week in CN's basement and only got it to Level 3, while some of my other buffs were level 11. It seems to level up about as quickly as Attack speed.

Secondly, they *are* that rare. My week in CN probably had 30-50 brown caskets a night, and I never saw Cocoon Band. It took me about 6 hours in R.Pass to get a Grapevine cape, which remains the only brown casket item I've gotten. I'd be surprised if the drop rate was higher than 5% per brown casket, likely between 1 and 3%.

Not very promising, considering I'm about to confine myself to Bost. Ob. (lolthat place) for Melaco Mittens. I'd just buy them, but there aren't ever any on AH.

[ShadowHeart]

ya but some things like fisherman's torque are ex/rar can't buy them ..... they need to fix drop rates or items in chests lol

[Seriha]

Well, after going dry in Zeruhn and then trying Oubliette for Melaco Mittens and going try there with level 6 Casket Discovery and a full signet's worth of active killing over a couple days of logging on and off, I can quite comfortably say drop rates on these things blow.

As a level 90 plowing through mobs 56-60, I don't really need things like the HP buffs, skill up boosts, and so on. It probably took about 8 hours to get to the level of CD that I did, at which point I stopped doing regimes and focused steamrolling the 8-10 Werebats leading down to the Bloodsuckers. Sometimes I'd still go a while with no chests at all, but I certainly saw my share of garbage loot and probably got enough Errant Slops to outfit the server.

Overall, the default casket rate needs to improve, as well as more of them added to the DATs if its a crowded time (which happened on occasion). I'd also propose prowess buffs be changed to a system of spent points that exponentially grows per level of a given category. So, for every clear you would get one Prowess Point. You can then spend that point on level 1 Casket Discovery. To get the next you'd need 2 points, then 4, then 8, and so on until max or your desired level. Thus you avoid the garbage buffs or even the times you get no buffs at all.

Eventually I just caved after my signet wore, warped back home, and bought the stupid things after seeing someone I'd seen EXPing got them to drop. Lucky them. Random junk maybe paid for 1/4 of it, but it's still pretty sad to have dumped 15 hours into actively hunting for a drop just to not get it. I'd almost rather camp old school NMs where it's either a case of focusing on PH or just waiting for free spawns. At least then you know the chance to get is better once the mob is in your claim.

[ShadowHeart]

took me 43 hours of compiled playtime without leaving zones to get the item i was after .... and trust me if i could buy them i would but few of them are ex/rar and there isn't the option.... at least increase the ex/rar drop rate ones its bs lol SE dropped the ball again with crap items in the chests and after 9 years they think they would make them useful at least...

SE increase ex/rar drop rates already

[Rosina]

they changed the mobs in the outer ruins near giddeus. b4 mobs checked ep-dc at 10. now are t and up. that tower was a good solo place for 7-14. Now its ruined kinda trying to find a new solo location

[Kraggy]

My second issue would be that we still can't spend merit points in the field. I've had 20.999 merits and capped buffer for the last three days.
Because the time taken to warp home, spend the limits and then port/ride back is sooooooooooo long.

/rolleyes

FFS, it's like 15 mins 'lost time' every few hours, is that really, really a problem?

Really?

[Aequis]

Because the time taken to warp home, spend the limits and then port/ride back is sooooooooooo long.

/rolleyes

FFS, it's like 15 mins 'lost time' every few hours, is that really, really a problem?

Really?

Then you'd lose whatever prowesses you'd earned, and if one of those is Casket Discovery at a high level, you don't really want to start over again. Especially if it's taken you over 30 hours to get it that high.

The rare item drop rate in caskets is pathetic, and it does need changing. No doubt about it. Some of them aren't worth the time it takes to potentially get one, so the entire system as it stands right now is skewed.

[Karbuncle]

Because the time taken to warp home, spend the limits and then port/ride back is sooooooooooo long.

/rolleyes

FFS, it's like 15 mins 'lost time' every few hours, is that really, really a problem?

Really?

prowess is lost when you zone.

I imagine if your goal is brown caskets, and you're sitting at level ~5 or higher casket discovery, the last thing you want to do is leave the zone.

Beyond that, bad design (I.E only being able to spend merits in your mog house) is Bad design, It shouldn't be like that regardless of how long its been like that. You should be able to spend merits on the fly if you desire.

[Khrnos]

Ah, the dreaded casket hunting. The horror stories I've heard and experienced myself... There definitely are some tweeking that needs to be done in regards to obtaining the rare items. There are quire a few aspects of of treasure caskets is just entirely too random from the appearance of brown caskets, the hints (not so bad but still pretty random), the prowess, and finally the items. There are just too many possible "junk" items and it's really diluting the chances for the desired rare items.
And with too many random aspects, it's either get really lucky and get the item really fast or horribly unlucky and spend hours to days to even weeks straight doing the same thing over and over and walking out completely drained. I doubt it was intended for this game to be taxing on it's players.
Thing like this are taking away time from doing the other things in the game that are actually fun.

Some suggestions:
-Some have already mentioned having more of a choice when it comes to prowess.

-Removing many of the "junk" items.

-Revising the possible prowess such as removing the useless "Increased crystal yield" and possibly adding some that increases the "quality of caskets" increasing the quality of items inside the caskets. As how it is with lights and the sturdy pyxis in abyssea.

-And as with abyssea, perhaps allowing players to view whats inside the chest before opening them.

-Or just plain and simply increase the drop rate for the "rare" items.

[ShadowHeart]

spent 6 + hours yesterday in maze of shik. got chiken bone, iron ore, potions.... u get idea best item was a crap nugget and when doing book 7 and 8 its a 10 minute run back and forth to even get a page... and make sure to take care leeches link like ...... but yes 6 hours which i dont mind spending if there was half a chance or a job i had use to do in there... all 20 jobs at 90 and merited so its only one reason to enter but to spend the next week in there for items like a neck, belt u might need for crafting etc is crazy but u know that there will be us out there who will do it :( really needs to be fixed though

[Panthera]

I like how they've extended FOV to higher levels and dungeon areas. The prowess system is nifty, and I really like the transporation options; going to one's home nation vs going to a home point.

On that note, I'd like to see further transporation options. In addition to warping from various dungeons, why not add warping to the dungeons as well? We can already get to Abyssea just about anywhere, and within Abyssea there's more warping to be had as well. Go into the Chocobo Racing area, and there's more warping to be had, even in such a tiny area.

I do like the idea of selecting one's own Prowess, and maybe it could use some kind of purchaseable system with points, albeit temporarally. However, we all know SE's motto,"Welcome to Vana'Diel, where Random is Fun!" So I think this is about as likely as a light weather pattern in Qufim; cool, but improbable.

Furthermore.... I do realize that GoV is new and in a trial phase, but extending it to ToAU and WoTG areas would help with the overcrowding.

[ShadowHeart]

i would think its perfectly feasible to choose which ones u get as u can choose which buffs u get from abyssea or which food or options u can choose from fov/gov with tabs so just make it possible to select even if you can only add once per page finished or something with the consumption of tabs

people should have choice over random lottery chance at getting a buff and lots of times get none at that matter per page done

[Limecat]

I'd like it if you could just choose your buffs. Maybe when you complete a page, you get a chance of acquiring a prowess point or whatever, that you use at the tome to buy a prowess upgrade of your choice. If SE won't go for that though, how about maybe a field support option where you pay X tabs to store your current prowess levels, then later on at any tome can restore them? Doing that would erase the stored values of course, and you'd have to pay another X tabs to store them again.

[Coldbrand]

Without leaving it complete stupid unless they want to create some formula to read your job/sub job and determine which buffs are selected around that it does seem selectable prowess would be a lot better than the current system of giving random ridiculous stuff once an hour that may be completely and entirely useless to the player.

[Camate]

In regards to the concern where it appears that the rate in which chests appear differs from area to area, we just wanted to confirm that the rate is the same for every area. Since these chests can be affected by Super Kupowers, there is a chance this is what you are experiencing.

As for being able to select the prowess enhancements manually and maintaining them when changing areas, we do not have any plans of changing or adjusting the current system right now.

[ShadowHeart]

In regards to the concern where it appears that the rate in which chests appear differs from area to area, we just wanted to confirm that the rate is the same for every area. Since these chests can be affected by Super Kupowers, there is a chance this is what you are experiencing.

As for being able to select the prowess enhancements manually and maintaining them when changing areas, we do not have any plans of changing or adjusting the current system right now.

BOOOOO failllll.... just like fixing campaign no one does but gimp it so the 3 people who still do it dont want to do it no more...

[Dauntless]

Cool, keep making things worse please. Because the last thing you want right now is to make anyone want to play the game more, right?

[Karbuncle]

Its a small part of the game anyway...?

Its not really that bad, I was Farming in Fei'Yin today, after about ~2hours or so I had came across and unlocked a good 15 chests or so. None had the shield but it was still a pretty decent spawn rate.

Just need to wait for the right Kupower(Boxes), Like you had too for other items if you wanted it in a reasonable time frame.

[Seriha]

The ability to choose and maintain prowess when zoning isn't something that has to come like that or not at all. Either would be satisfactory to some degree, though I'd prefer the ability to choose buffs since 15 hours of signet should hopefully cover a venture somewhere. If that's still not possible, condensing or removing some of the possible buffs should be looked into. ATK/RATK should be merged with WS damage boosts. MATK and Cure Potency should probably go together. Casket Discovery and Crystal Yield can make babies together.

[Septimus]

BOOOOO failllll.... just like fixing campaign no one does but gimp it so the 3 people who still do it dont want to do it no more...


Cool, keep making things worse please. Because the last thing you want right now is to make anyone want to play the game more, right?

Being snide to the people who make changes does not help. Ever. (Funny advice from me, although I tend towards adorably sarcastic...)

The bonuses that you get from completing repeated GoV trials are just that, bonuses. While it would be nice if there was a little more rhyme and reason behind the prowesses that we get (for example, there isn't much that my Warrior can do with cure potency) expecting to be able to chose what bonus you get and wanting them to stay with you when you zone is asking for a bit much. Yes, we would all love to stack up a billion combat/magic skill gains and have them move into our Mog Houses with us, but that is kind of unrealistic that to expect that to be possible from a programming standpoint.

[Malacite]

After spending quite a bit of time in Zeruhn, and seeing friends want to /wrist over having spent 4+ days straight in there, I have to say some adjustments are needed.

Prowess buffs are too random - rather than it being 100% random, how about giving us either a few choices at random, or give us a single point that we can then choose to spend on any new prowess or upgrade an existing one? This way we wouldn't have to spend days on end trying to get Casket Discovery to have a decent shot at getting a ring that's meant to reduce time spent skilling up but is ultimately negated by the obscene amount of time wasted farming said ring.

Sorry for the run-on sentence but this has been driving me up the wall lately. I don't feel like spending a week competing for mobs in small, overcrowded zone for something probably makes a marginal difference anyway - nor do I fancy putting it off until Mystery Boxes: Bastok shows up.

I don't have a problem with challenges - I do however have a raging, psychotic hatred of mindless, repetitive grinding with seemingly no end in sight.

[Kari]

As for being able to select the prowess enhancements manually and maintaining them when changing areas, we do not have any plans of changing or adjusting the current system right now.

Although I don't want to PICK what prowesses I receive, I find it absolutely ridiculous that I get prowesses I can't use at all with my job combination all the time.
Getting tons of Cure Potency, Magic Acc/Atk, etc is helping me none when I'm leveling BST/NIN.
Considering Prowess effects are VERY SMALL even when you have a decent level of the prowess, it's very ridiculous.
Especially since there are so many of them, and there's a chance of not getting ANY prowess.
The system is a bit flawed.

[Rosina]

Ok so upon returning to ffxi and discoverying the changes to the dungeons with grounds of valor. I think their need to be some tweaks that ffxi devs over looked when selecting the dungeons .

Hear me out. Since coming back I notices an influx of low levels, newbies and returning players starting over. This means people who need places to level and doing missions. I've come to notice that the Inner horutoto ruin tower by giddeus is no longer suited for solo by a player from 7-14. This was a great place to solo and a great place to farm wild onions.

Also another addition/tweak i discovered is the outer horutoto in the eastern part of east sarutabaruta. (the middle one) the cracked wall mobs are now easy pray to a level 90. This prevents a player from getting windurst mission 2-1 completed with out aid. And the quest "making headlines" Both of these require a visit to Nanaa Mihgo's secret hide out located with in this tower. The door is not blocked by all those 90+ level mobs.

Any chance this can be fixed?

[Francisco]

Camate - any word on if we can get "undesirable rewards" removed from the brown caskets? Way too many worthless potions and ethers.

[Karbuncle]

I'd keep the potions and ethers if they removed the Flint Stones, Rock Salts, insect wings, and pots of Honey -.-;

I try my best not to complain/act like whiny/ungrateful, But yah, Synth mats most people toss or don't bother picking up =/= Good filler rewards for brown caskets.

Higher level zones are pretty decent (Fei'Yin for instance has Orich ore, Hi-Elixirs, etc), but zones like Zeruhn and Horutoto which cater to slightly higher level players as well as lower level... just need the low junk removed.

Even new players toss insect wings and flint stones >_>

[ShadowHeart]

I'd keep the potions and ethers if they removed the Flint Stones, Rock Salts, insect wings, and pots of Honey -.-;

I try my best not to complain/act like whiny/ungrateful, But yah, Synth mats most people toss or don't bother picking up =/= Good filler rewards for brown caskets just need the low junk removed.

Even new players toss insect wings and flint stones >_>


this is mainly my point as well useless crap in chests... the drop rates i can handle and deal with even the random buffs even though a pain but to sit 3 days straight in there getting max buffs to open a chest with insect wings or flint stone is a little disheartening took me 43+ hours play time to get one item i needed was almost 5 days without leaving zone... merits capped all 20 jobs at lvl 90 and to sit in there for almost a week to get a neck piece or waist to enhance chocobo rope or torque for example is frustrating. its not like its a gamin breaking item but to make it so hard to get is asinine really.

[Tokiro]

this is mainly my point as well useless crap in chests... the drop rates i can handle and deal with even the random buffs even though a pain but to sit 3 days straight in there getting max buffs to open a chest with insect wings or flint stone is a little disheartening took me 43+ hours play time to get one item i needed was almost 5 days without leaving zone... merits capped all 20 jobs at lvl 90 and to sit in there for almost a week to get a neck piece or waist to enhance chocobo rope or torque for example is frustrating. its not like its a gamin breaking item but to make it so hard to get is asinine really.

If I want to get anything in this game, I have to put in time. No one can get items easily because most of the drops are random. To make them drop easily would be great for everyone who wants to zone in, get it, zone out. But is that the point? These chests are bonuses for people who happen to be in those zones leveling or farming. You find out that an item you want drops there and suddenly it has to be handed to you on a plate? I don't think so. I spent 2 weeks solid trying to get an item that was not game-breaking. But I wanted it and I knew how hard it would be to get it because of the conditions needed to obtain it. If you can't hack the time you need to put in, surely you can do without the item. There are thousands of players who cannot get items even in Abyssea because of the time needed to do so. They don't sit and ask people to give them the items just by killing a mob a couple of times. I can see the problems with the stat bonuses causing ridicule, but come on, people, you can't expect to get something easily just because it's not endgame. If you don't want to put in the time, don't do it. If it won't affect your play that much, why bother? If after all that you still want it, you're going to have to put in the time to get it. End of story.

[Byrth]

I'm like 99% sure they increased the rare item drop rate in these zones dramatically.

[Karbuncle]

I'm like 99% sure they increased the rare item drop rate in these zones dramatically.

Which zones? Grounds of Valor in general?

perhaps, Spent a couple hours in Fei'Yin and got like, 3 Hi-Elixirs, and my brother got a Percolator... No Dagda's Shield but it was fun!

[Byrth]

Check out the AH. Look at the sale rate of things like Melaco Mitts and Grapevine Capes before and after the last update. Waaaay up.

[Malacite]

Ugh, day 2 now of the slugfest that is Zeruhn Mines. We just got Mystery Boxes: Bastok so Zeruhn Mines is just overcrowded at the moment, so I'm taking a break until later.

Sitting on Discovery level 2 so far, gotten several boxes with junk in them, and a few I lost to being off by literally 1 digit (starting to make me want to ram my head against the wall).


Why does SE do stupid crap like this? The ring supposedly is only a 2% chance... and when you factor in all the time wasted farming the damn thing, well, it had better be worth it in the end.

I thought we were past this level of nonsense when we got Abyssea & the stagger system.

[Seyrena]

I think someone is just butthurt they can't find their prouesse ring.

I found mine on the first Colliery Bat kill.

[Seriha]

I think someone is just butthurt they can't find their prouesse ring.

I found mine on the first Colliery Bat kill.

Try farming another for a friend/mule/whatever and see if that luck holds up.

[Malacite]

I think someone is just butthurt they can't find their prouesse ring.

I found mine on the first Colliery Bat kill.

"Hey, I'm the exception to the rule and got lucky! Everyone else sucks because I'm just sooooo awesome"


Yeah, stow the attitude. You and all the other dolts who brag about going 1/1 on things like Kraken Club aren't special - just lucky, and very, very annoying.

[Bumbeen]

uh I tossed two of those prouesse rings, they are worthless lol.

[Karbuncle]

They're only worthless if you're capped on skill or think skilling up is fast enough (because hay, Going faster is stupid right?)

We still have 95 and 99 to skill up too as well, If you're like me and love capping worthless skills, This ring does help, especially with the new skill up foods, makes it a lot less of a chore in the long run.

[Malacite]

going on day 3 now, no ring...

this is maddening >_<;

[Tokiro]

"Hey, I'm the exception to the rule and got lucky! Everyone else sucks because I'm just sooooo awesome"


Yeah, stow the attitude. You and all the other dolts who brag about going 1/1 on things like Kraken Club aren't special - just lucky, and very, very annoying.

And you going on and on and on about how UNlucky you are is NOT annoying, right? I beg to differ.

[Karbuncle]

ITT: Two wrongs make a right

[Seriha]

And you going on and on and on about how UNlucky you are is NOT annoying, right? I beg to differ.

The people who've gone significantly long periods without a drop vastly outweigh those who go 1/1 or even find the item in an hour or two. While I may personally joke about how the game hates me and makes my luck suck because of it, there's no excuse for going 20 hours without the ring, 15 without Melaco Mittens, and even back in the day I spent a good 8 hours trying for Gothic Sabatons in BD. The drop rates suck, period.

[Malacite]

The people who've gone significantly long periods without a drop vastly outweigh those who go 1/1 or even find the item in an hour or two. While I may personally joke about how the game hates me and makes my luck suck because of it, there's no excuse for going 20 hours without the ring, 15 without Melaco Mittens, and even back in the day I spent a good 8 hours trying for Gothic Sabatons in BD. The drop rates suck, period.

I'm up to about 30+ now. This is retarded, especially for an item that's meant to reduce time spent doing a chore.

[Tokiro]

The people who've gone significantly long periods without a drop vastly outweigh those who go 1/1 or even find the item in an hour or two. While I may personally joke about how the game hates me and makes my luck suck because of it, there's no excuse for going 20 hours without the ring, 15 without Melaco Mittens, and even back in the day I spent a good 8 hours trying for Gothic Sabatons in BD. The drop rates suck, period.

And you know that, right? No one ever said, 'Hey, go to such and such an area and after killing 3 mobs and getting a chest you will 100% get a ring in it!' Everyone knows that these items are bonuses that you get for hard slog. People who camped Kreuzet (including myself) spent many a week/month waiting for the thing to actually spawn only to have it drop a crystal... But we want these items because they enhance our gameplay. Now, knowing the drop rates and knowing that so many people are frustrated with them, why would you keep trying? Because you want the item. I know that, you know that and SE knows that. It's called a game. Enjoy it or stop doing it.

[Seriha]

Our definitions of game greatly vary if you're okay with people putting large amounts of time into something with nothing to show for it. In fact, old game faults like NMs like Kreutzet by no means justify current ills just because it's "not as bad as it used to be!" In both cases, I had no other reason to be in those zones other than that specific item. I'd rather have fought a 1-2hr spawn NM with a 10% drop rate than open chest after chest with no guarantee that I'm actually getting closer to the drop. I didn't need EXP. I didn't need crystals. I certainly didn't need gobs and gobs of Zeruhn Soot.

[Tokiro]

Our definitions of game greatly vary if you're okay with people putting large amounts of time into something with nothing to show for it. In fact, old game faults like NMs like Kreutzet by no means justify current ills just because it's "not as bad as it used to be!" In both cases, I had no other reason to be in those zones other than that specific item. I'd rather have fought a 1-2hr spawn NM with a 10% drop rate than open chest after chest with no guarantee that I'm actually getting closer to the drop. I didn't need EXP. I didn't need crystals. I certainly didn't need gobs and gobs of Zeruhn Soot.

My definition of a game is something you play by the rules and if you don't like it, you stop playing. How anyone can seriously expect such an egocentric point of view to carry any weight is beyond me. 'I want this item so give it to me now' doesn't work in any game. 'Current ills' are not current ills. They are specific to you and others who will not rest until they get that special item that they obviously seem not to be able to live without. Throwing tantrums because you can't get what you want is puerile to say the least.

[Seriha]

Items exist to be acquired and used. If they're never acquired, then they certainly can't be used. Of course, if they're not used even if acquired, then they were more than likely a poorly designed item to begin with. By all means, assume I'm demanding a drop just because I walked into a zone. I just imagined those 35 hours spent over a week just logging on, focusing specifically on that, then logging out. You can confuse "need" with "something useful I could do on my own time whenever" all you want, but the end result was that time not being rewarded. The only aspect of ego involved was that it happened to me, but I'm also not the only one.

This is a condition hardly akin to rules like in that of basketball where you can't elbow, goal tend, double dribble, charge, travel, or whatever. No, imagine a game of basketball where only 5% of your baskets counted. That can be a rule, right? It's a pretty stupid rule, but it's a rule if you're trying to cling to the spirit of the word. No, I play games to have fun, not games so mired by "rules" that they either lose that fun or turn into something worse than an RL job without getting paid. The system, in terms of standalone drops, is terrible.

[Septimus]

My definition of a game is something you play by the rules and if you don't like it, you stop playing. How anyone can seriously expect such an egocentric point of view to carry any weight is beyond me. 'I want this item so give it to me now' doesn't work in any game. 'Current ills' are not current ills. They are specific to you and others who will not rest until they get that special item that they obviously seem not to be able to live without. Throwing tantrums because you can't get what you want is puerile to say the least.

Rules can be changed when they are terribly detrimental to the game.

Remember when pop items for the group 2 Jailers in Sea weren't 100%? I sure do, and that was certainly less than fun. Square actually listened to the player base, changed the drop rate from 25-33% to 100%. If we went by the "if you don't like it stop playing" mentality, we would still have a low drop rate on the pop items and Jailer of Love would be invincible.

It is not egotistical to expect to be rewarded for working towards a goal. If someone spends 10+ hours killing things, you should have something to show for that effort. There is a difference between expecting to get something right now and spending more than a full day killing things and having no tangible gains. I cannot fault someone for being more than slightly upset for going 10-20-30 hours trying to get an item- that is just bad game design and it should not be tolerated.

[Tokiro]

Items exist to be acquired and used. If they're never acquired, then they certainly can't be used. Of course, if they're not used even if acquired, then they were more than likely a poorly designed item to begin with. By all means, assume I'm demanding a drop just because I walked into a zone. I just imagined those 35 hours spent over a week just logging on, focusing specifically on that, then logging out. You can confuse "need" with "something useful I could do on my own time whenever" all you want, but the end result was that time not being rewarded. The only aspect of ego involved was that it happened to me, but I'm also not the only one.

This is a condition hardly akin to rules like in that of basketball where you can't elbow, goal tend, double dribble, charge, travel, or whatever. No, imagine a game of basketball where only 5% of your baskets counted. That can be a rule, right? It's a pretty stupid rule, but it's a rule if you're trying to cling to the spirit of the word. No, I play games to have fun, not games so mired by "rules" that they either lose that fun or turn into something worse than an RL job without getting paid. The system, in terms of standalone drops, is terrible.

Your basketball analogy is interesting. A basket is something you achieve by overcoming the odds and training hard. What you are trying to do in getting this item is throw a ball from anywhere in the court and, given a certain amount of time (because, hey, you put the time in, right?) you should definitely score a basket. That is no rule. That is pure fantasy. Sure, some people will get the basket immediately and run off screaming how lucky they were. Others won't. But, what you are trying to do is circumvent a rule which is in place for a reason. With your logic, everyone should just get the item in their postbox because that way no one has to do anything. How much time it took you to get the item is neither here nor there. The rules are these:
1. The drops on these items are very low.
2. If you try to get the item, it may take a very long time to get it.
3. You do not have to have this item, because not having it will not spoil your enjoyment of the rest of the game.

SE can change the drop rate all they like, but that means that the item will become less valuable. I don't want everyone running about with the same gear, even if I can only get the mediocre stuff myself. That's part of the fun. Knowing there is more out there that you could one day get. If we apply your rules to this entire game, I'm sure half the people in it would leave. I understand your frustration, I just feel it is completely self-inflicted.

[Tokiro]

Rules can be changed when they are terribly detrimental to the game.

Remember when pop items for the group 2 Jailers in Sea weren't 100%? I sure do, and that was certainly less than fun. Square actually listened to the player base, changed the drop rate from 25-33% to 100%. If we went by the "if you don't like it stop playing" mentality, we would still have a low drop rate on the pop items and Jailer of Love would be invincible.

It is not egotistical to expect to be rewarded for working towards a goal. If someone spends 10+ hours killing things, you should have something to show for that effort. There is a difference between expecting to get something right now and spending more than a full day killing things and having no tangible gains. I cannot fault someone for being more than slightly upset for going 10-20-30 hours trying to get an item- that is just bad game design and it should not be tolerated.

As I posted above, the time you put in is obviously a pain in the proverbial. I have a friend trying to get the refresh augmented hairpiece from Abyssea Konschtat. He is on his third week. He complains and goes on about it, but goes back every evening to try to get it. He has not and would not post on a forum like this, just because he knows how hard it can be to actually get it. He wants it and he will put in the time until he does. The drop rate is horrendous, I know. But I also know enough people who have put in the time and been rewarded eventually. Bad game design is an interesting comment. I think it's pretty good to have people really wanting items that are so hard to get. That's a pretty good design as far as I can see. As for me, I have more interesting things to do than spend 30 hours trying to get a ring that won't make much difference to my gameplay. But, hey, that's me. To all those who are still trying, go for it and I'm sure someday you'll get the item you want. Whatever SE does, I hope it never changes the drop rates on these things. Too many people are too hot for them.

[Seriha]

3. You do not have to have this item, because not having it will not spoil your enjoyment of the rest of the game.

You're putting too much of an emphasis on the rarity translating to value. An item should be valuable because it's useful, not because a random number generator is picky. You will never convince me that everyone suddenly having a Cocoon Band would ruin the game. Same with Melaco Mittens, Prouesse Ring, Grapevine Cape, and so on. People having them will not spoil your enjoyment of the game unless you want to be a haughty priss that feels just because you had to endure something, everyone else after should have to do the same.

[Tokiro]

You're putting too much of an emphasis on the rarity translating to value. An item should be valuable because it's useful, not because a random number generator is picky. You will never convince me that everyone suddenly having a Cocoon Band would ruin the game. Same with Melaco Mittens, Prouesse Ring, Grapevine Cape, and so on. People having them will not spoil your enjoyment of the game unless you want to be a haughty priss that feels just because you had to endure something, everyone else after should have to do the same.

I am putting no emphasis on the rarity translating to value. The items in the chests are useful. Why would you spend so much time trying to get them and so much time on this forum arguing about the drop rates, if they weren't? Useful items are hard to get. I don't want that to change and you do. Let's agree to disagree.

[Seriha]

Put simply, time is money. If I could make 200k gil elsewhere, those 35 hours I collectively spent could've been converted to 7 mil. Great for the items that can be bought, but for those that can't be, gil does no good. You also need to consider that a lot of these locations are simply "out of the way" from normal play, thus the main reason people go to them is largely for these items. Even if it is something that can be sold, these people are unlikely to want to farm multiples if it took them hours upon hours for their first. I made the comparison to low-drop NMs earlier because they were at least a better chance at getting what you were after instead of killing a mob, hoping for a brown chest, hoping you get good enough clues to unlock it, and then hope the item itself is in it... which is a lottery I certainly hadn't won.

There's nothing wrong with wanting the chests themselves to have valuable items in them, or little bonuses on the side. However, that's certainly not achieved with little things like kazham peppers, flint stones, and so on. Things like the odd piece of Errant gear I found in the Oubliette could at least be NPCed for a few k, or AHed for a bit more. Those make at least trying to open the chests worthwhile. Ultimately, I feel like each "trash" drop should have a minimum NPC value relative to the zone that scales the higher the minimum level range of the initial regimes are.

[AyinDygra]

A potential compromise idea:
Allow us to keep our buffs when we leave the zone and come back with the following restriction:
* Prowess Buffs are reset if you activate a book page in a different zone from where you accumulated your buffs.
* Prowess Buffs are only active while you have a page active (which will force players to interact with the book in each new zone, so they can't bypass the system.)

[Lushipur]

i got my prowess doing chest in zerhun with just kupower killing random mob.
the next kill dropped another ring...trashed...

but im 0/lostcount on pup attachment -_-

[Zhronne]

Treasure Caskets
- I would also like the hints provided by caskets to be adjusted somehow - without making it "too easy". It's pretty wretched when the hints start as follows: "Second Digit is 2, 3 or 4", "Second digit is odd", "one of the digits is 3" ... giving us a pretty low chance of guessing correctly. Maybe allow us to select the type of hint we get once per box?
Think this would require too much effort on their side.
One simple thing that they could probably do to partially address this is to allow us one further attempt? Currently there are like... 6 if I recall? Make it 7, and it should be okayish imho.

[Mirage]

I think it is terrible how the current system seems try it best to make people stay in the same zone for hours and hours.

Personally, I would prefer a static exp amount per page, and just let that be somewhere in the middle of the current min/max values. Either that, or keep the bonuses (or at least keep like half of them) until you activated a tome in a different area.