Am I the only one that dislikes the procs setup?

[Juri_Licious]

Regarding Abyssea, when it comes to getting seals people want you to be a certain class even if the monster that you're facing doesn't drop the seals for that class.

Why should I have to level up a whole other class just to get accepted into a party to get seals for the class I actually play/care about?

And to be honest, "Proc-ing" something isn't really fun anyway. As for a challenge, it's not even that either. I don't see the point in it really.

[Pikel]

Well I agree it does seem stupid to see shouts for say whm rdm nin smn seals and they ask for blm blu brd jobs for procs I do enjoy the system itself. I like the alternative to having to find a Thf for everything and I love seeing red procs just to freeze the nm's while we full attack. I don't understand why they are removing one Blu proc per element thou. I also don't like how there isn't a red proc for each weapon.

As for leveling up an entire new job to be able to proc your right that can be frustrating. My only comment to that would be some procs can be obtained thru subs and that in my experience has been accepted by some groups. I generally go Bst/nin for procs and killing. The only nin proc i can't land would be blind which can be frustrating since there's so few drk spells odds are it could very well be nin and we can't get it. Subbing whm is also decent if your nearing lightsday.

With the few jobs like Rng Cor Drg or Sam I can't really see much that wouldn't in some way be partially helpful with farming nm's thou and even then they could get some procs thru subs anyways.

[Chronofantasy]

1) 90% of the playerbase have 2+ jobs at 80-90.
2) It only takes 1-2 days to get a job to lvl 90 nowadays. BLM is a much needed job as well, so you won't have to worry about seeking forever either plus it's one of the jobs with most yellow procs available.

The system itself is a smart idea and allows for more co-operative play within Abyssea. It's better than a thf only trying to solo each NM or a thf + rdm or whm duoing everything. At least it'll allow for most group to find 4+ players each time.

[Rambus]

I personally don't care because I have every job leveled so it does not hurt me but I can understand the faults in it.

I can understand "hey I want to gear SCH, why can't i go SCH?" o"h you need BLM for procs" ok....

I do find it a bit unfair that abyssea is singled down too mnk, thf, blm, whm, thf, blu. (add war or nin for red)


1) 90% of the playerbase have 2+ jobs at 80-90.
2) It only takes 1-2 days to get a job to lvl 90 nowadays. BLM is a much needed job as well, so you won't have to worry about seeking forever either plus it's one of the jobs with most yellow procs available.

The system itself is a smart idea and allows for more co-operative play within Abyssea. It's better than a thf only trying to solo each NM or a thf + rdm or whm duoing everything. At least it'll allow for most group to find 4+ players each time.

why can't i just get 4 jobs that can work togher, and not the 4 specific jobs i listed?

if it was not for procs and pld being useless you my find groups that do pld, sch, drk, rdm

or something...

[Supersun]

The system definitely helped curbed killing speed and TH being the only things that mattered anymore for items and killing something fast alone wouldn't really reward you.

That being said the proc system certainly isn't perfect as it does greatly skew towards certain jobs and combos like Mnk+Whm and Blm+Blu.

I certainly think it's a step up where all you have is an alliance full of DDs just trying to kill the newest HNM as fast as you can like they're trying to set a record for a BCNM because the player base has pretty much proven that unless the monster is virtually impossible if we want something dead in a matter of seconds we'll kill it in a matter of seconds.

In the future I certainly wouldn't mind seeing a system that not only helps prevent the zerging of NMs, but also is flexible enough that a wider range of jobs can help attribute to the item acquisition unlike currently where only a handful of jobs are useful for procing. Maybe something that less relies on the job, but more relies on the role.

A random example could be like a system that gives you a certain assignment to do during the fight if you want a certain reward. Like it might tell you that to "proc blue" you need to magicburst any non damaging spell (something that most job combinations can easily do, but also require more out of the fight then just obliterating the monster).

[Anethia]

In regards to the removal of blu spell procs, several of the procs were either massive mp cost, with no garauntee of landing even with capped skill, or counter productive. For example 1k needles was either hit or miss, took far too long to cast, and its mp cost was enormous. Blitzrahl was removed because the resulting stun effect was counter productive to the proc process. Those were the main two I wanted removed as procs. I guess SE decided on removing 1 from each element just to make it balanced.

[Dfoley]

I would much rather have seen a system where:
If a mob droped blu/blm/drg/drk seals, then only those jobs can proc the red/grellow/blue and with only the skills of their main. That way you would want a blu/blm/drg/drk on every kill.

A logical way to set it up would be in 3 sets where each mob requires:
Healer - tank - support - magic dmg - 2x physical dmg
EG
Set 1: Whm - Mnk - cor - blu -rng - Sam/war
Set 2: Rdm - PLD - brd - smn - pup - drg/drk
Set 3: SCH - NIN - dnc - blm -bst - thf

That way if someone was doing a set 3 mob they would want dagger/axe/katana for red/blue and blm/ninjutsu for grellow, and not have to worry about bard or blu procs.

The reason they didnt do it, was it would take way to much time and coding on a per mob basis.

[Flunklesnarkin]

I think you are the only person that hates it.

[wish12oz]

Regarding Abyssea, when it comes to getting seals people want you to be a certain class even if the monster that you're facing doesn't drop the seals for that class.

Why should I have to level up a whole other class just to get accepted into a party to get seals for the class I actually play/care about?

And to be honest, "Proc-ing" something isn't really fun anyway. As for a challenge, it's not even that either. I don't see the point in it really.

Make groups instead of joining them and you can do whatever you want, then your problem is solved.

[Glamdring]

The problem is that the useful procs, grello and whatever that sorry excuse for "red" is, can only be done by a few jobs; jobs that noone may be interested in having in their group. Beast can't red on their main weap-axes, ninja comes up alot (for both) but ninjas tend to be in short supply (and the ones that are out there are frequently soloing), bard is considerred useless now except for grello (but I will red or blue with dagger and staff to save the War 1 more weap to try), you get the idea. It would help if the triggers were expanded, allowing more jobs a chance to accomplish !! with their higher skills rather than trying with their lesser skills or subjob abilities.

[Andylynn]

Please, for the love of god, go with the general consensus and call it yellow. That G word is an abomination and should be destroyed.

Back on topic, I do dislike the current system, it makes finding/forming pugs an arse, thus making acquisition of gear dificult for those without an LS/friends willing to get them for them. I do like that above idea about needingonly the job it drops only be the trigger, though I'm hoping these battlefields will make jobs more useful for finding remotely any kind of seal you may need.

[Lexin]

I hate it because well I have PLD and DRK leveled well PLD I have pretty much lost all hope in. Anyway I have armor pieces for both but can't get the seals because the way everything is setup.

Please don't tell me to quest I should not have to do a quest which may or may not give me the seals I need I should be able to join a few people to kill stuff to get the seals. People who are happy with the system like it because they have a job that can join.

Edit: Not everyone can leech jobs in Abyssea FYI... I tried a few times but the only way to get a leech spot now is to pay gil which not everyone has a ton of.

[Ravenmore]

I have got almost all my seals from quest, 1 body seal for blu from op 4 feet from NM 1 leg farming the KI pop for the zone boss. I did it that way cause of the freedom it provided not having to bother with pugs at all. Also put your own group together to leech.

[Rambus]

Please, for the love of god, go with the general consensus and call it yellow. That G word is an abomination and should be destroyed.

that, glad i am not the only person that thought that when i first hear it

[Khajit]

I hate it because well I have PLD and DRK leveled well PLD I have pretty much lost all hope in. Anyway I have armor pieces for both but can't get the seals because the way everything is setup.

Please don't tell me to quest I should not have to do a quest which may or may not give me the seals I need I should be able to join a few people to kill stuff to get the seals. People who are happy with the system like it because they have a job that can join.

Edit: Not everyone can leech jobs in Abyssea FYI... I tried a few times but the only way to get a leech spot now is to pay gil which not everyone has a ton of.

You make more gil leeching even if you pay for it than you pay to get in generally.

[noodles355]

People have been leveling other jobs they don't like in order to be able to easilly achieve things for their main jobs for years, this is nothing new.

Case in point: Anyone who leveled War, Sam, Rdm or Brd in order to get merits on their real job. Almost everyone who leveled Bard in a Ground King hnm shell.

[Meyi]

I love it... but then again, I'm a BLM.

It doesn't take skill, but it does take an attention span... which the vast majority of players seem to lack. You'd be amazed how many mages don't even bother trying to interrupt themselves when the monster is clearly casting/TPing. (I understand that sometimes TP moves or magic casting occur right at the end of a spell, but I'm talking about people who cast Burst and keep casting despite the monster reading up Waterja.)

It's very easy to sit and wait patiently for the monster to use TP moves and magic spells before casting. Start casting right as/right after the monster does it thing and you'll usually be golden.

I must say, after leveling my Elvaan to 75 BLM solo (because of ToAU), and then leveling my taru to 60 during ToAU prime, it's very refreshing to finally be a black mage who gets to be a black mage! I'm finally wanted and that makes me happy.

The best thing to do? Don't level another job you don't want to, but make friends. Make friends with people in linkshell, or join an abyssea linkshell. I'm always very happy to provide my blm or whm for linkshell mates who are hunting seals or +2 items.

[Khajit]

Besides. the flaws arent in the !! system for several instances. The flaws are in the jobs themselves. DRK and PLD for one can proc all red !! with a ninja but it doesn't help them in the end because compared to war(and every other job tbh but war in this case) they are inferior. BLue is only "flawed" because mnk can do all at once during a certain time and after all those years of regular lotto and 21~24H waits on NM the idea of just waiting until a "proper" time isn't a very painful concept to all of us. SE probably should have forced lolpup ws into blunt hours to give it some variety but I'm not exactly screaming with rage over the fact that i don't have to ask random noobs that will probably cause or nearly cause a wipe to help out.

Greelow was just sheer luck on blm's part.

[RabidSquirrel]

Please, for the love of god, go with the general consensus and call it yellow. That G word is an abomination and should be destroyed.

I have problems seeing greens and even I can see some green in that image. I figure calling it "Lime" would make more sense, but when did internet naming conventions make sense?

[Seriha]

Not to toot my own horn, but I made a post recently about expanding the weakness system (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/5004-New-weaknesses.) without going out of the way to harm the current incarnation. I won't claim it a perfect idea as is, but simply something to get the ball rolling and possibly get SE to consider later.

[thefinalrune]

I feel your pain, as a career THF I get turned down for THF seal parties all the time because I'm not a BLM.

;_; Its annoying for sure. Its a shame the model is designed to hinder the progress of players that don't want to level multiple jobs. I've tried just about every job there is and honestly couldn't care less about any of them. I'm a thief and that's all I really ever want to be. But apparently I get to be a pink thief for the rest of eternity because the quest system sucks and no wants to invite THFs to a THF seal party.

[Alhanelem]

I don't like the proc system either, because I see it as an artificial device to stop zerging.

[Randwolf]

To the OP, while the issues exist for certain jobs in Abyssea, it has existed for other jobs outside Abyssea for years. I still remember DM favoring BLM's and no other job. While it could be done with other jobs, it was a breeze with mostly BLM's and a few lucky leeches. Doing Kings, if your only job were say Monk, no HNMLS wanted you. If you were doing Kirin as a Monk, you were pretty much a Chi Whore or not welcome.

So, the inequity of what you can do on certain jobs has always existed. Right now, Monk gets some perks on things like Shinryu. But, is still not desired in other areas. Blue Mage saw a slight desire as a party member right after its introduction then quickly declined. BLU was also not of much interest in end-game outside of Dynamis, which can use Jack-Of-All-Trade jobs more efficiently. The reality of FFXI, up until this point, has always been that certain jobs are more or less desired depending on the activity.

[wish12oz]

I feel your pain, as a career THF I get turned down for THF seal parties all the time because I'm not a BLM.


This seems to be the main complaint I see.


Make groups instead of joining them and you can do whatever you want, then your problem is solved.

This is the solution.
Stop being lazy, make your own groups. Quit asking SE to change stuff because you're to lazy to make your party or level another job.

It was said earlier, maybe it needs to be said again. People have been leveling different jobs to get different stuff done since day1. I leveled RNG to do CoP missions when they came out. I leveled PLD to tank when NIN wasn't as useful anymore, I skilled up weapons on WAR so I could do all the red procs, etc, etc, etc, etc.... This is the way the game works, and why you can play multiple jobs ont he same character. If you don't like it you don't HAVE to level other stuff, but you're only hurting yourself and making the game less fun for yourself.

[RabidSquirrel]

Stop being lazy, make your own groups. Quit asking SE to change stuff because you're to lazy to make your party or level another job.

It was said earlier, maybe it needs to be said again. People have been leveling different jobs to get different stuff done since day1. I leveled RNG to do CoP missions when they came out. I leveled PLD to tank when NIN wasn't as useful anymore, I skilled up weapons on WAR so I could do all the red procs, etc, etc, etc, etc.... This is the way the game works, and why you can play multiple jobs ont he same character. If you don't like it you don't HAVE to level other stuff, but you're only hurting yourself and making the game less fun for yourself.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it is NEVER, in any situation, good when specific jobs or classes become obsolete. This tends to happen as a result of unforeseen circumstances and not a result of intentional implementation. It is impossible to predict what players will do to overcome a challenge. Do you honestly believe that SE's intention all along was to make thief, dancer, warrior, black mage, monk, and white mage the only needed jobs in Abyssea? If so, you are sadly mistaken. As more content is added, the job pyramid shifts in unforeseen ways. It has before, it has now, and will keep on happening.

[wish12oz]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it is NEVER, in any situation, good when specific jobs or classes become obsolete. This tends to happen as a result of unforeseen circumstances and not a result of intentional implementation. It is impossible to predict what players will do to overcome a challenge. Do you honestly believe that SE's intention all along was to make thief, dancer, warrior, black mage, monk, and white mage the only needed jobs in Abyssea? If so, you are sadly mistaken. As more content is added, the job pyramid shifts in unforeseen ways. It has before, it has now, and will keep on happening.

Which is why it's stupid to pigeonhole yourself onto 1 job. Level other jobs and make your own groups and you won't have these problems.

[Juri_Licious]

It was said earlier, maybe it needs to be said again. People have been leveling different jobs to get different stuff done since day1. I leveled RNG to do CoP missions when they came out. I leveled PLD to tank when NIN wasn't as useful anymore, I skilled up weapons on WAR so I could do all the red procs, etc, etc, etc, etc.... This is the way the game works, and why you can play multiple jobs ont he same character. If you don't like it you don't HAVE to level other stuff, but you're only hurting yourself and making the game less fun for yourself.
Yeah, the perfect solution is to just level up another character (You don't even want to play or like) from 1 to 90 just to get into parties to get a set of items for one character.

Here's my answer...Hell no.
Seriously what's the purpose of leveling up my char when the armor for my Job cannot be obtained through my Job?

If I make a party, i'm pretty much being there to be useless and get seals because I can't proc.
Then people will probably get furious if we're not "Proc-ing".

Just because you are fine with leveling up a ton of jobs to 90 doesn't mean everyone else has the time or want for it.
EXPing isn't so fun, especially if you've done it all the way to 90.

[Greatguardian]

How to never have to worry about being unwanted/unnecessary:

Step 1: Level and gear a variety of jobs that catch most/all niches in the game.

Step 2: Don't suck at them.

Step 3: Bask in the glory of having at least 1-2 jobs that everyone wants at any given time, and thus the ability to get any kind of NM/mission/item you need with minimal effort.

Step 2 is incredibly important, though. I'd rather not have a WHM at all than have a WHM who sucks. At least in the former situation you know you won't be getting cures; in the latter it just comes as a surprise.

[Khajit]

I feel your pain, as a career THF I get turned down for THF seal parties all the time because I'm not a BLM.

;_; Its annoying for sure. Its a shame the model is designed to hinder the progress of players that don't want to level multiple jobs. I've tried just about every job there is and honestly couldn't care less about any of them. I'm a thief and that's all I really ever want to be. But apparently I get to be a pink thief for the rest of eternity because the quest system sucks and no wants to invite THFs to a THF seal party.

Taking into account the fact that treasure hunter is an important factor in these runs I'm getting the impression that you are seriously sitting here complaining about not being able to play thf in a seal pt when they already had one to fulfill that role. The only other logical conclusion here is that they're one of those groups of idiots too stupid to want treasure hunter when they need a drop in which case you're complaining that SE needs to fix the idiotic decisions of others. Now while it may be annoying to see a shout for an item you want and can easily get with 2~5 people max only to discover they're going for 18 I don't see any need to request that SE fix that problem.

[Seriha]

This seems to be the main complaint I see.



This is the solution.
Stop being lazy, make your own groups. Quit asking SE to change stuff because you're to lazy to make your party or level another job.

It was said earlier, maybe it needs to be said again. People have been leveling different jobs to get different stuff done since day1. I leveled RNG to do CoP missions when they came out. I leveled PLD to tank when NIN wasn't as useful anymore, I skilled up weapons on WAR so I could do all the red procs, etc, etc, etc, etc.... This is the way the game works, and why you can play multiple jobs ont he same character. If you don't like it you don't HAVE to level other stuff, but you're only hurting yourself and making the game less fun for yourself.

The other problem is that if you're also forced to "compromise" in playing one job to outfit another, if that other is never actually wanted or useful to future activities you partake in, what's the point of actually chasing gear for it?

[Luvbunny]

Agree with most of the comments here, you need to make your own group, stop being lazy and be pro-active. Learn how to be nice and make friends. Another great way is to ask for team up with other group who farm the same NM in the area, and suggest "your pop item = your seals to be shared with your own group". The benefits are many: you may meet people with discernment, you may get a blue or blm if you did not bring any, if the other group is duo - you may get their unwanted seals (which could happen to be yours), you get to kill the mob faster, and there is safety in numbers.

You'll never go far in this game by being closed minded, being lazy and wanted everything handed to you, or not playing nice and making friends with others. For each melee or mage jobs, there are plenty jobs to level. And almost everyone level multiple jobs these days. You should level your main, and your farming job or endgame job. It's great that you can do things with only a few people now, and the game is far more accessible for casual player and newbies. Granted hardcore player can devour any content faster, but there are far more casual and newbie players than the hardcore ones. And if SE keep this trend, they can phase out the hardcore and reach more into the new players base - make more money this way.

[wish12oz]

Yeah, the perfect solution is to just level up another character (You don't even want to play or like) from 1 to 90 just to get into parties to get a set of items for one character.

Here's my answer...Hell no.
Seriously what's the purpose of leveling up my char when the armor for my Job cannot be obtained through my Job?

If I make a party, i'm pretty much being there to be useless and get seals because I can't proc.
Then people will probably get furious if we're not "Proc-ing".

Just because you are fine with leveling up a ton of jobs to 90 doesn't mean everyone else has the time or want for it.
EXPing isn't so fun, especially if you've done it all the way to 90.

You're totally right, why even bother to play the game. It's better to sit in town and do nothing~

[Khajit]

SJ nin. Take the invo-6 hit that most sane people would refuse to take. There's no excuse for any job to not be able to at least do the nin procs since it's usually rare for anyone that isn't a nin and can use universal tools instead of losing gearspace to bring them.

[Randwolf]

Just because you are fine with leveling up a ton of jobs to 90 doesn't mean everyone else has the time or want for it.
EXPing isn't so fun, especially if you've done it all the way to 90.
What annoys me most about these proc complaints is not that they aren't valid, they are. It's that the issue with being a certain job and not being able to get into groups to do certain things has been around since the start of the game.

BLM and TH4 (prior to the ease of getting the armlets and knife) used to be an all access pass. But, now that a large portion of the long-time population has multiple jobs because of that, the more recent players complain because they are putting up with what the rest of us did for years. Yup, we were forced to level other jobs to get into certain activities. So, it's probably why you aren't finding tons of sympathy. Most long-time players are hardened from history. Plus, the people who leveled more than one job prior to Abyssea had very limited ways to do it quickly. Again, adding to why there is little sympathy over an issue that has been around since the start of the game. Finally, S/E put no effort whatsoever into inclusivity of jobs prior to Abyssea. There now is more demand for all jobs all the way around.

So, a big part of the reason people are flippant about telling you to raise another job is that they did it when there was not a whole lot of ways to do it quickly. Sure, some people had access to AF burns or Power-Leveling. But, at a certain point, you pretty much had to finish out the levels in parties.

[Rambus]

What annoys me most about these proc complaints is not that they aren't valid, they are. It's that the issue with being a certain job and not being able to get into groups to do certain things has been around since the start of the game.

BLM and TH4 (prior to the ease of getting the armlets and knife) used to be an all access pass. But, now that a large portion of the long-time population has multiple jobs because of that, the more recent players complain because they are putting up with what the rest of us did for years. Yup, we were forced to level other jobs to get into certain activities. So, it's probably why you aren't finding tons of sympathy. Most long-time players are hardened from history. Plus, the people who leveled more than one job prior to Abyssea had very limited ways to do it quickly. Again, adding to why there is little sympathy over an issue that has been around since the start of the game. Finally, S/E put no effort whatsoever into inclusivity of jobs prior to Abyssea. There now is more demand for all jobs all the way around.

So, a big part of the reason people are flippant about telling you to raise another job is that they did it when there was not a whole lot of ways to do it quickly. Sure, some people had access to AF burns or Power-Leveling. But, at a certain point, you pretty much had to finish out the levels in parties.

then you have this issue.

I like playing rng or sam or pld or thf. i like all my jobs and like to take it out time to time

well abyssea only suck me on war and blu only.

[Randwolf]

then you have this issue.

I like playing rng or sam or pld or thf. i like all my jobs and like to take it out time to time

well abyssea only suck me on war and blu only.

Reading comprehension. Do you have it?

My response was to the OP complaining about leveling more than one job. I leveled my jobs, to be in activities, under the old "it takes forever to get to 75" system. Back before there was a reduction in experience needed to reach 75. Thus, why there is little sympathy about complaints when every job can't get in on every activity.

[Meyi]

I don't think people should level jobs if they don't want to.

I leveled seven jobs on my original character. I enjoyed them. But as my taru, I don't really want to do it again. So I can completely understand those who want to stay with one job.

However, if you want to stay that one job, it becomes your responsibility to get the things you want. People shouting need specific roles for a reason; all the other roles have been covered, and it's those few remaining jobs that they need to do the activity.

Even having the job at 90 doesn't mean you'll get invited anyway. I've lost out on many shouts for black mage body seals even though they needed a black mage, because someone else sent the /tell first. Having a job does not guarantee success.

Starting the shout does not guarantee success, nor does having a linkshell that does the activities you enjoy, but both of these will increase your odds much better than sitting in Jeuno, waiting.

[Karbuncle]

Firstly, I don't know if someone was just typing wrong, Or just got off a WoW craze. But you don't need to "Level a new Character" to play another job. This isn't WoW, you can play other jobs on your character.
.....

Anyway, I don't know if it was used as an excuse or something, But if a Group is shouting for Yellow-proc jobs and they don't have a THF, and refuse a THF's help, They are Dumbasses anyway, Because Yellow is fine, Blue is fine, but TH on top of them is what makes it shine. TH + Proc is the best for every situation, no excuse not to bring a THF. Or you'll end up proc'n yellow and receiving only 2 Seals instead of 4/(5).

If you can't find 1 more job out of 20 you enjoy playing, MAKE YOUR OWN SHOUTS. Stop ignoring Wish because he doesn't sugar coat his responses in Ponies and Lollipops. He's very right. If you're too lazy to make your own shout, you think the solution is to adjust an entire system? It doesn't make sense. Its not that hard to shout and build a party around your favorite job. If you like PLD, go PLD, build a party around it, and you tank. If your party is good it doesn't matter if you're on PLD.

There is nothing wrong with the proc system, Yellow can be covered by 3 jobs. BLU/NIN, BLM/BRD, and WHM. thats it, every single trigger right there, Stop over-stating it. Blue triggeres are spread across multiple jobs, Requiring at least DRG, DRK, PLD, WHM, RNG and THF for Specific ones (Shark Bite, Swift Blade, you see my point).

Red is the easiest, can be done with ~2 jobs.

But the Trigger systems are fine, This game has been and always will cater to low-man groups when it comes to "shout groups", Because these shout groups want the least amount of competition per drop. What are your plans for Revision? Do you want it removed and every mob drop all the stuff all the time? I don't like that idea. I think the proc system adds a small level of Strategy for a fight.

Take Carabosse for Instance, Proc Red > Zerg before 2hour. or don't proc > fight normal. Gives you 2 ways to do it. I like the proc system, It caters to certain jobs sure, But so does the entire game. You may find it a little more extreme in abyssea, but thats where Wish comes in. start your own shout. It doesn't take a lot of effort. Get motivated.

Its hard to design a system that lets every single job Play, Especially because of the community. The Community will always find the most efficient time-effective way to do something, and it becomes the norm. This is human nature. We want the quickest route form A > B. Do not change a system just because your job doesn't fall in the quickest route. Create your own route by shouting for it.

I understand your complaints, but they aren't valid. You could use that argument for 99% of the Events in the game, Its just how the game works. In fact I'm 99% positive, OP saw a shout today, Didn't get in, and created the thread to vent/hate and get other sheep to vent/hate with them. You people need to stop jumping on every chance to complain about something minor.

I know these forums are for the expression of how you feel regarding the game, But its not about "I didn't get invited to a shout so I'm creating a butthurt thread to make alter the game so i can be invited more". So we shouldn't be so quick to react just because you're upset you didn't get invited, its not the best idea.

Every system will have flaws, but the proc'n system is one of the best ideas this game has had in a while. It gives players a chance to do something in a fight that can directly effect your spoils. (Similar to how Killing the Imp in "The ashu Talif" quests gives you another quests, or certain mobs in ANNMs, etc). I Like these systems, while not perfect, nothing else.

We can't start complaining every time something is not perfect. Nothing in this world is perfect. Someone will always find something to complain about. You think I'm just saying that to say it, but you're wrong. It could be a perfect game, and someone would complain its too perfect. I promise you.

so please, If you don't get invited to a shout, Make your own, or level a useful job. I know it sucks sometimes but take it from the Owner of a Maat's-Cap Pre Abyssea... Leveling jobs is really fun if you let it be. You make a lot of new friends. Solo where you can, Party where you can, and enjoy it always.

Theres gotta be 4-5 jobs in 20 you can find that you enjoy. Even if you don't enjoy it, level it for utility (its why i leveled BRD). Its not perfect in itself, But such is the curse of an MMO. Sometimes, when thousands and thousands of people come together, Your style might be left out.

Think of it like Highschool. Eventually Clicks will form. You either need to fit in, Or not. Personally I've never enjoyed fitting in, but it just so happens my favorite job is THF, So i dumb-lucked into a niche. Sometimes the best solution is to "Fake it". Level a job you might not like, but will get a lot of Benefit from. Once you've got everything you needed from the job, Leave it for dead.

Its not a perfect solution, nothing is perfect, this game is no exception. Sometimes life is about compromise. this isn't a lesson your parents tell you for fun. this is Truth. You will never have everything your way in life. It sucks, But thats how it works. So the best solution is to try and level a new job, Even if you hate the idea of i. Compromise is what makes the world go round. The least you could do is try to enjoy it :)

[Miera]

I feel for the OP because I too a having difficulties getting things done because I don't have the new Cookie Cutter jobs.

SCH DNC SMN BST PUP RNG RDM,

These jobs aren't useless to me and I hate the proc system. I question procs at the moment, I remember getting Yellow on a NM and got no seals at all. I remember procing Blue on a few NMs and it drops nothing. :(

[Ravenmore]

I see alot of people that most likey never bothered with CoP till it was uncapped. Every promy run I did was on nin, I hate nin but I went on it to get that those done. leveled blu to 60 so I could do the rest of the missions that my fav job was not wanted for. Yes even getting !! does not mean you'll get the drops but its just like TH4 was, just cause you had it doesn't mean you'll get the drop either.

[Catsby]

The OP smacks of troll bait.

[Rambus]

I have to say this, I find it really stupid using weak weapons/ ws, get the mob to 10% hp and still do not know red proc.

it can be really annoying, buff weaker NM HP or something please -.-

I dislike the proc system because to me it is repeat of history, too meny jobs singled out. To me it is worse now though because I got to use more jobs in the past vs now.

past I was bard, whm, sam, rng, thf, blu, blm, drg, smn, pld ( smallest rate)

now i am blu, war -.-

[Randwolf]

I have to say this, I find it really stupid using weak weapons/ ws, get the mob to 10% hp and still do not know red proc.

it can be really annoying, buff weaker NM HP or something please -.-

I dislike the proc system because to me it is repeat of history, too meny jobs singled out. To me it is worse now though because I got to use more jobs in the past vs now.

past I was bard, whm, sam, rng, thf, blu, blm, drg, smn, pld ( smallest rate)

now i am blu, war -.-
Then it's the people you're doing stuff with. We take all the jobs listed in red from your quote into activities, including Abyssea, all of the time. SMN is the one that gets left out most often. Although, on certain NM's, pet jobs are the primary choice.

[Alukat]

i agree to my pre-posters, the actual proc system & drop rates is sad.
if u want a seal from a NM, that drops it, a job specific job ability, weapon skill or spell should be able to make it drop.
i need rdm body seals and did tiger in ulegerand range and even with yellow procs i most time just saw nin,smn or whm body seals drop ; ;
i am at 8 seals out of like 30 pops.
here is my idea:
now make a hit of en-spell II at least drops 1 rdm seal.
for thf steal or mug could be the trigger to make at least 1 thf seal drop.
for bst could be that a killer effect has to proc or bind the mob with charm to get one bst seal.
th gives a chance to drop additional seals (more than 4 out of 1 pop), so ppl would want rng or thfs in their pt again.
and everyone can play his job he leveled to get the seals and not only blue,brd,blm,whm.
example:
10 body seals out of 10 pops is a droprate of 10% for the body.

and even if SE gives a 50% chance to drop the seal after u proc'd it with the JA, it would be a 5% droprate for the body.
doing pops and seeing that only seals drops which u don't need over and over again just sucks.like it is now -.-

Edit: blm,blu,brd,whm for grellow procs makes it even more difficult to find ppl to proc it, because random ppl need seals, they need to drop from that NM, to make them show up as brd,blu,blm or whm.
someone with blm90 and drg 90 as example wont show up to a NM that drop smn,thf,nin,rdm

[Tamoa]

Isn't Abyssea with all the buffs and the atmas etcetc, easy enough? The vast majority of the nms that drop seals and +2 items are easy, getting exp back if you die is easy, and so on and so forth. And you still want guaranteed drops/guaranteed job specific drops? Are people seriously saying they want every damn thing in this game handed to them with as little effort needed as possible? You don't want to lvl a job you don't like (a yellow proc job), you don't want to make your own shout groups, you want the proc system to be gone because it doesn't suit you. Whaaambulance etc etc. -.-

[Alukat]

Isn't Abyssea with all the buffs and the atmas etcetc, easy enough? The vast majority of the nms that drop seals and +2 items are easy, getting exp back if you die is easy, and so on and so forth. And you still want guaranteed drops/guaranteed job specific drops? Are people seriously saying they want every damn thing in this game handed to them with as little effort needed as possible? You don't want to lvl a job you don't like (a yellow proc job), you don't want to make your own shout groups, you want the proc system to be gone because it doesn't suit you. Whaaambulance etc etc. -.-

little effort? farming the pop, kill the mob doesn't take time?not our fault SE implented atmas & cruor buffs to make fights so damn easy.
i do my own shout groups.
so i lvl'd thf to 90 built my mandau to be blm for procs? screw that

[Fincat]

If you don't want to level another job, make a friend for seal farming. There has to be at least ONE person in this game who wants to play with you!

I've been farming seals with 1-2 other people for the past few days, and I think we have been unable to proc yellow only a handful of times and have seen plenty of seal drops. They weren't always the seals we wanted, but still! We mostly did DNC BLM or WHM NIN BLM. (ZOMG and the BLM didn't even bother to sub BRD!!)

Or make your own groups. I've gotten plenty of invites as a THF and have been in plenty of parties with people who didn't have proc jobs. How much easier do you want things?

[Tamoa]

little effort? farming the pop, kill the mob doesn't take time?not our fault SE implented atmas & cruor buffs to make fights so damn easy.
i do my own shout groups.
so i lvl'd thf to 90 built my mandau to be blm for procs? screw that

1. My previous post wasn't directed at you specifially, but "you" as in everyone that whines about anything that can possibly be perceived as any form of challenge or obstacle in FFXI.

2. If you want to go seal farming on a specific job, and people don't want that job, either suck it up and change, or make your own groups. Thf is a bad example as it's always good to have TH. Also, in Abyssea a thf can tank and can do ninjutsu for yellow procs.

3. Farming pops and killing the mob is not much of an effort, no. Hell, you can even buy pop items from the AH. Even less effort.

4. What Fincat said. Bring a friend or 2. Last time I wanted specific job seals, I soloed as nin/dnc and then teamed up with a blu/nin. We both got our 8 seals each, and we sure as hell didn't proc much yellow.

[Seriha]

You might be okay with doubling the potential number of NMs you need to kill, but not everyone else is. That's why the discrimination exists and the proc system is a contributor. Otherwise, stop pretending everyone's asking for hand-outs.

[Tamoa]

You might be okay with doubling the potential number of NMs you need to kill, but not everyone else is. That's why the discrimination exists and the proc system is a contributor. Otherwise, stop pretending everyone's asking for hand-outs.

There is an amazing number of threads and posts on this forum, made by people who complain about anything they see as an obstacle for them to reach a specific goal. This is the reason I am under the impression a large percentage of FFXI players in fact do ask for handouts. Some even demand them.

Also, doubling the number of NMs needed to kill but still getting all seals, sure beats not getting any seals at all and then whining about it.

[Seriha]

And you blanketly assume they haven't tried. People are stubborn with the community stereotypes, and when it comes to procs, warm and fuzzy feelings won't suddenly make the grellow !! appear. You can't just throw any random two jobs together and expect success. A THF and BLU can work because the THF's evasion can play off BLU's lesser curative ability compared to WHM. Put a RNG and a BRD together, however, and you'll probably have two dead people. And we all know that the more bodies you start including, the more they're going to want their own rewards. The longer you make a PUG event, the more you also risk someone having to bail for whatever reason (sometimes conveniently just after they get their stuff, leaving the rest of the group hanging).

Point being, there's a middle ground, and at times the game is far from that.

[Vold]

Procs, whether by design or not, do two things: 1)Increase drop rates above the normal lame slow low drop rates of items. Abyssea is no different from the past... until you factor in procs. 2)to try to ensure no job is left behind in the interest of progression via procs. And they do sorta have their strategic uses because after all the procs do put a stop to spells, TP moves, and making the NM do nothing at all. Lights and weakness procs were a brilliant move by SE(whether they know it or not) to force the player base into inviting unpopular jobs. No one ever imagined BLM would ever, ever EVER again be welcomed to exp groups. This is one example of many that I can make.

People have been complaining for years about jobs being left behind. Procs help solve that problem. Maybe it's not perfect and could use some fine tuning no thanks to the player base unwillingness to do something different than the established "best way", but it's better than what we've been getting, which is nothing at all except job adjustment after job adjustment that just made things worse or better depending on your point of view. So you have to use magic to progress with seal farming. Okay, single melee sub nin, invite your cookie cutting jobs to proc azure, move along.

/NIN makes any job.. ANY job worthwhile in a seal farming group. Yes, the job everyone loves or hates. Lastly, you don't have to proc to farm seals. The only time it really applies is if pop items are worth a lot of money. That's really only in Heroes areas. I farmed the vast majority of my seals for my 7 capped jobs without procs. My oh my how easy we forget that. You know, that cookie cutting shortcut thing called azure weakness not being required. But it exists and you absolutely want it for farming your seals. Just like everyone absolutely wants to take as little as possible to farm seals while guaranteeing azure proc.

I don't care that the average drop rate is 0-2 seals without azure weakness. It's there. Use it. Stop complaining about azure procs when you know damn well you prefer to take advantage of it than not at all. "killing a NM for no seal drop is a waste of time" Sub ninja and GO.

It's probably too late at this point to change things up for Abyssea but if people have ideas on how to solve the limitations in seal farming then I suggest they spill the beans so that SE may consider it down the road to put an end to the player bases constant cookie cutting of content. To start, they could restrict certain jobs to certain monsters. Only those jobs can defeat the monster. In a Abyssea system, only those jobs can proc. Said monster drops items for only those jobs. Different jobs may achieve enmity by whatever means outside of doing damage. It took me 1 minute to think of that idea. GO.

In before the inevitable sorry good for nothing commentary "I shouldn't have to level ninja for sub" for crying out loud go play another game that doesn't have support jobs.

[Seriha]

Tying job-related loot to weakness from said jobs isn't a bad idea assuming the spread is enough to keep some mobs from going totally neglected because they're "not worth it" for it whatever reason. People killing Shen for the WHM melee body back in the day kind of springs to mind here (Obscure location, no other worthwhile drop). Anyway, making it so only those jobs could hurt or kill it, though, is pretty silly. It's just taking the job-isms from the player's hands and making the game do it with no compromise.

[Ravenmore]

I also think lot of people on here are just asking for hand outs at this point. With my feet seals for blu I started solo killing the mob after the first kill my mnk friend joined me with another friend on the way on whm. We ended up get 8 sam seals for the mnk and 8 whm seal for the whm and i walked away with my blu seals. We did all that in bout 2 hours having dfun and never bothering with procing.