Exp penalty for partying with other players

[Catmato]

Please remove the EXP penalty players receive when partying with other players. Trusts are already better than new player characters at low levels, please stop discouraging players from teaming up with each other by lowering the exp we gain.

[Uroah]

I mean. The reason it exists is reasonable.

1 warrior kills something at X speed. 2 warriors kill the same something at 2X speed, so it makes sense to cut the exp gain.

However. This has been completely irrelevant since ilvl.

Gain-EXP would be significantly better if they got rid of it. So it likely won't ever happen.

[Catmato]

1 warrior kills something at X speed. 2 warriors kill the same something at 2X speed, so it makes sense to cut the exp gain.

A character with 5 trusts kills faster than 2 players with 4 trusts. It only really hurts new characters. IF they're concerned about endgame balance, they could make the penalty only apply to limit points, not exp. If they're concerned about people leveling up too fast, they shouldn't be. If they're concerned about people leveling too many new bots too quickly... well, they obviously aren't concerned about bots.

[Alhanelem]

A character with 5 trusts kills faster than 2 players with 4 trusts.It depends on the job you're playing; but really this is only true at low levels. When you're grinding job points or master levels, you now substantially outclass Trusts which do not scale with JP/ML.

[Voidstorm]

they made "Limbus" supposedly alliance content but the amount of time it takes to full climb a zone is a LOT longer for an alliance even working together to clear a floor than it does a single party AND get garbage for Exemplar Points / EXPerience points compared to a single party doing the same.
The party/alliance adjustment for EXP/EP should be given a second look.

[Catmato]

It depends on the job you're playing; but really this is only true at low levels. When you're grinding job points or master levels, you now substantially outclass Trusts which do not scale with JP/ML.

Yes, this is what the thread is about: gaining experience points.

[Alhanelem]

Yes, this is what the thread is about: gaining experience points.
We mostly gain OG EXP solo now. Even just entirely solo without trust it's faster than back in the day. The only reason to party before 99 is just for the sake of playing with a friend.

I don't think they need to change this. You can grind 100% solo no trusts with an EXP ring against <=EM mobs and reach 99 in less time than it ever took in a full group of actual people back when we still did that.

That penalty exists (and not just for Experience Points) for a reason. While it may be true that below level 99/ilvl trusts are strong and outclass most real players, it doesn't really matter. in FFXI today, leveling up to 99 is a very short part of your progression journey.

[Catmato]

The only reason to party before 99 is just for the sake of playing with a friend.

That's the point. Don't penalize people for playing with friends in an MMO. Discouraging group play in a multiplayer game is not a good thing.

[Uroah]

It's not a penalty, mathematically, it's a bonus.

If one player kills a mob for 200 xp, then 2 players kill the same mob, they get 150 each, the singular mob went from 200xp to 300xp

And because you kill it twice as fast, it's worth less than twice as much.

I understand that trust throws that all out the window. But that's the way it is.

[Catmato]

Trusts have been a thing for almost half the game's life. It's time to reconsider some choices they made 23 years ago.

[Uroah]

Trusts have been a thing for almost half the game's life. It's time to reconsider some choices they made 23 years ago.

Yes. Many of them. They're not going to do that though.

[Alhanelem]

That's the point. Don't penalize people for playing with friends in an MMO. Discouraging group play in a multiplayer game is not a good thing.It's not really much of a penalty. It's been in the since the beginning to ensure that proper parties weren't too efficient. Now, you can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm pretty sure this still applies with CP/EP as well as EXP.

It's hard enough to get SE to change things that actually matter. I don't think anything is going to change here even if ti was needed.

[Catmato]

It's not really much of a penalty. It's been in the since the beginning to ensure that proper parties weren't too efficient.
Uroah explained how it wasn't initially a penalty with exp share. Doesn't change the fact that it's a penalty now.



Now, you can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm pretty sure this still applies with CP/EP as well as EXP.
I'm not going to correct you because I'm not advocating for those to be changed, they aren't relevant to the conversation.



It's hard enough to get SE to change things that actually matter. I don't think anything is going to change here even if ti[SIC] was needed.
Just because you don't feel that it's worth the development time, doesn't mean it's a bad idea. Thanks for your input, you've made your point clear.

[Alhanelem]

Uroah explained how it wasn't initially a penalty with exp share. Doesn't change the fact that it's a penalty now.It's no more or less a penalty/bonus now than it was then. The calculation is the same. multiple players individually get less EXP but more EXP is generated total.



I'm not going to correct you because I'm not advocating for those to be changed, they aren't relevant to the conversation.It is relevant to the conversation because the same system is used for all forms of points- it may not even be directly possible for them to change one without affecting the thers.

Just because you don't feel that it's worth the development time, doesn't mean it's a bad idea.You're absolutely correct. The assessment "not being worth the development time" is in fact not the same thing as saying "It's a bad idea." I did not say "It's a bad idea." only that there are reasons why it exists and they're not likely to change it because of those reasons.


And alongside that, there are more important things that could be changed that would improve QOL for many more people than the very few who are still partying together to EXP at level 29 (or whatever). There could be other factors too- They may not want to make it faster because RMT tend to EXP up in parties/alliances and since most players don't do that anymore, they may see this as a limiting factor for RMT (even if it's not substantial).

Thanks for your input.

[Voidstorm]

I think the mechanic should be adjusted up regardless, they can lower the base EXP/CP/MEXP in exchange though.
current: https://ffxiclopedia.fandom.com/wiki/Experience_Points#Player_Share (i think)
Party size Normal share Signet share Total share (normal) Total share (signet)
1 1.00 1.00 1.0 1.0
2 0.60 0.75 1.2 1.5
3 0.45 0.55 1.35 1.65
4 0.40 0.45 1.6 1.8
5 0.37 0.39 1.85 1.95
6 0.35 0.35 2.1 2.1
7+ 1.8/7+ 1.8/7+ 1.8 1.8

Cut the base EXP/CP in half, then use this instead. Leave MEXP as is.
Party size Normal share Signet share Total share (normal) Total share (signet)
1 1.00 1.00 1.0 1.0
2 0.90 1.00 1.8 2.0
3 0.85 0.9 2.55 2.7
4 0.80 0.85 3.2 3.4
5 0.75 0.80 3.75 4.0
6 0.70 0.70 4.2 4.2
7+ 4.2/7+ 4.2/7+ 4.2 4.2
The reason RMT do mercenary MEXP in the first place is because SE set the requirements to cap a single job as a ludicrous time requirement. No one has the time to do that, so we discovered AoE kill methods of doing it much more quickly... Locus mobs destroyed that, bringing us back to no one having the time to do it.
In come the bots & RMT to make it possible while you are unavailable.
By making Alliances not be a complete waste for EXP/CP/MEXP legitimate players waste less of our lives grinding levels, and would promote linkshell partying if only slightly.
By relaxing the MEXP penalty & floor enemy requirements in Limbus for an alliance as well, we could actually do that as Linkshells.
Typically the largest groups doing Limbus at all that i've seen are a few tool assisted multi-box players with considerable time on their hands. They basically only do it fro a lack of anything else to spend their time on in the game. They no longer need gil, already did their other daily events, so it's either Limbus or touch grass.

I can't say enough how I think Limbus needs its objectives for alliances heavily relaxed. Think it takes 5 mobs as a 6man party, or 25 for a typical floor as an 18man alliance to fulfill a typical floor's objective.

edit: bah, the tables got lost in transition.